I guarantee you that every "violent" verse is take

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It doesn't matter what side I'm on. Criticisms need to be valid.

EXACTLY. Every time I try to logically debate with someone about Islam on other websites, people fabricate the craziest stories, baseless and devoid of facts, just to make Islam look bad, and when I try to argue and say those "facts" are incorrect, I get made fun of and sarcastically sneered at and made to look like an idiot. 1st website where I can actually debate about Islam without having to insult out of anger of complete and utter stupidity and ignorance. At least the people on this website actually know what they're saying rather than being bias and fabricating stories. I give credit to people who are fair minded and rational thinkers over brainwashed nutjobs who believe everything they hear.

Debate This bubbah. There is a big hole where the WTC used to stand. and over 3000 unarmed Americans died because some of your boys took the Q'ran literally.

ruveyn

Don't try that card on me, you're opening a can of worms if you know what I mean. You know Islam condemns such terrorism, it's not my fault a bunch of lunatics are crazy and don't think.

I must have completely dreamed the scenes of Palestinians literally dancing in the streets after 9/11 and the endless scenes of Islamist terrorism across the world that take place almost every single day and has done for many, many years.

But, of course, "Islam condemns such terrorism." That's it.

Even though it happens again, and again, and again, and a sizeable minority of young UK Muslims alone sympathise with these terrorists.

Pull the other one mate.

Don't sound cynical with me, you and I both know Islam would never allow such terrorism.

/discussion

Islam closes people's minds.

Islam and terrorism is a massive, very serious debate, yet you as a Muslim contribute nothing to it but blanket statements. "Islam condemns terrorism."

Even when Muslims pull out 'justificatory' quotes that are agreed with by a sizeable number of Muslims around the world.

Oh, and this is a respectable state of affairs is it?

A blind man had a slave-mother who used to abuse the Prophet and disparage him. He forbade her but she did not stop. He rebuked her but she did not give up her habit. One night she began to slander the Prophet and abuse him. So he took a dagger, placed it on her belly, pressed it, and killed her. A child who came between her legs was smeared with the blood that was there. When the morning came, the Prophet was informed about it.

He assembled the people and said: I adjure by Allah the man who has done this action and I adjure him by my right to him that he should stand up. Jumping over the necks of the people and trembling the man stood up.

He sat before the Prophet and said: Apostle of Allah! I am her master; she used to abuse you and disparage you. I forbade her, but she did not stop, and I rebuked her, but she did not abandon her habit. I have two sons like pearls from her, and she was my companion. Last night she began to abuse and disparage you. So I took a dagger, put it on her belly and pressed it till I killed her.

Thereupon the Prophet said: Oh be witness, no retaliation is payable for her blood.

Agree with that statement?

Lovely, lovely people.

Salad, you don't get to decide when the discussion ends.

How about the 72 virgins promised to anyone who becomes a martyr in the name of Islam (one wonders if the occasional women suicide bombers also get 72 virgins, and if so, what gender they are, and if they're male, what use is a male virgin who magically becomes a virgin again each time he has sex?).

What virgins? It's 72 grapes!

Or something like that.

I thought they were raisins? I'm sure I read somewhere that the actual translation was raisins or something equally stupid and not virgins.

I don't want a virgin; I'd rather have someone who knows what they're doing.

+1 for liberated women.

Have these idiots never heard of the local Tesco?

The sheer effrontery of it from the guy that lectures others on ignorance!

Tesco is not halal.

Don't tell me - it's because it was founded by a Jew.

It has been proposed that '72 dark-eyed houris' might actually be '72 white rasins,' but the change has not been universally embraced. Whether or not one accepts it seems to depend on the liberalness of one's islam (ie, the fundies still want their virgins).

One wonders if the fundamentalists are that far gone that they don't actually want to hear the real truth of Islam. i.e. If Muhammad and his story was widely discredited and much of it was in fact invented to further Arab imperialism, they'd probably be even more violent and insane over it because they'd have nothing left. You might then have a portion of Muslims, especially those living in more liberal Muslim and non-Muslim countries, that grow disillusioned with Islam because they realise that Islam would then be a lie and doesn't hold true even on the terms it has set for itself, and then you'd get the nutters and the fanatics believing a story about Muhammad the man that would be pure fantasy.

Just one more reason to support Islamic historians in their work and hopefully they will uncover evidence before the Islamists get the chance to destroy it (if any exists), brave souls that they are.