Sarah Palin to become Fox News commentator
monsterland wrote:
I'm not sure what these polls accomplish. When I lived in Soviet Union I was "quite satisfied" with our healthcare system. Why ? Because I was never exposed to anything better.
Having ambulances arrive within 5 minutes (USA) instead of 3 hours (USSR) seemed like a needless luxury, and I was honest-to-God convinced that horrible suffering I was subjected to while having my teeth drilled without anaesthetics was unavoidable. We didn't have water/suction, either. So there was just this hot powder landing all over your mouth.
Now, looking at actual wait LINES (mentioned in article I linked prior), prioritization of patients, and the dreaded rationing of medicine that goes on in both Canada and Britain, reveals the real picture of whats going on there.
Having ambulances arrive within 5 minutes (USA) instead of 3 hours (USSR) seemed like a needless luxury, and I was honest-to-God convinced that horrible suffering I was subjected to while having my teeth drilled without anaesthetics was unavoidable. We didn't have water/suction, either. So there was just this hot powder landing all over your mouth.
Now, looking at actual wait LINES (mentioned in article I linked prior), prioritization of patients, and the dreaded rationing of medicine that goes on in both Canada and Britain, reveals the real picture of whats going on there.
Every system of healthcare involves some form of rationing. The American system involves a rationing on the basis of wealth.
And my experience with the Canadian System of Socialized Medicine - albeit in the best province of the federation - has been rather good. Earlier on some of the checkup wait-times were lengthy, but as the NDP government invested more in healthcare that seemed to improve. I've been diagnosed with - and treated for - Type I Diabetes, Asthma and Celiac Disease.
In terms of rationing and prioritizing, I do recall being bumped ahead of others with more serious physical injuries in a car accident due to potential complications my Juvenile Diabetes may cause.
monsterland wrote:
NorraStjarna wrote:
Orwell wrote:
Having Palin as a commentator is perfectly in keeping with Fox's standards of journalism.
Haha... I concur.
It never fails to amaze me how "cool" it is to rag on Fox News, even though it offered the most even percentage of coverage to both candidates during the election. More even than other mainstream networks such as CNN and MSNBC.
CNN has commentators that use homosexual slurs like "teabagging" to label people they disagree with. Now THOSE are some high standards of journalism and reporting.
Criticising Fox News is not cool, but it is standing up for decent journalism. It is literally part of the British Media Studies curriculum (at least in my college) to learn about media bais and especially Fox New's bais. Though knowing Palin's stance on nationalised healthcare, she'd probably think that us Brits are a load of communist crazies anyway.
monsterland wrote:
The media assassination efforts didn't work on me; I still like Sarah Palin and wish her good luck.
I don't think that a "media assassination" is necessary, as Palin is doing a pretty good job at assassinating herself by talking.
I mean, she actually said that "The America I know and love is not one in which my parents or my baby with Down Syndrome will have to stand in front of Obama's 'death panel' so his bureaucrats can decide, based on a subjective judgement of their 'level of productivity in society', whether they are worthy of health care." That just shows how little she knows about nationalised healthcare.
Other right-wingers even suggested that "Professor Stephen Hawking wouldn't have survived under the NHS", despite the fact that Stephen Hawking is British and he himself said that "I wouldn't be here today if it were not for the NHS,".
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article ... cians.html
Hawking wrote:
'I have received a large amount of high quality treatment without which I would not have survived.'
The question isn't about whether or not Hawking, an accomplished theoretical physicist who had already graduated Oxford and started attending Trinity Hall before evidence of ALS presented itself, would receive treatment; instead the question is whether or not someone of less accomplishment would.
While an article on Sweden and not Britian, the Journal of the American Physicians and Surgeons notes the following story in their Spring 2008 publication titled, Lessons from Sweden’s Universal Health System: Tales from the Health-care Crypt:
Quote:
Even those who do not die from encountering denials of care suffer considerably under Sweden’s universal coverage. Mr. D., a multiple sclerosis patient, lives in Gothenburg, a city of 500,000. His doctor told him about a new medicine that is considered a breakthrough inMStreatment. But, when the doctor put in a request to have Mr. D. treated with it, the request was denied. Reason: it would cost 33 percent more than the old medicine, and that was more than the government was willing to pay.
