do hippies not realize how homophobic muslims are

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techstepgenr8tion
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02 May 2011, 3:36 pm

marshall wrote:
I guess liberals are more likely to simply make fun of Islam instead of fantasizing about a "clash of civilizations" where the US ends up nuking millions of Muslims.

I was trying to walk marshall through this statement, he apparently went out for a bit and several other people including yourself and Will jumped in to replace him.

This is what I'm coming back to - the assertion that the conservative stance on foreign policy is inherently 'nuke em all' or that saying conservative and racist or xenophobe is reciprocally redundant. That's the core of what I'm finding a problem with here.

If we just lost track of the conversation somewhere - fine, we can drop it. If you additionally agree with what I quoted above though, lets get back on point and deal with that specifically.


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02 May 2011, 3:47 pm

techstepgenr8tion wrote:
This is what I'm coming back to - the assertion that the conservative stance on foreign policy is inherently 'nuke em all' or that saying conservative and racist or xenophobe is reciprocally redundant.


For entire regions/cultures of the country, that assertion is true. A Northerner would probably likewise scratch his head at hearing of pro-life, anti-gay, war-supporting Southern Democrats.


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02 May 2011, 3:56 pm

WilliamWDelaney wrote:
puddingmouse wrote:
MDD123 wrote:
I was under the impression that homosexual activity was commonplace in a lot of Islamic countries because of thestrict approach to socializing between genders (men aren't usually allowed to talk to women unless they have family permission in many cases). Men however can publicly hold hands without raising any suspicion. I only heard it from one person (an Iraqi), but according to him, it was commonplace for men to have relations with other men and just not publicly discuss it (kind of like the way we don't talk about masturbating in public).


Yep!

They even have a third sex in Pakistan called the hijra.

It's the Western notion of homosexuality that is abhorrent to them.



This destructive, culture-destroying movement in Islam is very much like the one in Western Christianity that wants to ban the traditional celebration of Christmas because of its Pagan trappings. They even want to do away with celebrating Mohammed's birthday.



Mohammed's birthday was never much of a significant day for the Muslims (well it is just a holiday but I don't witness significant celebrations on that day), not even in my part of the world where Muslims are more moderate than the Gulf.

The reason for this, that Mohammad's birthday wasn't a significant event to Islam as Jesus' birthday to Christianity, another reason that Muslim clerics discourage any form (even the slightest of it) of Mohammad's deification, for them glorifying the day of his birth is a kind of deification, it is a part of the Muslim culture, that's why you never see statues of Mohammad because statues are seen as form of deification as well. I was told by a Muslim pilgrim who visited Mohammad's graveyard (supposedly) in Mecca, the guard there prevented him to bow and pray for him because this was seen as an act of deification.

Recently, there was some Christian (or pagan?) traditions adopted by the regular Muslims here on Mohammad's birthday, such as Christmas lights and other decorations but the clerics made it sure to prevent this new tradition to expand.


Quote:
Sorry for the caricature, but this kind of outlook really deeply annoys me, and people who tend to assume it don't seem to realize how deep, complex and ancient the connections between the cultures really are. When someone tries to explain the gritty realities of human history to them, it's like the offender has just burned down Disney Land and murdered Mickey.



Image

Title: An Islamic preacher issues a Fatwa to kill Mikey Mouse!! And Islamist cartoons came for the call!!

Bubble: "We killed Mikey! Hurray"


Sorry, couldn't help it :lol:

This gives puddingmouse another reason to be more Islamphobe :lol:



techstepgenr8tion
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02 May 2011, 4:13 pm

Bethie wrote:
techstepgenr8tion wrote:
This is what I'm coming back to - the assertion that the conservative stance on foreign policy is inherently 'nuke em all' or that saying conservative and racist or xenophobe is reciprocally redundant.


For entire regions/cultures of the country, that assertion is true. A Northerner would probably likewise scratch his head at hearing of pro-life, anti-gay, war-supporting Southern Democrats.

So are you saying its a regional thing rather than a conservative/liberal thing?


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02 May 2011, 4:16 pm

The_Face_of_Boo wrote:
WilliamWDelaney wrote:
puddingmouse wrote:
MDD123 wrote:
I was under the impression that homosexual activity was commonplace in a lot of Islamic countries because of thestrict approach to socializing between genders (men aren't usually allowed to talk to women unless they have family permission in many cases). Men however can publicly hold hands without raising any suspicion. I only heard it from one person (an Iraqi), but according to him, it was commonplace for men to have relations with other men and just not publicly discuss it (kind of like the way we don't talk about masturbating in public).


