What if Jews actually did control the world?

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Chronos
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25 Mar 2018, 3:28 pm

JohnPowell wrote:
Chronos wrote:
JohnPowell wrote:
They bulldozed those homes because they were done without state approval, not because they care about the rights of the Palestinians. With the cases of bulldozing Palestinian homes, they do it because they want to build the racial colonies etc.


Exactly. They were built illegaly, supporting my claim. They bulldoze Israeli homes built illegally and they bulldoze Palestinian homes built illegally.

They also bulldoze homes of the families of accused terrorists/militants who have attacked or conspired against the state. So far these have been Palestinian homes but if some jewish Israeli sect started attacking Israel they would probably have their homes bulldozed as well.

I should point out, regardless of how the Israeli Palestinian conflict started and who is responsible, it would not have occurred in previous times because until recently in history it was considered perfectly acceptable to completely annihilate one's enemy and sell the survivors in to slavery. The ancestors of contemporary humanity would find the Israeli Palestinian situation absolutely insane given that Israel could theoretically wipe Palestinians out.

Anyway if the rest of the world turned their backs, Israel and Palestine would both try to annihilate one another I'm sure. It's a shame they can't get along.


JohnPowell wrote:
No it doesn't. Israel have no right to bulldoze any homes in land that is recognised occupied Palestinian land under International Law.


We can have our moral and ethical objections to things and deitize the concept of rights like authority figures but people who raze homes and people who blow themselvez up on buses and take innocent people along with them seem to disagree with us.

JohnPowell wrote:
They also have no right to do that but they are in good company by doing that. The only other two regimes that have done that was Iraq under Saddam and Nazi Germany.


Western countries routinely raze the homes of the poor but these individuals are not even afforded the respect of having their homes recognized as homes. Their possessions and important documents get tossed in the trash and they have to start all over with nothing. Ask ASS-P about it.

My point is, there are few atrocities and crimes against humanity that are unique. It's difficult to be original these days.

JohnPowell wrote:
Israel won't just wipe the Palestinians out because they still have to try to be seen as the victims. They want to make life such hell that the Palestinians just give up.

Haha. You are making it sound like it's some 50/50 battle. Israel has hundreds of nukes and gets $10 million a day from the US and is sold major weapons by the US and UK.


I think you have misinterpreted my post and I think you have done so because of you emotional bias on the issue. Please re-read and I will then clarify if necessary.



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25 Mar 2018, 3:41 pm

naturalplastic wrote:
magz wrote:
Well, I guess Israel is actually controlled by the Jews.
Been there. Talked to people there. Lots of different agendas, ideologies, political parties fighting each other.
What if the whole world looked like this? Oh, wait....


Some say that "Israel is controlled by the US". So arguably Jews don't even run Israel!


You just hit the nail on the head.

There is actually a pretty big difference between what the average Israeli citizens want and what the Israeli government does.

Israeli democracy, much like American democracy, is greatly influenced by international banksters, most of whom aren't Jews.


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JohnPowell
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25 Mar 2018, 3:55 pm

Chronos wrote:
JohnPowell wrote:
Chronos wrote:
JohnPowell wrote:
They bulldozed those homes because they were done without state approval, not because they care about the rights of the Palestinians. With the cases of bulldozing Palestinian homes, they do it because they want to build the racial colonies etc.


Exactly. They were built illegaly, supporting my claim. They bulldoze Israeli homes built illegally and they bulldoze Palestinian homes built illegally.

They also bulldoze homes of the families of accused terrorists/militants who have attacked or conspired against the state. So far these have been Palestinian homes but if some jewish Israeli sect started attacking Israel they would probably have their homes bulldozed as well.

I should point out, regardless of how the Israeli Palestinian conflict started and who is responsible, it would not have occurred in previous times because until recently in history it was considered perfectly acceptable to completely annihilate one's enemy and sell the survivors in to slavery. The ancestors of contemporary humanity would find the Israeli Palestinian situation absolutely insane given that Israel could theoretically wipe Palestinians out.

