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kraftiekortie
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08 Aug 2018, 8:04 pm

Anyway.....I was talking about gender politics.

Isn't this what the thread is about?

There are men's issues. Of course, men sometimes get the short end of the stick when it comes to child custody. There are women's issues as well. Like Twilight stated, men and women both should have a dialogue.

As for me, I have "people" issues. I don't really feel I have "men's" or "women's" issues too often.

Except when a woman expects me to know what's on her mind at all times, and to react accordingly.



TwilightPrincess
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08 Aug 2018, 8:25 pm

kraftiekortie wrote:
Anyway.....I was talking about gender politics.

Isn't this what the thread is about?

There are men's issues. Of course, men sometimes get the short end of the stick when it comes to child custody. There are women's issues as well. Like Twilight stated, men and women both should have a dialogue.

As for me, I have "people" issues. I don't really feel I have "men's" or "women's" issues too often.

Except when a woman expects me to know what's on her mind at all times, and to react accordingly.


I’m interested in men’s mental health. Guys are frequently expected to “suck it up.” What sort of toll does that take on a man’s mental health, especially when he’s dealing with mental illness?



kraftiekortie
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08 Aug 2018, 8:32 pm

I guess it can take a toll....but I also believe, sometimes, that people can't give in to all the adverse things that come their way. I don't feel a person is "weak" because they give in; I just feel it causes more problems if a person gives in.

I have known that a vicious cycle was coming if I didn't deal with a situation properly. The way to deal with it was to try to find a solution to it, rather than give in to it.

I could have caved in plenty of times in my life. I am fortunate that I found a way out of certain situations.

It's true that a solution isn't always forthcoming----but, I also believe one should strive for one, because through this work, the solution might come---even if it's years from now.



Peacesells
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09 Aug 2018, 4:02 am

kraftiekortie wrote:
But there really shouldn't be one. You're a smart guy. You're an engineer. I acknowledge that. You're a top dog.

Since you say he is so smart, perhaps you should consider the fact that he may be right and what you say has nothing to do with the thread.



kraftiekortie
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09 Aug 2018, 6:05 am

I just don’t agree with that assessment.......

I like to have fun here. I don’t like my fun to be limited.



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09 Aug 2018, 6:36 am

kraftiekortie wrote:
I just don’t agree with that assessment.......

I like to have fun here. I don’t like my fun to be limited.

If you don't agree please explain why you think it's not off-topic to come to a thread about men's issues to talk about how much you care about women's rights.

I'm sure the ladies are all impressed by your chivalrous concern, Kraftie, but perhaps it'd be better to do it in some more dedicated thread.



kraftiekortie
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09 Aug 2018, 6:58 am

I’m just giving my take on the matter....I believe in the “what’s fair is fair” doctrine—for all genders.

Any woman here will attest that I am not a “white knight.”

I calls them as I sees them.



Peacesells
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09 Aug 2018, 7:24 am

kraftiekortie wrote:
I’m just giving my take on the matter....I believe in the “what’s fair is fair” doctrine—for all genders.

Any woman here will attest that I am not a “white knight.”

I calls them as I sees them.

"What's fair is fair" is a legitimate take on the subject, but for some reason (I wonder why) after you say that the rest or your post seemed more oriented about women, which is not the topic of this thread. Fnord is right.



Biscuitman
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09 Aug 2018, 7:31 am

Women are awesome btw



Magna
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09 Aug 2018, 7:50 am

Biscuitman wrote:
Women are awesome btw


Agreed.



Peacesells
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09 Aug 2018, 8:01 am

I am sure behaving like this in a thread about men's issues will give you extra feminism points and make the ladies impressed, guys.



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09 Aug 2018, 8:26 am

Peacesells wrote:
I am sure behaving like this in a thread about men's issues will give you extra feminism points and make the ladies impressed, guys.
That loud crashing sound you hear is the wannabe White Knights of this community derailing this thread in their desperate attempts to suck up to feminists in the hope of getting girlfriends.



kraftiekortie
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09 Aug 2018, 9:10 am

I have a wife, and have had many lovers....



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09 Aug 2018, 9:48 am

DarthMetaKnight wrote:
Their most common argument is this: "Well … maybe men face discrimination … but women face more discrimination … so any discrimination that men face is irrelevant."

"Not as bad as" fallacy or fallacy of relative privation
https://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Not_as_bad_as

The "not as bad as" fallacy, also known as the fallacy of relative privation, asserts that:
1. If something is worse than the problem currently being discussed, then
2. The problem currently being discussed isn't that important at all.


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aghogday
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09 Aug 2018, 9:51 am

The Grace of Balance; yes, Literally Balance is one 'Male Issue' that
Technically Leads to out of Balance Minds and Bodies in never truly Developing
A Balance of Body and Mind in an Actual Physical Free Dance of Life that actually Regulates
Emotions and Integrates Senses as this Deficit Basically arises from Males who rarely if ever Participate in Rough and Tumble Play and Outdoor Team Sports that do require this Dance of Balance Naturally leading to Emotional Regulation and Integration of Senses; As Additionally, A Non-Verbal Language of Fearless is An Attraction Factor that Science Shows Attracts Women most of all.

