08 Nov 2015, 3:17 am
08 Nov 2015, 3:22 am
08 Nov 2015, 4:34 am
MonsterCrack wrote:
Because just because Muhammad did it, doesn't mean we're supposed to blindly imitate him in everything.... If Muhammad had lived in the Arctic, does that mean that all Muslims, even those living in desert regions, are supposed to wear heavy coats?? When we follow the sunnah of the Prophet Muhammad, we only do things which are universal.... if times change, or we live in a different part of the world, then we can adjust it to current times or present cultural norms..... you'll find that sunnah deals primarily with things like temperament and food etiquette, not cultural norms specific to a time and place.....
Clothes are a practical matter. We are talking about morals and ethics, for which, again, Mohammed is supposed to be the gold standard.
Quote:
most Muslims know not to marry off their 9 year olds... even in saudi arabia, the minimum age of marriage is 17.
You seem extraordinarily capable of pulling baseless figures and assertions out of thin air. The Grand Mufti of Saudi Arabia has decreed, as late as 2009, that girls as young as 10 are marriageable. 14 percent of girls in Yemen are married before 15. Neither country has a minimum age set for marriage. I could go on with figures for Pakistan and Afghanistan, but I think we both know they wouldn't make Sharia look any more appealing.
Quote:
Fine, I'll tell you... shariah has a means of eliminating crime and social ills, by getting rid of the root of the problem, such as eliminating sexual immorality by means of gender segregation, elimination of crime by means of harsh penalties but at the same time paying zakat for charity and not punishing those who steal to feed themselves and/or their families... etc.
That's why the rates of rape is so much lower in the islamic world than in, say, Scandinavia, right? Oh, wait...
Also, there was one old ruler in Romania that bragged that he could leave a jewelled cup out in public and retrieve it later, because no one would dare steal it. Ever heard of Vlad the Impaler?
Quote:
and people in shariah countries are actually happier than people in the United States because they have a more close-knit society that does not have to deal with (as much) suicide, school shootings, millions of accidental pregnancies, the poor being left to fend for themselves, women being treated as sex objects and raped on dates, alcoholism, drug addiction, crime, etc. The saudis and those in the UAE, according to psychologists, are among the happiest people in the world... Turks and Americans are among the least happy... 
...And the Swiss and the Scandinavians habitually top the charts. I'd say our system is pretty much the polar opposite of Sharia, so do you think maybe looking at reality would help determine what a civilized and reasonable system actually is?
Quote:
oh, and....
homelessness, sex addiction, incest, beastiality, paranoid school administration with zero tolerance policies because of NON STOP VIOLENCE, etc.
homelessness, sex addiction, incest, beastiality, paranoid school administration with zero tolerance policies because of NON STOP VIOLENCE, etc.
Just mentioning these things does not lend you any credibility. And Sharia would do nothing to stop any of this. In fact, 30-something percent of marriages in Pakistan are between cousins, under Sharia.
Quote:
but what I plan to get out of it is halal meat (which is technically a requirement in Islam, it's kinda like kosher), a more meaningful direction in life, better cultural mentality (one that isnt full of people committing suicide with pills because they hate life, or kids bringing guns to school, or at least not as much), and a sense of pride in that my place in the afterlife is assured-since I did not get tempted to fall into sin since many of the sinful things were forbidden anyway- and a healthier psyche
"Let's implement a system of murder and oppression so I can eat my special meat and feel good about myself. Who cares about other people?"
Quote:
it's also very satisfying to know that if anyone, God forbid, rapes my daughter, wife, or sister, they will be stoned to death... 
I'm going to ignore for now the gleeful drooling over the prospect of a tribalistic execution, and instead point out that it's just as likely that your daughter will be married to her rapist.
Quote:
Anyone who would think that a 6 year old / 9 year old was mentally an adult is a blooming idiot. The idea is completely preposterous.
She's said to have been allowed to play with dolls, which was verboten to anyone who wasn't prepubescent.
SilverProteus
Veteran
Joined: 20 Jul 2007
Gender: Female
Posts: 7,915
Location: Somewhere Over The Rainbow
08 Nov 2015, 10:58 am
I suggest you take a good, critical long look at Sharia law and see what it's all about.
Subjugation of others does not make you safer, in fact, generally the opposite is true.
Removal of certain freedoms does not make people happier, it's quite the contrary, in fact.
You do not need to live in a country inflicted with Sharia law to feel like you have purpose in life.
The logic on which religious legislature is based is critically flawed. Like I said earlier, it makes victims of the innocent.
