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Pro-conscription should be banned

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thinkinginpictures
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02 Jun 2020, 2:00 am

Fnord wrote:
Personal attack noted.


It was not intended as a personal attack, but my way of expressing how I personally view your opinion.

Fnord wrote:
What part of "sound mind" is difficult for you to understand?


Fnord wrote:
What part of "able-bodied" is difficult for you to understand?


Sometimes, "able-bodied and sound mind" can mean just being conscious and able to walk on two legs.



Last edited by thinkinginpictures on 02 Jun 2020, 3:57 am, edited 1 time in total.

magz
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02 Jun 2020, 2:37 am

thinkinginpictures wrote:
Why? Why is that not okay to use hate speech and thought police against someone evil?
Hate speech and thought police is - in itself - not an evil as such.

Yes, hate speech and thought police are evil by themselves. Apart from their enormous potential to be abused:

Hate speech: I don't mean how SJW can stretch the term to contain anything they don't like. I mean rhetorics saying a group of people don't deserve to be treated like humans. This is enabling for the worst atrocities recorded in the history - hey, you can switch off your moral sense when dealing with these under-people! And people do it, to most horrible effects.

Thought police: We're not holders of the Truth given us from the Heaven. We're sentient apes trying to figure things out. Trying to stop the natural process of exploring the reality with thinking is futile - from historical record, we know harsher and harsher punishments needed to be employed and people did it anyway. Don't you think harsh punishments for something natural are evil by themselves?


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thinkinginpictures
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02 Jun 2020, 3:06 am

magz wrote:
thinkinginpictures wrote:
Why? Why is that not okay to use hate speech and thought police against someone evil?
Hate speech and thought police is - in itself - not an evil as such.

Yes, hate speech and thought police are evil by themselves. Apart from their enormous potential to be abused:

Hate speech: I don't mean how SJW can stretch the term to contain anything they don't like. I mean rhetorics saying a group of people don't deserve to be treated like humans. This is enabling for the worst atrocities recorded in the history - hey, you can switch off your moral sense when dealing with these under-people! And people do it, to most horrible effects.

Thought police: We're not holders of the Truth given us from the Heaven. We're sentient apes trying to figure things out. Trying to stop the natural process of exploring the reality with thinking is futile - from historical record, we know harsher and harsher punishments needed to be employed and people did it anyway. Don't you think harsh punishments for something natural are evil by themselves?


Thanks, you convinced me to think alternatively on this subject.

All I want is for wars to end, conscription and forced labour to stop, and have prosperity, wealth and welfare.

That's my intention with this topic. I was prepared to use any means neccessary to achieve this, but I see it won't work anyway.



funeralxempire
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02 Jun 2020, 4:16 pm

thinkinginpictures wrote:
magz wrote:
thinkinginpictures wrote:
Why? Why is that not okay to use hate speech and thought police against someone evil?
Hate speech and thought police is - in itself - not an evil as such.

Yes, hate speech and thought police are evil by themselves. Apart from their enormous potential to be abused:

Hate speech: I don't mean how SJW can stretch the term to contain anything they don't like. I mean rhetorics saying a group of people don't deserve to be treated like humans. This is enabling for the worst atrocities recorded in the history - hey, you can switch off your moral sense when dealing with these under-people! And people do it, to most horrible effects.

Thought police: We're not holders of the Truth given us from the Heaven. We're sentient apes trying to figure things out. Trying to stop the natural process of exploring the reality with thinking is futile - from historical record, we know harsher and harsher punishments needed to be employed and people did it anyway. Don't you think harsh punishments for something natural are evil by themselves?


Thanks, you convinced me to think alternatively on this subject.

All I want is for wars to end, conscription and forced labour to stop, and have prosperity, wealth and welfare.

That's my intention with this topic. I was prepared to use any means neccessary to achieve this, but I see it won't work anyway.


Your intentions were good, but that's what the road to hell is paved with.

It's unfortunate that some problems don't have easy top-down solutions. Something of this nature basically requires getting people to buy into moral codes that strongly favour personal freedom, but also that they not drop those views when things go bad or become scary. It's a lot harder to get people to do what you want because they've been convinced, but if your goal is to preserve freedom you don't have any other option or pretty soon you'll be the one conscripting men and promising them it's for the greater good of ending it permanently with no feasible way of implementing the end you've promised.


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02 Jun 2020, 10:06 pm

thinkinginpictures wrote:
magz wrote:
thinkinginpictures wrote:
Why? Why is that not okay to use hate speech and thought police against someone evil?
Hate speech and thought police is - in itself - not an evil as such.

Yes, hate speech and thought police are evil by themselves. Apart from their enormous potential to be abused:

Hate speech: I don't mean how SJW can stretch the term to contain anything they don't like. I mean rhetorics saying a group of people don't deserve to be treated like humans. This is enabling for the worst atrocities recorded in the history - hey, you can switch off your moral sense when dealing with these under-people! And people do it, to most horrible effects.

Thought police: We're not holders of the Truth given us from the Heaven. We're sentient apes trying to figure things out. Trying to stop the natural process of exploring the reality with thinking is futile - from historical record, we know harsher and harsher punishments needed to be employed and people did it anyway. Don't you think harsh punishments for something natural are evil by themselves?


Thanks, you convinced me to think alternatively on this subject.

All I want is for wars to end, conscription and forced labour to stop, and have prosperity, wealth and welfare.

