The Influence of Ayn Rand on American Society...

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EtherealBallet
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07 Dec 2012, 9:00 pm

DarthMetaKnight wrote:

The Ancient Greeks told plenty of stories that promoted individualism - and they weren't homophobes like Rand.

Mythology or otherwise? Truly this is off topic, but would you give me some examples? I enjoy Greek Mythology.

Raptor
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07 Dec 2012, 9:03 pm

Kraichgauer wrote:

Raptor wrote:

Kraichgauer wrote:

DarthMetaKnight wrote:

I am totally aware of the fact that Ayn Rand did not consider herself a libertarian and I'm glad she rejected that label because she was homophobic.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Objectivism_and_homosexuality

Funny, Rand should be so anti-gay, and especially anti-lesbian, considering that haircut of hers...
:lol:

So all women with short hair are lesbians?
Nice generalization. :roll:

From the emoticon I used, I think it was obvious I was joking.

-Bill, otherwise known as Kraichgauer

I would have gotten a TOS. :shameonyou:

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Last edited by Raptor on 07 Dec 2012, 9:08 pm, edited 1 time in total.

DarthMetaKnight
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07 Dec 2012, 9:04 pm

EtherealBallet wrote:

DarthMetaKnight wrote:

The Ancient Greeks told plenty of stories that promoted individualism - and they weren't homophobes like Rand.

Mythology or otherwise? Truly this is off topic, but would you give me some examples? I enjoy Greek Mythology.

The Iliad has a very pro-individualist message. The protagonist - Achilles - is fighting in the against the Trojans in the Trojan war but he really just wants to become famous.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iliad

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EtherealBallet
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07 Dec 2012, 9:21 pm

DarthMetaKnight wrote:

EtherealBallet wrote:

DarthMetaKnight wrote:

The Ancient Greeks told plenty of stories that promoted individualism - and they weren't homophobes like Rand.

Mythology or otherwise? Truly this is off topic, but would you give me some examples? I enjoy Greek Mythology.

I have not read much of him :oops:

because of this thing I have where I focus on mostly one person or character. In Greek Mythology it was Athena so I only read of Athena's role in the war. I will see if I can find the poem to read. :study:

Greek Mythology did have a lot same-sex relationships in it correct? I have not read any with two women however.

DarthMetaKnight
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07 Dec 2012, 9:30 pm

EtherealBallet wrote:

Greek Mythology did have a lot same-sex relationships in it correct?

Yes
Achilles was in a homosexual relationship with Patroclus. Patroclus dies partway through the Iliad and Achilles falls apart emotionally. Achilles does, however get into relationships with women at other parts of the story. Achilles - like most Ancient Greek characters - was bisexual.

Quote:

I have not read any with two women however.

I do know about a certain real Ancient Greek woman who was famous for her homosexual activity.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sappho

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EtherealBallet
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07 Dec 2012, 9:45 pm

DarthMetaKnight wrote:

EtherealBallet wrote:

Greek Mythology did have a lot same-sex relationships in it correct?

Quote:

I have not read any with two women however.

I do know about a certain real Ancient Greek woman who was famous for her homosexual activity.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sappho

The word lesbian comes from where Sappho lived, right? Sapphist used to be used but I believe that term is now outdated and not to be used. I just read the page of her and the sparkling comments of her work as soon as I find time and can go to the library I will take out a book with her poems if any are to be found.

DarthMetaKnight
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07 Dec 2012, 10:07 pm

EtherealBallet wrote:

The word lesbian comes from where Sappho lived, right?

Yes

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lesbos

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ruveyn
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07 Dec 2012, 10:29 pm

One Greek city state where girl on girl sex happened was Sparta. The men stayed with their buddies in the barracks and married guys over 30 were obliged to make sons for the State so they snuck home to their wives for a quickie to plant the seed and then came back to the barracks. Spartan women were expected to exercise and stay in shape so they would bear healthy sons for the State. During their gym sessions there was fooling around between the women. It was not considered a sin in Sparta but the Athenians had all kinds of het-boy fantasies about Spartan women.

ruveyn

EtherealBallet
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07 Dec 2012, 11:20 pm

The post on Sparta is new information to me and interesting and I am glad to hear it. I am also glad to hear that I was correct on the word lesbian. I do rather like the sound of the word. The pictures of the island are lovely. I find it rather funny that an Ayn Rand discussion turned into one about homosexuality in ancient Greece.

Kraichgauer
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08 Dec 2012, 3:19 am

ruveyn wrote:

Tight bodied bi chicks - what's not to like?

-Bill, otherwise known as Kraichgauer

xenon13
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11 Dec 2012, 1:03 pm

Rand probably worked for the Narodnyi Kommissariat Vnuktrinikh Dyel.

ruveyn
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11 Dec 2012, 2:39 pm

xenon13 wrote:

Rand probably worked for the Narodnyi Kommissariat Vnuktrinikh Dyel.

Never. She left the Soviet Union early on (in the 1920's) and she never looked back except in disdain and dislike. She hated what Russia became under the Soviets.

What ever else might have been true about Rand, she hated communism and collectivism with every atom of her being.

As do I. The idea of subordinating one's own precious self and life to the idol of the State is an evil and disgusting idea.

ruveyn

visagrunt
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11 Dec 2012, 2:52 pm

ruveyn wrote:

As do I. The idea of subordinating one's own precious self and life to the idol of the State is an evil and disgusting idea.

ruveyn

You and Roy Cohn.

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ruveyn
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11 Dec 2012, 2:56 pm

visagrunt wrote:

ruveyn wrote:

As do I. The idea of subordinating one's own precious self and life to the idol of the State is an evil and disgusting idea.

ruveyn

You and Roy Cohn.

How so? Any self respecting human will not become a human sacrifice to the Greater Good. There is no such thing. The greatest good in my life is the good of myself and my children. You look after your good as best you can. I won't interfere.

ruveyn

visagrunt
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11 Dec 2012, 4:54 pm

ruveyn wrote:

Until you perceive that it interferes with your good, at which point you will act in your own immediate self-interest and, I suggest, thereby put your long term self-interest at risk. You cannot isolate yourself from the competition of other people all pursuing their own interests.

Your hyperbole in dismissing communism (a fatally flawed system) is uncritical. In that respect you are uncritical, biased and prejudicial--characteristics that you and Roy shared.

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ruveyn
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11 Dec 2012, 5:28 pm

visagrunt wrote:

ruveyn wrote:

The facts speak for themselves. Communism has never, ever worked. Not once.

Why? Human nature. People love themselves and their kids more than the love others and their kids. Very simple. Get used to it.

ruveyn

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