This part is rather simple and complex; A Greatest Negative Factor of "Men's Issues" is a Failure to Develop the Innate Instinct and Intuition in Non-Verbal Language that Makes a Dude a Chick Magnet everywhere they go; To sit still in Class and to Stick to Screens at Night in all the ways that moves one while sitting still is no way to become a 'Real Man' who Women will even notice.

As an Anthropologist Participant Observer in the Art of Free Style Dance in Public now for 9699 Miles in 59 Months
Starting at age 53; with now a Documentation that yes Class I can empirically prove now with over 2000 Smiling Ear
to Ear Early 20's Females in A Joy of the excitation of Dance I Bring to/for them is Clear to See in Thousands of these Recorded Selfies in this Empirical Evidence; yes, it is clear to see at least in this Case Study Evidence that Close to all my Problems Associated with this so-called Asperger's Syndrome is I never even Learned how to move Freely and Confidently as two feet become one Force of Balance. Now that this issue is fully resolved, Life is Realistically Magic now in attracting the Opposite Sex Freely; of Course, just as an Anthropological Exercise as A Participant Observer as Still my 48 Year old Wife exceeds the Beauty of Most of those Women; and yes, upon request that's easy to prove too. I Credit my Marriage though 'strictly' through the Love my Mother Gardened as me; A most Attractive Factor along with Fearless that Any Woman will Love in a Male Still today is the Ability to Generate a Feeling of Fearless Unconditional Love; call it 'White Knight' if one likes but that turns Women on; And Oh My God it's like Human 101, Love is the Best when you really Do Love
And Am
Love Incarnate too.

Other than the Grace of Balance; the other Greatest so-called 'Toxic Patriarchal Deficit' of Males Still is
That Failure to Develop the Empathy Sympathy and Compassion of Love; And Chances are if one is either
not born with that Propensity and or Gardened that way by a Loving Hugging Mother; and yes, other Family
and Peer Support As Science now shows how one may not even have/develop the 'Wiring' to Feel the 'Warm
And Fuzzy' Pet of a Cat; And yes a Greatest 'Male Issue' as far as this real life deficit goes is never
Gaining the Ability to make a Woman Feel as Warm Inside and Fuzzy as a Cat Purring
too; just waiting to please one in every which way and loose as far as that stuff goes too.

People who truly Believe that Physical and Emotional Intelligences are inferior to Intellectual
Pursuits of Standard IQ are Inherently Lost from what even actually Counts Most in Life; namely,
Still A Fearless Unconditional Love for when one is Filled up; and yes 'Feeled' up in that Nation
of Human Being Within; the Rest of the Cake of Life is simply Icing (Heaven) but sure; being
Financial Independent erases the other Part of the Sour Lemons out of the Sweeter Lemonades to; heHe..;)

In Shorter Terms too, Social Status through Purposeful Meaningful Subsistence Gaining Activities Full of Meaning
And Purpose are High on the Priority Lists of Males who Feel and Sense Life is not Worth Living and basically S88KS.

Clearly Defined Social Roles and Purposeful Meaningful Subsistence Gaining Activities Full of Holy and Sacred Senses and
Feelings about Success in Life Naturally Brings an Easier Gait and Taller Posture in life; reference the Fearless Non-Verbal Language in attracting the other Gender, too, if that pleases you too.

It all comes down to this;
If you can't do that Stray (Stay) Cat Loving Strut; you lose.
And that Folks has Little to do with any Book Learning at all.

So in even a
Smaller
Phrase
Dance Life
Lovingly Fearlessly
And Freely now or lose
more than you may even imagine now;

Just from my Experience, at least, of course; and Oh God so much more;
Almost all my 'Male Issues' came from a Lack of Free Dance; 'who' Knew the Answer is so simple.
And to be clear 'Your Male Issues' may be totally different from the ones I had; just my opinion this is too.


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09 Aug 2018, 10:20 am

I love you Fnord, very good points you've raised in this thread.
I've thought alot about most of them myself too, from my own reference, but also watching other men, and of course my dad getting absoulutely crushed to pieces in divorce.

These issues have angered me alot throughout my life, but even though it was very clear to me, as I'm not a dumb guy, at some point, I've started to accept that these things will never ever change. The people in this thread who honestly think the perception of men in society will change, if men open up an become more emotional?...I don't know what you guys are smoking. You probably don't have the experience of being a man, so this might seem like a convincing and logical arguement to you. Most of my guy friends and I, have absolutely no problem opening up or being emotional when there's only men around.

Men are human doings. Society doesn't care about you, because you're supposed to just be strong. This only applies if you are in fact, strong. If you're a weak man, you're either completely invisible or looked down upon, especially by women I might add. There's no group that society has less sympathy for, than weak men.

I've seen both sides of this myself. Coming from a broken home and being a relative failure, to now being in the upper quartile of students at medical school. From being completely invisible to now getting sympathy I don't really need anymore, it's hard not become resentful about it. It's women in particular who have made a 180 on me in this regard.

See, I didn't ever get sympathy by opening up, being emotional or adopting feminine characteristics, I got it by fulfilling my duty as a human doing, that can potentially provide a bunch of resources for a hypothetical family.

Women have never cared about men, so I couldn't care less about women's issues.
I don't really care about men's issues either, because it's a hopeless game you'd have to be an idiot to believe in.