That's my intention with this topic. I was prepared to use any means neccessary to achieve this, but I see it won't work anyway.


Out of curiosity, what would be your opinion of "conscription" if there were an option to "serve" the time in a non-military branch (although even the military branches have many non-combat areas, such as enginerring, mechanics, catering, for example) which (outside instilling some form of discipline\responsibility) focussed on things in the community (cleaning rubbish/removing graffitti/planting trees/maintinaing parks/etc.) as a way of giving back something to the community?



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03 Jun 2020, 3:27 am

Brictoria wrote:
Out of curiosity, what would be your opinion of "conscription" if there were an option to "serve" the time in a non-military branch (although even the military branches have many non-combat areas, such as enginerring, mechanics, catering, for example) which (outside instilling some form of discipline\responsibility) focussed on things in the community (cleaning rubbish/removing graffitti/planting trees/maintinaing parks/etc.) as a way of giving back something to the community?


I'm still against conscription - including non-military conscription (labour/work duty), because I consider all forced labour equal to slavery. The State should NEVER tell what I should work with, or work at all if I choose not to.

I want liberty, freedom of choice for everyone on how to make a living, so long as you don't interfere with other people's freedom.



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03 Jun 2020, 8:12 am

... and if your only options are either military duty or abject poverty ... ?


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thinkinginpictures
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03 Jun 2020, 8:43 am

Fnord wrote:
... and if your only options are either military duty or abject poverty ... ?


Poverty. Ultimately death. I prefer to rather be dead, than do military duty or other forced labor.



Last edited by thinkinginpictures on 03 Jun 2020, 9:11 am, edited 1 time in total.

Fnord
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03 Jun 2020, 8:53 am

thinkinginpictures wrote:
Fnord wrote:
... and if your only options are either military duty or abject poverty ... ?
Poverty. Ultimately death. I prefer to rather be dead, than do military duty or other forced labor...
And that is where we differ.  I would rather be a humble military veteran than a proud, rotting corpse.


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thinkinginpictures
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03 Jun 2020, 8:57 am

Fnord wrote:
thinkinginpictures wrote:
Fnord wrote:
... and if your only options are either military duty or abject poverty ... ?
Poverty. Ultimately death. I prefer to rather be dead, than do military duty or other forced labor...
And that is where we differ.  I would rather be a humble military veteran than a proud, rotting corpse.


For me it has nothing to do with being proud of anything.

I want quality of life. If I cannot get that, I prefer death.

I also prefer death above severe physical disability.



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03 Jun 2020, 9:03 am

Do you believe your quality of life would increase or decrease if society stopped existing?


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Fnord
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03 Jun 2020, 9:04 am

thinkinginpictures wrote:
Fnord wrote:
thinkinginpictures wrote:
Fnord wrote:
... and if your only options are either military duty or abject poverty ... ?
Poverty. Ultimately death. I prefer to rather be dead, than do military duty or other forced labor...
And that is where we differ.  I would rather be a humble military veteran than a proud, rotting corpse.
... I want quality of life. If I cannot get that, I prefer death...
What are you doing to achieve that "quality of life" you so deeply desire?  Besides complaining about "conscription" in a land where it no longer exists, of course...


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thinkinginpictures
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03 Jun 2020, 1:42 pm

Fnord wrote:
thinkinginpictures wrote:
Fnord wrote:
thinkinginpictures wrote:
Fnord wrote:
... and if your only options are either military duty or abject poverty ... ?
Poverty. Ultimately death. I prefer to rather be dead, than do military duty or other forced labor...
And that is where we differ.  I would rather be a humble military veteran than a proud, rotting corpse.
... I want quality of life. If I cannot get that, I prefer death...
What are you doing to achieve that "quality of life" you so deeply desire?  Besides complaining about "conscription" in a land where it no longer exists, of course...


To contribute to society - voluntarily.

You know, that soft drink tastes so much better when you're not forced to drink it.

At least, that's how I feel about stuff, I don't know about you, but for me I would HATE soft drinks, if it was compulsory to drink it.

Same goes for work.



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03 Jun 2020, 2:44 pm

vermontsavant wrote:
thinkinginpictures wrote:
It should be illegal to be in favor of conscription.

The state should never decide what to do with innocent people's bodies. My body is my body, your body is your body, and so long as you or me are not engaging in any activities that are illegal, the state should never tell us what to do/work with/live with/go to war.

You can tell what NOT to do. But NEVER tell WHAT to do!

That's why I've held this opinion of punishment to anyone who is pro-conscription.

I don't care whether those pro-conscription are from the right or left of the political spectrum. They aren't considered human beings in my opinion.
The only country I know of with conscription is Israel,we have not had the draft since Vietnam ended,what's your worry.Your on this website so your probably autistic,so they wouldn't draft you anyway,in the Vietnam era bad knees would get you out of the draft.







Or bone spurs! 8) ! !! !! !! South Korea - North, I'd think, too - has the draft. China? Taiwan? Four countries, both of each two on perpetual guard against the other " half " :( .


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03 Jun 2020, 3:43 pm

I disagree with conscription as well...but pretty sure we have freedom of speech in this country. It would be pretty unconstitutional if there were legal penalties for any person who agrees with the idea.

The government cannot tell people what opinions to have or enforce it.


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03 Jun 2020, 3:45 pm

If you can read this, thank a teacher.
If you can read this in English, thank a conscripted veteran.


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