Conservative or Liberal? (official poll)

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No. That is not the issue. The issue for me is the effect on the raising of children. Should same-sex marriage be legalized it is very likely that it will become "the norm" for children to be raised in same-sex households. I am not convinced that this will be a positive for society for a variety of reasons. First, yes, much of society is simply not prepared to accept it. However, another thing is I think it is insane to introduce the topic of sexuality to a young child which is going to happen in the public schools (various democratic state legislatures are already very friendly to proposals that would could make such education mandatory in the public schools, and also end up effecting interfering with the ability with adoptive parents to run their own households on the grounds that teaching the "wrong" message about homosexuality is the grounds for punishment).

In addition, men and women are different. They bring different skills to the table. I know many people deny this, but I think the ideal for a child is a two parent husband-wife home. Maybe I will be proved to be wrong. However, there is no proof that I am. By removing a tradition (possibly by court order) we are taking a rather large risk that we will cause a permanent effect on society that we cannot turn back.

Of course, every decision has rippling effects as well.

I realize that there are committed, and loving gay couples that are together. I also realize there committed gay couples with children. I have no interest in seizing those children or anything crazy like that. I am interested in the long term stability of the society. Perhaps I am wrong. I hope I am.

I need to take a break from this debate for a couple of days. I have gotten a bit more annoyed then I have wanted to get when making these arguments I think it is for the best.

I mean no offense, and I am sure you have have the best of intentions in what you all say.

Well, Jimservo.

Thanks for thinking I don't deserve a functioning Pancreas. Thanks for thinking that I should I have to careful monitor what I eat and have injections on a regular basis. Thanks for thinking I deserve to lose my limbs and go blind. Or worse - Die.

Thanks for condemning millions Type 1 diabetics to such painful lows just to save a non-sentient lifeform.

I'd love to see you oppose Stem Cell Research when it could cost you your own life.

I hope you see the faces of those you condemn to death every night when you go to sleep.

Because you are murderer, pure and simple.

Their ideas, not religions, and I ain't an automotan. Where's "thinking,rational, human being".

If my gaurdians were two gay people I would probably run away or kill myself as soon as I could.

Your comments are out of line.

Jimservo has murdered no one (that I know of.) He has simply taken a position on an issue that you happen to disagree with on a very personal level. He is entitled to his opinion. If anyone has condemned any to death, it is god. For that matter, we are all condemned to death.

I am confident that an intelligent and thoughtful aspie like yourself is able to attack a position without attacking people who hold that position. You're better than an NT politician.

Going back to the original topic, here's an organization that tries to expand the original conservative/liberal one-dimensional environment to two dimensions, with the positions represented as the points of a diamond:

http://www.theadvocates.org/quiz.html

Here's a FAQ on the US Libertarian Party:

http://www.lp.org/article_85.shtml

Positions on specific issues can be found here:

http://www.lp.org/issues/issues.shtml

You do deserve a functioning Pancreas... but not at the murder of an unborn child.

I would let go of my life to save a "non-sentient" life form.

I would never murder an unborn child to save my own life... that's the act of a coward.

I hope YOU have seen all the faces who could have lived, but were aborted.

Non-Sentient lifeforms have no rights in comparison to the sentient.

It's no different then killing a cow for beef.

Or killing a chicken.

We just happen to get organs out of the deal.

They never dream, never think. Therefore they lose nothing.

I on the other hand, have dreams and thoughts. I have intelligence, they don't.

Protecting what you already have is more important then making more it.

I was born just fine but at ten my Pancreas slowly shut off.

Do you know just how many years that cuts off my life expectancy?

Do you know I can lose limbs and my sight from this?

How do you justify that? That's a pretty sick statement.

Last edited by ahayes on 28 Jan 2007, 5:52 pm, edited 1 time in total.

You eat beef?

Yes

Your consuming a non-sentient lifeform to fulfill your selfish lusts by your logic.

Only way your logic works is if your a vegan who wouldn't allow ANY plant, animal or microorganism to come to harm.

Last edited by Flagg on 28 Jan 2007, 5:57 pm, edited 1 time in total.

You guys just have different dichotomies on what life is worth saving and what one is not.

But the cow actually gets to live, the case is not so with you. The cow also will never become sentient. The cow would not exist if it weren't for me to eat it.

Also, the plants that are cultivated would never have lived had they not been grown. I do not consume the entire plant and in most cases me using the plant for food in some way aids in the plants procreation.

Furthermore, I will harm microorganisms one way or another. By living I have an immune system that will kill pathogens. By dying I will destroy many microorganisms that rely on my body to live. After all is said and done, I will have had no choice but to do both.

Without the womb an embryo can never become sentient. This requires the services of another being.

Your argument rests on the fact a an embryo can grow on it's own. Which is a logic fallacy because it requires a host.

These cells haven't been programmed yet!

Without intervention from the host it never grows.

Besides, it's cheaper for society to treat someone once then to maintain for the rest of their lives.

Those cells originated IN the host.