Anyway if the rest of the world turned their backs, Israel and Palestine would both try to annihilate one another I'm sure. It's a shame they can't get along.


JohnPowell wrote:
No it doesn't. Israel have no right to bulldoze any homes in land that is recognised occupied Palestinian land under International Law.


We can have our moral and ethical objections to things and deitize the concept of rights like authority figures but people who raze homes and people who blow themselvez up on buses and take innocent people along with them seem to disagree with us.

JohnPowell wrote:
They also have no right to do that but they are in good company by doing that. The only other two regimes that have done that was Iraq under Saddam and Nazi Germany.


Western countries routinely raze the homes of the poor but these individuals are not even afforded the respect of having their homes recognized as homes. Their possessions and important documents get tossed in the trash and they have to start all over with nothing. Ask ASS-P about it.

My point is, there are few atrocities and crimes against humanity that are unique. It's difficult to be original these days.

JohnPowell wrote:
Israel won't just wipe the Palestinians out because they still have to try to be seen as the victims. They want to make life such hell that the Palestinians just give up.

Haha. You are making it sound like it's some 50/50 battle. Israel has hundreds of nukes and gets $10 million a day from the US and is sold major weapons by the US and UK.


I think you have misinterpreted my post and I think you have done so because of you emotional bias on the issue. Please re-read and I will then clarify if necessary.


I am biased about justice. It might seem that way to you when you don't understand the subject.


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Chronos
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25 Mar 2018, 4:06 pm

JohnPowell wrote:
Chronos wrote:
JohnPowell wrote:
Chronos wrote:
JohnPowell wrote:
They bulldozed those homes because they were done without state approval, not because they care about the rights of the Palestinians. With the cases of bulldozing Palestinian homes, they do it because they want to build the racial colonies etc.


Exactly. They were built illegaly, supporting my claim. They bulldoze Israeli homes built illegally and they bulldoze Palestinian homes built illegally.

They also bulldoze homes of the families of accused terrorists/militants who have attacked or conspired against the state. So far these have been Palestinian homes but if some jewish Israeli sect started attacking Israel they would probably have their homes bulldozed as well.

I should point out, regardless of how the Israeli Palestinian conflict started and who is responsible, it would not have occurred in previous times because until recently in history it was considered perfectly acceptable to completely annihilate one's enemy and sell the survivors in to slavery. The ancestors of contemporary humanity would find the Israeli Palestinian situation absolutely insane given that Israel could theoretically wipe Palestinians out.

Anyway if the rest of the world turned their backs, Israel and Palestine would both try to annihilate one another I'm sure. It's a shame they can't get along.


JohnPowell wrote:
No it doesn't. Israel have no right to bulldoze any homes in land that is recognised occupied Palestinian land under International Law.


We can have our moral and ethical objections to things and deitize the concept of rights like authority figures but people who raze homes and people who blow themselvez up on buses and take innocent people along with them seem to disagree with us.

JohnPowell wrote:
They also have no right to do that but they are in good company by doing that. The only other two regimes that have done that was Iraq under Saddam and Nazi Germany.


Western countries routinely raze the homes of the poor but these individuals are not even afforded the respect of having their homes recognized as homes. Their possessions and important documents get tossed in the trash and they have to start all over with nothing. Ask ASS-P about it.

My point is, there are few atrocities and crimes against humanity that are unique. It's difficult to be original these days.

JohnPowell wrote:
Israel won't just wipe the Palestinians out because they still have to try to be seen as the victims. They want to make life such hell that the Palestinians just give up.

Haha. You are making it sound like it's some 50/50 battle. Israel has hundreds of nukes and gets $10 million a day from the US and is sold major weapons by the US and UK.


I think you have misinterpreted my post and I think you have done so because of you emotional bias on the issue. Please re-read and I will then clarify if necessary.