Yep!

They even have a third sex in Pakistan called the hijra.

It's the Western notion of homosexuality that is abhorrent to them.



This destructive, culture-destroying movement in Islam is very much like the one in Western Christianity that wants to ban the traditional celebration of Christmas because of its Pagan trappings. They even want to do away with celebrating Mohammed's birthday.



Mohammed's birthday was never much of a significant day for the Muslims (well it is just a holiday but I don't witness significant celebrations on that day), not even in my part of the world where Muslims are more moderate than the Gulf.

The reason for this, that Mohammad's birthday wasn't a significant event to Islam as Jesus' birthday to Christianity, another reason that Muslim clerics discourage any form (even the slightest of it) of Mohammad's deification, for them glorifying the day of his birth is a kind of deification, it is a part of the Muslim culture, that's why you never see statues of Mohammad because statues are seen as form of deification as well. I was told by a Muslim pilgrim who visited Mohammad's graveyard (supposedly) in Mecca, the guard there prevented him to bow and pray for him because this was seen as an act of deification.

Recently, there was some Christian (or pagan?) traditions adopted by the regular Muslims here on Mohammad's birthday, such as Christmas lights and other decorations but the clerics made it sure to prevent this new tradition to expand.


Quote:
Sorry for the caricature, but this kind of outlook really deeply annoys me, and people who tend to assume it don't seem to realize how deep, complex and ancient the connections between the cultures really are. When someone tries to explain the gritty realities of human history to them, it's like the offender has just burned down Disney Land and murdered Mickey.



Image

Title: An Islamic preacher issues a Fatwa to kill Mikey Mouse!! And Islamist cartoons came for the call!!

Bubble: "We killed Mikey! Hurray"


Sorry, couldn't help it :lol:

This gives puddingmouse another reason to be more Islamphobe :lol:


Mickey was a rampant anti-Semite anyway and also killed Kennedy


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02 May 2011, 4:26 pm

The_Face_of_Boo wrote:

This gives puddingmouse another reason to be more Islamphobe :lol:


Mickey is a traitor to the Rodent Brotherhood and got what he had coming.


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02 May 2011, 4:27 pm

puddingmouse wrote:
The_Face_of_Boo wrote:

This gives puddingmouse another reason to be more Islamphobe :lol:


Mickey is a traitor to the Rodent Brotherhood and got what he had coming.


Swift justice. One does not leave the Rodent Brotherhood lightly


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02 May 2011, 4:32 pm

puddingmouse wrote:
The_Face_of_Boo wrote:

This gives puddingmouse another reason to be more Islamphobe :lol:


Mickey is a traitor to the Rodent Brotherhood and got what he had coming.


You really think they care about your Rodent Brotherhood?? The man's Fatwa clearly says to kill all mouse characters! They're coming after you and your filthy brotherhood, mouse :lol:.



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02 May 2011, 4:37 pm

The_Face_of_Boo wrote:
puddingmouse wrote:
The_Face_of_Boo wrote:

This gives puddingmouse another reason to be more Islamphobe :lol:


Mickey is a traitor to the Rodent Brotherhood and got what he had coming.


You really think they care about your Rodent Brotherhood?? The man's Fatwa clearly says to kill all mouse characters! They're coming after you and your filthy brotherhood, mouse :lol:.


Crap. Oh well, they haven't got Taslima Nasrin or Salman Rushdie yet, so I may still survive.

Are you peeved at me for saying I'm an Islamophobe?


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02 May 2011, 4:46 pm

puddingmouse wrote:
The_Face_of_Boo wrote:
puddingmouse wrote:
The_Face_of_Boo wrote:

This gives puddingmouse another reason to be more Islamphobe :lol:


Mickey is a traitor to the Rodent Brotherhood and got what he had coming.


You really think they care about your Rodent Brotherhood?? The man's Fatwa clearly says to kill all mouse characters! They're coming after you and your filthy brotherhood, mouse :lol:.


Crap. Oh well, they haven't got Taslima Nasrin or Salman Rushdie yet, so I may still survive.

Are you peeved at me for saying I'm an Islamophobe?


Nah, to each his own.



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02 May 2011, 4:51 pm

The_Face_of_Boo wrote:

Nah, to each his own.


