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Oklahoma bans cities from raising minimum wage

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Kraichgauer
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05 May 2014, 4:08 pm

Raptor wrote:
You actually believe that an agency of the federal government gives two s**ts about anything other than sustaining its own empire under the guise of education?
:roll:


Geez, I'm not even as cynical as you! 8O


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05 May 2014, 5:47 pm

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05 May 2014, 6:17 pm

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Kraichgauer
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05 May 2014, 7:29 pm

Misslizard wrote:
Image


Amen, and Amen!


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05 May 2014, 7:48 pm

/\ I'm sensing envy here.


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Kraichgauer
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05 May 2014, 8:01 pm

Raptor wrote:
/\ I'm sensing envy here.


Not at all. Just contempt for the rich and powerful whose real god is money.


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05 May 2014, 8:05 pm

Only because you're not rich and powerful. Neither am I but I have this thing about not being a slave to envy and resentment disguised as liberalism.


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Kraichgauer
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05 May 2014, 8:27 pm

Raptor wrote:
Only because you're not rich and powerful. Neither am I but I have this thing about not being a slave to envy and resentment disguised as liberalism.


Why is it everytime someone criticizes big business - especially when it uproots production and outsources it, devastating communities and people alike - conservatives say it's actually about class envy?
As a matter of fact, I'm quite happy living my life of genteel poverty as a bohemian bum with my wife and daughter. I just feel outraged when those who have the power and wealth reject the idea that they owe their workers or their country any sense of responsibility, all the while selling the 99% a bill of goods that they just have to work a little longer and harder, and they'll be rich, too. Then walk out on their country for cheaper labor, all for the sake of a little more money.


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05 May 2014, 9:45 pm

It was Ross Perot who criticized NAFTA.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5XEziSYRqhU

Clinton supported it, and Gore defended it vigorously in debate.



Kraichgauer
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05 May 2014, 10:41 pm

NobodyKnows wrote:
It was Ross Perot who criticized NAFTA.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5XEziSYRqhU

Clinton supported it, and Gore defended it vigorously in debate.


Yeah, and that was a terrible mistake on Clinton's and Gore's part. It must not be forgotten that Clinton was actually a right leaning Democrat. He after all was responsible for the Defense Of Marriage Act.


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05 May 2014, 10:45 pm

I think everyone would agree that a minimum wage of $1 dollar/hr won't cause harm, and $100/hr would. So, intellectually, the discussion is about a threshold value.

Thus far, the pro-minimum wage thinkers appear to have failed to explain how the threshold value should be set?

Invoking "the 1% is greedy" and "I want money from the wealthy" is not proper, most business owners are smaller places that operate on a tight budget.


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zer0netgain
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06 May 2014, 9:11 am

LoveNotHate wrote:
I think everyone would agree that a minimum wage of $1 dollar/hr won't cause harm, and $100/hr would. So, intellectually, the discussion is about a threshold value.

Thus far, the pro-minimum wage thinkers appear to have failed to explain how the threshold value should be set?

Invoking "the 1% is greedy" and "I want money from the wealthy" is not proper, most business owners are smaller places that operate on a tight budget.


I think the solution is a "tiered" minimum wage.

You can't set it for ALL jobs because all jobs are not equal. There is no way someone doing an easy and menial job should be paid the same as someone who does a difficult or laborious entry-level job....no debate. However, a minimum wage law would do just that.

Tier the minimum wage so that people doing easy work only get X. If the job involves so much physical labor and/or cognitive skill, the minimum wage is Y. If the job involves mandatory education requirements (say 2 years in college or a certificate program), the minimum wage is Z.

I'm sure the obvious flaw is that the marketplace does a better job determining what a person of skill is paid for their work, but the counterpoint is that in a bad economy, where supply outstrips demand, you won't have to pay that much to get a skilled worker who needs a job.

Also, some places (like Lowes here in the USA) has to offer pay commensurate with education and experience thanks to holding federal contracts. I suspect that is why I can't get hired with them....they can't pay me what I'm worth to them, but rather they must pay me what the government dictates...so I'm passed over for someone with less credentials.



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06 May 2014, 10:06 am

Kraichgauer wrote:
Raptor wrote:
Only because you're not rich and powerful. Neither am I but I have this thing about not being a slave to envy and resentment disguised as liberalism.


Why is it everytime someone criticizes big business - especially when it uproots production and outsources it, devastating communities and people alike - conservatives say it's actually about class envy?
As a matter of fact, I'm quite happy living my life of genteel poverty as a bohemian bum with my wife and daughter. I just feel outraged when those who have the power and wealth reject the idea that they owe their workers or their country any sense of responsibility, all the while selling the 99% a bill of goods that they just have to work a little longer and harder, and they'll be rich, too. Then walk out on their country for cheaper labor, all for the sake of a little more money.


Why and how someone would so casually relegate themselves and their family to genteel poverty, any poverty, is beyond me.


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Kraichgauer
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06 May 2014, 10:55 am

Raptor wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
Raptor wrote:
Only because you're not rich and powerful. Neither am I but I have this thing about not being a slave to envy and resentment disguised as liberalism.


Why is it everytime someone criticizes big business - especially when it uproots production and outsources it, devastating communities and people alike - conservatives say it's actually about class envy?
As a matter of fact, I'm quite happy living my life of genteel poverty as a bohemian bum with my wife and daughter. I just feel outraged when those who have the power and wealth reject the idea that they owe their workers or their country any sense of responsibility, all the while selling the 99% a bill of goods that they just have to work a little longer and harder, and they'll be rich, too. Then walk out on their country for cheaper labor, all for the sake of a little more money.


Why and how someone would so casually relegate themselves and their family to genteel poverty, any poverty, is beyond me.


Even if I exaggerated my financial situation a bit for the sake of romanticizing my current status, you're not me, so please, don't criticize. :shameonyou:


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06 May 2014, 11:50 am

/\ That was more skepticism that criticism. You should know by now that criticism from me in PPR would have most likely contained a good tablespoon full of condescension and/or mockery. :P
Moreover, it should go without saying that the best way to avoid criticism is by not proudly advertising oneself as something they don't want to be criticised for.


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Kraichgauer
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06 May 2014, 12:57 pm

Raptor wrote:
/\ That was more skepticism that criticism. You should know by now that criticism from me in PPR would have most likely contained a good tablespoon full of condescension and/or mockery. :P
Moreover, it should go without saying that the best way to avoid criticism is by not proudly advertising oneself as something they don't want to be criticised for.


Well, just the same, my wife and I rather enjoy a more counter cultural life free of too many possessions (though admittedly, we spoil our little girl with what dispensable income we have). I might want to live in a commune if I didn't have such an aversion to other people.


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