I am biased about justice. It might seem that way to you when you don't understand the subject.


Yet you have misinterpreted my comment. So how can we discuss if I say one thing and you take it as another and are content with this?

I will illustrate what I am talking about.

I said... wrote:
The ancestors of contemporary humanity would find the Israeli Palestinian situation absolutely insane given that Israel could theoretically wipe Palestinians out


But you seem to have overlooked this and said..

You said wrote:
You are making it sound like it's some 50/50 battle. Israel has hundreds of nukes and gets $10 million a day from the US and is sold major weapons by the US and UK


Do you see? I noted Israelis could destroy the Palestinians but your bias has blinded you to that.

How can we discuss if you are blind to that which I say and see instead that which feeds your emotions?



Last edited by Chronos on 25 Mar 2018, 4:27 pm, edited 3 times in total.

The_Face_of_Boo
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25 Mar 2018, 4:25 pm

Kraichgauer wrote:
Chronos wrote:
The_Face_of_Boo wrote:
Quote:
At one point, there were Israelites in Israel and at some point, some of their descendants, genetically and religiously, ended up as white people in Europe, and some of them ended up as black people in southern Africa


and the ancestors of Israelites were...?


Possibly Mesopotamians but things get very obscure. I think the story of Adam and Eve goes back a lot farther than people think and might very well represent an account of the transition of humans from hunter gatherer societies to agrarian societies.


I very much concur.


Which means that the Israelites were invaders...

There's another theory:



Chronos
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25 Mar 2018, 4:45 pm

The_Face_of_Boo wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
Chronos wrote:
The_Face_of_Boo wrote:
Quote:
At one point, there were Israelites in Israel and at some point, some of their descendants, genetically and religiously, ended up as white people in Europe, and some of them ended up as black people in southern Africa


and the ancestors of Israelites were...?


Possibly Mesopotamians but things get very obscure. I think the story of Adam and Eve goes back a lot farther than people think and might very well represent an account of the transition of humans from hunter gatherer societies to agrarian societies.


I very much concur.


Which means that the Israelites were invaders...

There's another theory:



In Australia, it's easy to say the British were invaders because aboriginals were the first human lineage to set foot on the contenant but in a place where humanity essentially evolved and the ancestry of the people there goes back to obscurity, it's difficult to say. Certainly we can call Ashkenazis in Israel invaders but of the ancient Israelites, it's difficult to make that claim for a number a reasons, one being, what geographic radius are we talking about? I think the video illustrates this well.

Where I am a native American tribe used to exist in great numbers but is now very small. That tribe has been here for thousands of years. However they were not the first in the region. There was another tribe in the region which little is known about, and they came to an end abruptly when the ancestors of the tribe we call indigenous to the region attacked the previous tribe as they slept and bashed their heads in.

Archaeologists actually found the murder scene with the remains. We can construct very accurate time lines in this region because of the undisturbed sedimentation.



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25 Mar 2018, 5:24 pm

Chronos wrote:

I think you have misinterpreted my post and I think you have done so because of you emotional bias on the issue. Please re-read and I will then clarify if necessary.


You are one of the most level headed and rational people on this web site... :wink:

Chronos wrote:

Do you see? I noted Israelis could destroy the Palestinians but your bias has blinded you to that.

How can we discuss if you are blind to that which I say and see instead that which feeds your emotions?


Indeed:
"Passion is the nemisis of objectivity"...



Chronos
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25 Mar 2018, 9:16 pm

Pepe wrote:
Chronos wrote:

I think you have misinterpreted my post and I think you have done so because of you emotional bias on the issue. Please re-read and I will then clarify if necessary.


You are one of the most level headed and rational people on this web site... :wink:

Chronos wrote:

Do you see? I noted Israelis could destroy the Palestinians but your bias has blinded you to that.

How can we discuss if you are blind to that which I say and see instead that which feeds your emotions?


Indeed:
"Passion is the nemisis of objectivity"...