I'm not the kind that thinks everyone who is a Muslim is hateful or extreme. I know those people are a minority. I just object to it as a religion and its effects on society. I live and work amongst many Muslims so my 'phobia' is based on experience.


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02 May 2011, 6:39 pm

techstepgenr8tion wrote:
Bethie wrote:
techstepgenr8tion wrote:
This is what I'm coming back to - the assertion that the conservative stance on foreign policy is inherently 'nuke em all' or that saying conservative and racist or xenophobe is reciprocally redundant.


For entire regions/cultures of the country, that assertion is true. A Northerner would probably likewise scratch his head at hearing of pro-life, anti-gay, war-supporting Southern Democrats.

So are you saying its a regional thing rather than a conservative/liberal thing?


I'm saying it's a massive, vocal, Conservative voting bloc thing.


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techstepgenr8tion
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02 May 2011, 9:30 pm

Bethie wrote:
techstepgenr8tion wrote:
Bethie wrote:
techstepgenr8tion wrote:
This is what I'm coming back to - the assertion that the conservative stance on foreign policy is inherently 'nuke em all' or that saying conservative and racist or xenophobe is reciprocally redundant.


For entire regions/cultures of the country, that assertion is true. A Northerner would probably likewise scratch his head at hearing of pro-life, anti-gay, war-supporting Southern Democrats.

So are you saying its a regional thing rather than a conservative/liberal thing?


I'm saying it's a massive, vocal, Conservative voting bloc thing.

Still no answer though, is this all? Nearly all? Most? Half and half? Some?


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03 May 2011, 12:02 am

techstepgenr8tion wrote:
Bethie wrote:
techstepgenr8tion wrote:
Bethie wrote:
techstepgenr8tion wrote:
This is what I'm coming back to - the assertion that the conservative stance on foreign policy is inherently 'nuke em all' or that saying conservative and racist or xenophobe is reciprocally redundant.


For entire regions/cultures of the country, that assertion is true. A Northerner would probably likewise scratch his head at hearing of pro-life, anti-gay, war-supporting Southern Democrats.

So are you saying its a regional thing rather than a conservative/liberal thing?


I'm saying it's a massive, vocal, Conservative voting bloc thing.

Still no answer though, is this all? Nearly all? Most? Half and half? Some?


Of John McCain's 173 electoral votes, 130 were from Southern states, 43 from elsewhere.
Of the 59,934,814 popular votes he received, 23,307,059 were from Southern States.
Of the 24 states whose electoral votes went for John McCain, 12 of them were Southern states.

There's such a strong association between Conservatism and the type of Southern mindset William is describing because Southerners make up the single largest and most recognizable voting bloc of that persuasion.


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03 May 2011, 1:10 am

techstepgenr8tion wrote:
marshall wrote:
I guess liberals are more likely to simply make fun of Islam instead of fantasizing about a "clash of civilizations" where the US ends up nuking millions of Muslims.

I was trying to walk marshall through this statement, he apparently went out for a bit and several other people including yourself and Will jumped in to replace him.

This is what I'm coming back to - the assertion that the conservative stance on foreign policy is inherently 'nuke em all' or that saying conservative and racist or xenophobe is reciprocally redundant. That's the core of what I'm finding a problem with here.

If we just lost track of the conversation somewhere - fine, we can drop it. If you additionally agree with what I quoted above though, lets get back on point and deal with that specifically.

I think people took my statement the wrong way. I wasn't trying to slam conservatives. I was actually defending against the accusation that liberals are "soft" on civil liberties issues when it comes to Islamic abuses. I was just sarcastically pointing out that anything short of "clash of civilizations" fear mongering and outright hatred isn't good enough to please some people. The OP just reminded me of other encounters with extreme islamophobes.



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03 May 2011, 6:47 am

marshall wrote:
I think people took my statement the wrong way. I wasn't trying to slam conservatives. I was actually defending against the accusation that liberals are "soft" on civil liberties issues when it comes to Islamic abuses. I was just sarcastically pointing out that anything short of "clash of civilizations" fear mongering and outright hatred isn't good enough to please some people. The OP just reminded me of other encounters with extreme islamophobes.

Thanks for the clarification. A bunch of other people tried to defend the literal value so we went in circles for a while.

BTW, if it were only 'making fun of' Islam rather than say doing something with regard to the 2001 incident or people handing off big resources to the associated organizations though - I agree, it would be soft. I don't know that this is what you're saying? I would think that most liberals would at least have been in favor or getting to Bin Laden?


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