For most Swedes there are no longer any subsidies for prescription drugs. People with exceptionally high pharmaceutical costs get some subsidies, but they have to pay the greater share themselves.
When the government denied Mr. D. the new medicine on the grounds that the subsidies would cost too much, he offered to pay the full cost of the medicine himself. He was denied the option to pay full cost out of his own pocket because, the bureaucrats said, it would set a bad precedent and lead to unequal access to medicine. In Sweden, there is no way to obtain access to medication outside the government-run system.
For most Swedes there are no longer any subsidies for prescription drugs. People with exceptionally high pharmaceutical costs get some subsidies, but they have to pay the greater share themselves.
When the government denied Mr. D. the new medicine on the grounds that the subsidies would cost too much, he offered to pay the full cost of the medicine himself. He was denied the option to pay full cost out of his own pocket because, the bureaucrats said, it would set a bad precedent and lead to unequal access to medicine. In Sweden, there is no way to obtain access to medication outside the government-run system.
While currently it's possible an insurance company in the US may refuse the payment of certain medications, we are still fortunate enough to not have the abhorrent denial of another person (doctor or otherwise) to pay for medication on our behalf from their own pocket.
KazigluBey wrote:
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1205953/NHS-branded-evil-Orwellian-high-level-US-politicians.html
The question isn't about whether or not Hawking, an accomplished theoretical physicist who had already graduated Oxford and started attending Trinity Hall before evidence of ALS presented itself, would receive treatment; instead the question is whether or not someone of less accomplishment would.
Hawking wrote:
'I have received a large amount of high quality treatment without which I would not have survived.'
The question isn't about whether or not Hawking, an accomplished theoretical physicist who had already graduated Oxford and started attending Trinity Hall before evidence of ALS presented itself, would receive treatment; instead the question is whether or not someone of less accomplishment would.
Well someone of less accomplishment will have alot more chance of getting treatment from the NHS, considering that like Master_Pedant said, America's rationing system is based on wealth.
SDFarsight wrote:
Criticising Fox News is not cool, but it is standing up for decent journalism. It is literally part of the British Media Studies curriculum (at least in my college) to learn about media bais and especially Fox New's bais.
Do you even realize what you just said ? Thanks for proving my point. Your educational institution is teaching you about the "right" and "wrong" news sources. Do you even remotely comprehend how atrocious of a violation that is ?
You sir, have been brainwashed. Do you know how I know ? Because our Soviet education system was very similar.
In 1991 it was painful for me to get un-brainwashed. A shocking experience, really. Learning that 50% of what I was taught in school had a horrible bias. Some of it (such as USSR's alleged "complete innocence" in WWII) I still can't fully get over today.
One day it will happen to you as well. When the light hits your eyes for the first time, the eyes hurt.
Orwell wrote:
I live in one of the most conservative regions of the country and am surrounded by right-wing radicals all the time. Trust me, you don't want to cite these people agreeing with you. It doesn't help your case at all to say that a pack of morons believes the same as you do.
I've heard this before. However my opinions are not those of "right wing radicals". They're merely of what used to be conservatives. You know, people who value Borders, Language, Culture, smaller government. If you were to actually listen to aforementioned Fox News, or even Sarah Palin, she's such a person. She's not a monster, she's what I consider to be a normal person with family values, strong moral convinctions.
She's not overly "smart" (Stalin was very smart too, look where it got him), but she's uncorrupt and has a clear conscience. Now the people who harassed her, threatened her life, and burned down her church - liberals - I don't have many kind words about them.
The reason she's popular is because the "conservatives" we got in the government now are anything but, and people sense that, no matter what the talking heads say on the Communist News Network.
The liberals we got in the government today... let's just say..., in 1950s many of them would be labeled "commie pinko bastards", because that's what they are. They're traitors to the very foundations on which the country was built. The so-called conservatives too. Bush was an embarassment, and Obama is an even bigger embarassment.
Now, there's a lot of "right wing radicals" who act as clowns, walk around with swastikas painted on Obama's face, who look and talk like trailer trash and have IQ below 50. They're a convenient label to use on all conservatives, a nice big fat target of a stereotype.