Thank you Pepe.



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26 Mar 2018, 4:10 am

Chronos wrote:

Thank you Pepe.


Your knight-errant as always, me lady... :wink:



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27 Mar 2018, 7:38 am

The_Face_of_Boo wrote:
Daniel89 wrote:
JohnPowell wrote:
ASPartOfMe wrote:
JohnPowell wrote:
It's not "the Jews". Though Jews are the most privileged ethnic group in the world by a mile. Israeli lobby groups have masses of power in numerous countries. Zionist Jews have a lot of power. If Jews are against Israel they can be banned from Israel and they will be pretty much shunned in the media.


Privileged is an individual thing. A Jew is more likely to be privilaged in America. That does not not make the individual Jew automatically privilaged.


They are a tiny percentage of the population yet have high positions in banking and all money institutions, Hollywood, universities, media and lobby groups. But someone like Norman Finkelstein who is critical of Israel is banned from Israel and lost his tenure.

Can you name another ethnic group that has the right to have someone else's home bulldozed down so a new one can be built for them in someone else's country?


The Jews returned to Israel after being forced out by Muslim violence. Jews being successful is nothing to do with privilege its do with their culture valuing education and not demonising money.


Jews and Muslims are very similar theologically - in fact ; as DarthMetaKnight said, they coexisted for a long time.

Actually, it was the European Christian world which was so hostile against Jews. This what made them to create Israel far away from Europe, the holocaust anyone? The inquisition anyone?

The Jews of Spain escaped the inquisition and settled in Meghreb (Morocco, Algeria and Tunisia) - there are still Jews in Morocco and Algeria to this day.

Quote:
Sephardic Jews
By the end of the Reconquista in 1492, 100,000 Jews converted and 175,000 left in exile as they were forced to either leave or convert under the Spanish inquisition.[1] The expulsions from Spain and Portugal were echoed in Sicily and many Italian states during the sixteenth century. Sicily's Jews suffered expulsion in the summer and autumn of 1492. Naples in turn expelled her Jews in 1497.[2] Sephardi Jews faced great obstacles as France refused Jewish immigrants and the nearest refuge in North Africa was barred to Jews: the Spanish occupied the ports of Algeria and Tunisia, the Portuguese occupied northern Morocco. Furthermore, the independent Sheikhs of the coastal regions refused to grant access to the interior. The Sephardim who reached Morocco were the most fortunate of the exiles to North Africa. The Berber King of Fez, Mulai Muhammed esh-Sheikh, had agreed to let them settle outside the city walls attracting 20,000 refugees alone.[3] As they arrived local Maghrebi Jews welcomed them, paid their ransoms and supplied them with food and clothing despite the cholera Sephardi Jews came with. Even so, life was harsh for Sephardi Jews in North Africa.



The Jews of Egypt existed for a long time before the foundation of Israel.

Lebanon was a 'magnet' for Jewish immigration before the Israel-Arab conflict.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_o ... in_Lebanon

Quote:
Early 20th century

In 1911, Jews from Italy, Greece, Syria, Iraq, Turkey, Egypt and Iran moved to Beirut, expanding the community there with more than 5,000 additional members. Articles 9 and 10 of the 1926 Constitution of Lebanon guaranteed the freedom of religion and provided each religious community, including the Jewish community, the right to manage its own civil matters, including education, and thus the Jewish community was constitutionally protected, a fact that did not apply to other Jewish communities in the region.[14] The Jewish community prospered under the French mandate and Greater Lebanon, exerting considerable influence throughout Lebanon and beyond. They allied themselves with Pierre Gemayel's Phalangist Party (a fascist right wing, Maronite group modelled after similar movements in Italy and Germany, and Franco's Phalangist movement in Spain.) and played an instrumental role in the establishment of Lebanon as an independent state.

During the Greater Lebanon period, two Jewish newspapers were founded, the Arabic language Al-Alam al-Israili (the Israelite World) and the French Le Commerce du Levant, an economic periodical which still publishes (though it is now owned by non-Jews).

