The "No Kids Allowed" Movement

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IF there is a "movement" to speak of (is there even a facebook group?), i personally think that's a bit much.

Like i said - i love my nieces and nephews and I'm missing 3 of them that moved to seattle recently before i had a chance to take them bowling again. They re so awesome. you wouldn't believe how good the 4 year old is.

But a bowling alley at 11am on a saturday is an outstanding place to take your kids. As long as you can keep them from dropping bowling balls on themselves or running where they shouldn't go.

Fine dining or a place for singles to mingle maybe not so much.

If the manager of an establishment hears from enough of his customers that they would come more frequently or linger longer and spend more money on booze or dessert if there weren't unruly children around, the manager of that establishment is well within his rights to decide whether children are allowed - and smart ones probably decide they are only not allowed on particular evenings.

Insufficient data to compute:

child and parents; adult and community; working definition of "misbehave"

Once again its up to me to tell the truth.

1... most adults are by their own choice far more ignorant then any child.
2... some adults are good people and are not ignorent (but very few these days)
3... most children are not ignorent unless you put it in their heads that "ignornace is OK"
4... all humans can be good or bad... it is not their age that determins this... it is their actions
5... a lot of adults are far more childish then most children...
6... everyone has their own views and it is ok to have your own views.

now let's put the arguments on this topic to rest and just get along!
I really don't want to keep seeing these post that basically say "all kids are bad"
it might not say it exactly like that but that is what you mean to say...
before we expect children to "behave" we as adults need to rethink how we behave,

thta means all of us!! ! it is the truth even I have to behave if I want children to...
so lets just end the nonesense posted in this topic, it is not funny if anyone is luaghting at this...
and i hope no one is luaghting... this not an easy matter for anyone...

'misbehave': for starters, speaking too loudly, requesting attention in strident tones, making comments inappropriate for company, mishandling food or utensils through lack of coordination or sheer delight at seeing food fly, etc, etc, etc.

Why not?

You joined a discussion, prepare for your posts to be scrutinized and challenged. Your writing style does not help your position. If you are writing a book, you wouldn't want to cause headaches to your editor.

MAYBE I could see banning infants as a justifable move, but the fact remains that I've went to many establishments in Winnipeg that have had children from time to time, and while there's an occassional crier it doesn't seem to have reached anything near the endemic proportions so many people are whinning about in this thread. I'm not sure if people are worse parents in the US, but let me just continue that even if you can make the "child isn't responsible" argument, I'm sure we'd all agree that there are adults with various disabilities, some of which may miitgate responsibility. Is it suddenly a sane move to start barring people with certain disabilities from these establishments? Quite frankly, I find the support for these draconian measures among otherwise thoughtful people disheartening.

in the book i'm writing I do use good grammer and all that sort of stuff...

but this is not a book so there are no reasons to correct ones grammer or sentences or writing style!
now i no longer want anything to do with this topic becuase it is on a road to pure chaos...

I will avoid this topic from here on unless you clean up your act!! !

Implying that I am either lying or ignorant.


I disagree. Children can have a unique, outside-of-the-box logic, but they are generally profoundly ignorant of social norms and mores - moreso the younger they are. Adults may willfully violate norms that they know, but they are not ignorant of them.


Disruptiveness is not intrinsically "bad," but it is tautologically disruptive. While children are not intrinsically more "bad" than adults, they are intrinsically more disruptive. Sometimes adults want calm.


True, "lots" of adults are childish; however, statistically a child is far more likely to be childish than an adult is.


well, yeah.


'now, shut up and let me have the last word.'

Then we're all good, because no one has said that. What people have said is that private business owners should have the right to disallow children in ceratin venus so that adults can have some times and places away from children.

No. You are reading in something that is not there. Please allow for the nuance that really does exist in this argument. What is bad in one context might not be so in another, and just because someone 'behaves badly' once in a while does not make them a bad person - whether they're a child or an adult.

Mmmm I generally think of 'draconian' as 'state imposed,' and I think we're talking about allowing the owners of private establishments to set their own rules here.
Some examples of poor behavior by parents/children that I wouldn't want to encounter in a nice restaurant after I'd gone to the trouble of finding a babysitter and rearanging my schedule for a night out:
*parent setting a diapered toddler down on the food counter
*siblings fighing with each other in moderate volumes but rough tones; parents hissing at fighting siblings to stop fighting; parents threatening fighting children with various punishments for fighting
*toddler flinging food across the room
*toddler screaming in a joyous way that nevertheless makes me want to physically flee due to sound issues
*tween sullenly snapping at parents everytime he or she is addressed/tween complaining about being ignored in loud tones
*tween(s) taking delight in taking up more than their share of time/space in aisles, bathrooms, noise volume, etc.