It's been shown that harsher punishments such as death penalty does not deter crime.
http://www.deathpenaltyinfo.org/deterre ... rder-rates
The general trend is that people in secular, highly educated and generally non-religious societies are safer, happier, richer, and better off.
I suggest you look for other ways to structure your life rather than defend a barbaric and backwards system. I think you're looking for answers in the wrong place. 
08 Nov 2015, 12:58 pm
Wolfram87 wrote:
MonsterCrack wrote:
Because just because Muhammad did it, doesn't mean we're supposed to blindly imitate him in everything.... If Muhammad had lived in the Arctic, does that mean that all Muslims, even those living in desert regions, are supposed to wear heavy coats?? When we follow the sunnah of the Prophet Muhammad, we only do things which are universal.... if times change, or we live in a different part of the world, then we can adjust it to current times or present cultural norms..... you'll find that sunnah deals primarily with things like temperament and food etiquette, not cultural norms specific to a time and place.....
Clothes are a practical matter. We are talking about morals and ethics, for which, again, Mohammed is supposed to be the gold standard.
Quote:
most Muslims know not to marry off their 9 year olds... even in saudi arabia, the minimum age of marriage is 17.
You seem extraordinarily capable of pulling baseless figures and assertions out of thin air. The Grand Mufti of Saudi Arabia has decreed, as late as 2009, that girls as young as 10 are marriageable. 14 percent of girls in Yemen are married before 15. Neither country has a minimum age set for marriage. I could go on with figures for Pakistan and Afghanistan, but I think we both know they wouldn't make Sharia look any more appealing.
Quote:
Fine, I'll tell you... shariah has a means of eliminating crime and social ills, by getting rid of the root of the problem, such as eliminating sexual immorality by means of gender segregation, elimination of crime by means of harsh penalties but at the same time paying zakat for charity and not punishing those who steal to feed themselves and/or their families... etc.
That's why the rates of rape is so much lower in the islamic world than in, say, Scandinavia, right? Oh, wait...
Also, there was one old ruler in Romania that bragged that he could leave a jewelled cup out in public and retrieve it later, because no one would dare steal it. Ever heard of Vlad the Impaler?
Quote:
and people in shariah countries are actually happier than people in the United States because they have a more close-knit society that does not have to deal with (as much) suicide, school shootings, millions of accidental pregnancies, the poor being left to fend for themselves, women being treated as sex objects and raped on dates, alcoholism, drug addiction, crime, etc. The saudis and those in the UAE, according to psychologists, are among the happiest people in the world... Turks and Americans are among the least happy...
...And the Swiss and the Scandinavians habitually top the charts. I'd say our system is pretty much the polar opposite of Sharia, so do you think maybe looking at reality would help determine what a civilized and reasonable system actually is?
Quote:
oh, and....
homelessness, sex addiction, incest, beastiality, paranoid school administration with zero tolerance policies because of NON STOP VIOLENCE, etc.
homelessness, sex addiction, incest, beastiality, paranoid school administration with zero tolerance policies because of NON STOP VIOLENCE, etc.
Just mentioning these things does not lend you any credibility. And Sharia would do nothing to stop any of this. In fact, 30-something percent of marriages in Pakistan are between cousins, under Sharia.
Quote:
but what I plan to get out of it is halal meat (which is technically a requirement in Islam, it's kinda like kosher), a more meaningful direction in life, better cultural mentality (one that isnt full of people committing suicide with pills because they hate life, or kids bringing guns to school, or at least not as much), and a sense of pride in that my place in the afterlife is assured-since I did not get tempted to fall into sin since many of the sinful things were forbidden anyway- and a healthier psyche
"Let's implement a system of murder and oppression so I can eat my special meat and feel good about myself. Who cares about other people?"
Quote:
it's also very satisfying to know that if anyone, God forbid, rapes my daughter, wife, or sister, they will be stoned to death...
I'm going to ignore for now the gleeful drooling over the prospect of a tribalistic execution, and instead point out that it's just as likely that your daughter will be married to her rapist.
Quote:
Anyone who would think that a 6 year old / 9 year old was mentally an adult is a blooming idiot. The idea is completely preposterous.
She's said to have been allowed to play with dolls, which was verboten to anyone who wasn't prepubescent.
I'm asking the mods to lock this thread, as it has gotten off topic and out of hand.... I am not here to argue the legitimacy of shariah with atheist westerners, I am here to ask how to either hide my liking for shariah or confess it to secular people in my life....
08 Nov 2015, 1:03 pm
08 Nov 2015, 1:13 pm
08 Nov 2015, 3:44 pm
08 Nov 2015, 4:17 pm