The Jewish community of Beirut evolved in three distinct phases.[15] Until 1908, the Jewish population in Beirut grew by migration from the Syrian interior and from other Ottoman cities like Izmir, Salonica, Istanbul, and Baghdad. Commercial growth in the thriving port-city, consular protection, and relative safety and stability in Beirut all accounted for the Jewish migration. Thus, from a few hundred at the beginning of the 19th century, the Jewish community grew to 2,500 by the end of the century, and to 3,500 by the First World War. While the number of Jews grew considerably, the community remained largely unorganized. During this period, the community lacked some of the fundamental institutions such as communal statutes, elected council, welfare and taxation mechanisms. In this period, the most organized and well-known Jewish institution in the city was probably the private Tiferet Israel (The Glory of Israel) boarding-school founded by Zaki Cohen in 1874. The school attracted Jewish students from prosperous families like Shloush (Jaffa), Moyal (Jaffa), and Sassoon (Baghdad). Its founder, influenced by the Ottoman reforms and by local cultural trends, aspired to create a modern yet Jewish school. It offered both secular and strictly Jewish subjects as well as seven languages. It also offered commercial subjects. The school was closed at the beginning of the 20th century due to financial hardships.


While Jews were treated worse than cattle in many parts of Europe at this time (1911).

So educate yourself before making silly statements on our region's history.



And one of the very few European countries that helped Jews to escape the Holocaust was Albania - a muslim country.

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kraftiekortie
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27 Mar 2018, 9:42 am

I believe you need some "passion" in order to form a more "objective" conception of an idea or thing---than a mere appeal to "logic."

"Logic," I have found, often skews an idea---because logic might not be based upon "real world" realities.

I would say the compromise would be to one to appeal to one's "reason." Within "reason," there is a place for both passion and lgoic.



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27 Mar 2018, 4:53 pm

kraftiekortie wrote:
I believe you need some "passion" in order to form a more "objective" conception of an idea or thing---than a mere appeal to "logic."

"Logic," I have found, often skews an idea---because logic might not be based upon "real world" realities.

I would say the compromise would be to one to appeal to one's "reason." Within "reason," there is a place for both passion and lgoic.


A healthy amount of passion is fine but when it becomes blinding or distorting it becomes problematic.

Sometimes people need to fight against something and would prefer a world view that reinforces their ideas and feeds their emotions even if they have to falsify reality to do to the extent that you could be agreeing with them and they proceed as if you are disagreeing with them.

I call these people "People who create more enemies than they actually have". They start out advocating for a particular thing and then actually become an obstacle to that which they claim to advocate for.



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27 Mar 2018, 6:47 pm

I absolutely agree.

When I say "some" passion, I don't mean the "blinding" type.

I mean...a sort of virtuous passion, which is tempered by common sense.



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27 Mar 2018, 11:17 pm

kraftiekortie wrote:
I believe you need some "passion" in order to form a more "objective" conception of an idea or thing---than a mere appeal to "logic."

Passion/emotion is good for creativity and empathy, not objectivity or logic...

kraftiekortie wrote:
"Logic," I have found, often skews an idea---because logic might not be based upon "real world" realities..

If you think this, I don't think you are doing it right... ;)
But I will keep an open mind...
Can you give some examples?

There are different "tools" for different purposes...
Analysing a statement and considering the logic behind it is different to understanding why the statement was created...
The former does not need empathy...

kraftiekortie wrote:
I would say the compromise would be to one to appeal to one's "reason." Within "reason," there is a place for both passion and lgoic.

Once again, could you give examples to make your point "concrete"?



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27 Mar 2018, 11:20 pm

Human beings must be tempered with both logic and passion in equal measure.


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27 Mar 2018, 11:27 pm

Kraichgauer wrote:
Human beings must be tempered with both logic and passion in equal measure.


What context are you using here?