Quote:
I wasn't so much trying to marginalize you. I just find this reaction among so many ex-Soviets (even some educated ones) to be interesting. It's curious to see people who lived under Soviet rule go off with absurd misunderstandings of socialism- it's a strange lack of perspective to equate minimal social welfare programs with the dictatorship of the proletariat.
Well, I guess since I condescend on the likes of you (calling you brainwashed morons), you can condescend on me. It's fair. No, I'm not being sarcastic. It's okay.
It's funny that you assume that people who lived (not merely VISITED) in two countries have less perspective than people who lived in just one. Quite the opposite, actually.
Immigrants see the truth, because they have perspective. Chinese and Russian immigrants see exactly who you elected here.
Statism is the overarching system of belief out of which all great dictators sprout.
Obama is a Statist. He believes the State should control the citizen's lives. Most of who voted for him were uninformed. The rest were Statists as well. Given your nickname I find it double ironic how you remain non-reactive to Obama's unprecedented in frequency television appearances, to the point where he started to annoy the actual networks he appeared on.
...
Now... as I find myself outnumbered, I simply have neither the time nor the nerves to keep up this exchange. I've done what I could in the past to support my arguments, but the chain of liberals on most Internet forums never ends. I've never experienced the part where it just ends and people say "Okay, I understand your opinions and accept whatever sources you provided". So I'm not going to waste another week of my life trading potshots with a dozen people.
If you feel particularly strongly about an issue, feel free to PM me. This will at least filter out those of you too lazy to PM. I'm outta here.
P.S. As parting word, I recommend y'all read this book. It may just undo the damage Berkeley has done to your brain.
SDFarsight wrote:
Well someone of less accomplishment will have alot more chance of getting treatment from the NHS, considering that like Master_Pedant said, America's rationing system is based on wealth.
Also based on wealth; however, in this case, not the wealth of their own (which they may have the opportunity to change), but on the "wealth" of a government--deciding what is and is not too expensive along with what does and does not constitute equal treatment.
In the case I cited, the same person who didn't have the money still didn't get the drugs the doctor felt necessary. Unfortunately, even when a third party offered to pay for the drugs, the patient still didn't get the drugs.
There's a big difference when one needs something and simply can't afford it and when the government intervenes, preventing an opportunity for you to receive it.
Tollorin
Veteran
Joined: 14 Jun 2009
Age: 44
Gender: Male
Posts: 3,178
Location: Sherbrooke, Québec, Canada
monsterland wrote:
I lived in Soviet Union (and former USSR) for 17 years. What Obama is doing is no joke, and many of us former Soviets also easily recognize the brainwashing that goes in on America's educational institutions such as Berkeley, which produce people like you. This started decades ago.
Nothing personal against YOU, I'm sure you are a really nice person, but you've been mislead.
I used to be brainwashed into Communism and Socialism too... faux drive for equality and spreading the wealth. Faux enlightement appeals to the youth, and is propagated by the government and educational institutions from then on.
I was also the subject to the end result of what will eventually become Obama's healthcare system [disaster]. I hope you enjoy having your teeth drilled without anaesthetics and waiting 3 hours for an ambulance to (maybe) arrive.
Nothing personal against YOU, I'm sure you are a really nice person, but you've been mislead.
I used to be brainwashed into Communism and Socialism too... faux drive for equality and spreading the wealth. Faux enlightement appeals to the youth, and is propagated by the government and educational institutions from then on.
I was also the subject to the end result of what will eventually become Obama's healthcare system [disaster]. I hope you enjoy having your teeth drilled without anaesthetics and waiting 3 hours for an ambulance to (maybe) arrive.
Having lived in "left wing" dictature make you biased. You assume that every drive toward left wing is a drive toward dictature, which is not the case.Right wing too can lead to dictature. Right now in USA the right wing is closer to dictature that the left wing. (The "Patriot act" is a good example) But because of your biased views you can't see it.
Also, in Canada the ambulances comes in 5 minutes and anesthesia is frequentlty used.
_________________
Down with speculators!! !
SDFarsight wrote:
Criticising Fox News is not cool, but it is standing up for decent journalism.
There is no such thing as "decent journalism" in america, at least, not anymore. It's all propaganda, be it Fox's republican Propaganda, MSNBC's Democratic Propaganda, or CNN's... Honestly I find CNN too hard to watch to even discern what type of propaganda they're pushing.