*snort*
Ok.
Welcome to the PPR forum.

This shows a huge lack on respect towards others. Are you implying that people in forums are subhumans that do not deserve the sort of writing style you would put in a book?

Truth is, that you won't have a good writing style if you don't practice it. Making excuses like "I am not writing a book right now" will not help your writing style. There are plenty of good reasons to improve it, and switching to "no grammerz mode" when you are in forums is detrimental to such improvement.

This is completely false. Trivial cases: When you are very old your brain is no longer at its best and it will perform worse. When you are a kid your brain is still not developed. It does not finish development until mid teens, I think.

I remember being a kid and I when I look back many of the decisions I took when I was a kid were incredibly stupid. I remember how a cartoon character in a cereal box would make me really want the cereal. That's worse than freaking Jesus.



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Discrimination by age is perfectly widespread, legal and ok in basically all cultures. The elderly can cut waiting lines. Babies cannot open bank accounts. Children cannot enter strip clubs. You can't be president at 26-th. You can't have sex with children. You need 16 for a driver's license. Etc, etc, etc.

Take them abroad where children are better-behaved?

Stop moaning and have a little bit of personal responsibility.

At the end of the day, it is not the restaurant's concern! Their concern is that as many paying patrons are as happy as possible. If they don't want screeching children bellowing and running around the shop, that comes into it too.

You can't force your ideals on private businesses like this. Unless you're willing for some of your favourite restaurants to go out of business as a result?

Oh yes, I forgot, you're a leftist, so that doesn't bother you.

Children don't pay taxes, don't vote, don't serve on juries, or have any of the responsibilities as citizens, which to me makes them second class citizens. I don't understand why so much of our moral issues have to put the children ahead of everybody else. And discrimination against kids is perfectly alright, because unlike other forms of discrimination, children eventually grow out of their second class status when they become adults.

I was invited to a "no-kids" wedding once. Children were not only unwelcome at the ceremony (which seems reasonable) but also banned from the reception. I feel that weddings are about celebrating family, and I think the motive behind banning children from the reception was money. The couple didn't want to pay for the additional dinners, which is really tacky. I snubbed the invite entirely, and didn't even send a card. I would do the same again.

Quote:
No one is less inteligent becuase of their age.

perhaps you didn't know that the "very old" as you call them are often (but not always) very wise...

did you not know that each knew generation is commonly better with technolagy then the older generation?
that clearly means they are very intelligent.



I am writing a book right now!! ! get your facts striaght!

I am just so sick of this topic...
yet some of you refuse to accept that i no longer wish to deal with your severe lack of compassion for our people!
you can argue you can be the ignorant types who care only for theirselves... you can go to war for all I care!! !

but leave the ones who have a heart (like me)
out of your iilogical self centered over controlling disrespect of the younger generations that guess what?
willl have to clean up the mess that the increasingly currupt older generation has cuased...
take that into account... along with these reasons you seem to ignore...
Children don't kill innocent poeple
they don'y rob banks
and they don't do anything criminal
they do not discriminate in any way
these reasons make them far better citizens then you and your power hungry buddys or whatever you call hateful group.

Aslo childhood is the most important part of human development... what happens when your a child can effect your life as an adult.
if you treat them kindly they are more likley to be kind as an adult... but if you dicriminate them they might not be so kind as an adult.

now fight all you want with each other do what you will to the world most valuable resource that just so happens to be the children...
see what it gets you when your too old and weak to take care of yourselfs or handle all the horrific
chaos you've done to our once beutiful planet... and are once great people!! !
now try to see what its like to grow up in the currupt world of today... it sure is'nt easy and you know its true

if you continue trying to draw me into your negativity... then you are a sad, very sad soul...
we all know this is a diffcult subject and You may chose the side you want...
you can be a benifit to society by improving the community (like better edgucation or volunteer as a fire fighter)
or you can be currupt and take away human freedom for your own gain...
then you could just stay out of both sides and live alone...
it's your choice make the world a happy place for all or just plain ruin everyones lives

most of you are clearly out to cuase issues... when the world already has enoght to worry about.

Factually untrue.

It's rare but it does happen. Usually guns are involved but not always.

Generally they are not culpable because they do not understand what they do.

Because they are ignorant.