Why is the US against Assad?
Kraichgauer
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Joined: 12 Apr 2010
Gender: Male
Posts: 49,751
Location: Spokane area, Washington state.
15 Apr 2017, 3:27 pm
Jacoby wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
jrjones9933 wrote:
*hands Bill a mic and suggests that he drop it*
Thank you, thank you very much.
You two should get a room
Richard Spencer is more relevant to you two and people like you than anybody else
That's not what his rallies show. And when his mother had picked a fight with a Jewish civil rights leader at Whitefish, Montana, droves of Alt Right loons rushed to her defense on his behalf, demonizing the whole Jewish community there, and even showing a picture of one of their children, and all their phone numbers and addresses on the internet. Sounds like some pretty hardcore support for Spencer to me.
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-Bill, otherwise known as Kraichgauer
22 Apr 2017, 2:09 am
Jacoby wrote:
Chronos wrote:
Jacoby wrote:
Maybe the alt-right doesn't want to get stuck into another decades long cold war with an 'enemy' that isn't really an enemy? Obsessing about Russian interference has been a long tried and true deflection technique. If you can justify a relationship with Saudi Arabia and China then why not Russia? Russia and the US have many shared interests and together would make the world a much safer place, I have no interest in another 'great game' to be played like some do.
People brought up during that time seem to carry a lot of xenophobic prejudice against Russia, it's manipulation
People brought up during that time seem to carry a lot of xenophobic prejudice against Russia, it's manipulation
Understand that while the Russian people may be happy to have no tensions between their country and the US, Putin, being an ex-KGB agent who grew up in soviet Russia during the cold war, seems to continue to posses certain soviet perspectives on US/Russia relations. Namely, the idea that it is Russia that should be the foremost world power, and the US should not. This mentality means that Russia should not be completely trusted.
It goes both ways, if Russia is a FSB/KGB state then the US is a CIA one. There are a lot of people that don't want to have normal relations with Russia, there are a lot of people that want to continue to pressure and break apart Russia so it never can be put back together again. Intelligence agencies should never be trusted ever, they do not have the best interests of their people at heart. Textbook example of this is what these so called 'intelligence agencies' have done since Trump has been elected, the fact that we speak of a deep state in this country should be profoundly disturbing.
We should work with the Russians when we can, what is the danger of trusting them? It is the US that is the much more powerful nation so it shouldn't be the US who is scared.
What you're missing due to your pro Russia Bias, is it's a two way street. There's people in Russia (Putin) who don't want to work with the USA. You can't pin al, the bad relations solely on the USA. I'd like to see improved cooperation with Russia but as long as Putin lives he'll always be in charge and as long as he's in charge they'll never be any cooperation with the USA. How can you say people here have a Cold War mindset. It outin and ex KGB agent and all of Russia just forgot the Cold War, f**k ww2 was much long ago and Russians still hold s grudge against Germans, they won't soon be friendly with the USA.not unless we knell to them and follow their orders like a lap dog and I pray that never happens.
23 Apr 2017, 1:13 am
I swear whilst researching a while ago I read that Syria had three quarters of the billions of debt they owed the UoSSR written off in exchange for continued usage and potential expansion of the Tartus naval facility, I believe they are intending to expand it. Syria also buys most of its crap from russia, removing that tidy partnership alongside bypassing russia's monopoly on supplying energy to europe with the unsurprising pipeline free for all would hit them hard economically. There's theories that america have not been after eradicating isis at all just keeping the carnage going as long as possible whilst Putin wants anything not affiliated with apesh** Assad sterilized. I'd need to read a lot of hours on that to have any thoughts on it but it's interesting. Anyway on the coastal matter, Tartus is a warm water port opening onto the mediterranean which allows Putin's power projection to cast a long and menacing shadow across the underside of europe. The ocean is how you make everyone take notice, the faster you can be in an area of dispute ready to unload, the better for your credibility. The united states has I believe ten air craft carriers and an unfathomable number of overseas naval installations. Russia needs to keep hold of Tartus. There is another vital port in a little region called Crimea (Sevastapol) too you should note which has over 20,000 personnel stationed... the port which russia desperately desires to retain is just one intriguing layer of the conflict of course. What is going to happen if Assad is booted out and those ''moderate'' rebels topple Putin's man in the region? I doubt their ships are going to be welcome and it's back to relying on the arduous turkish strait route from the north to get down there. They aren't going to just sit back and meekly accept that their sphere of influence is going to be shattered by the current course of events, Syria is a place of unbelievable importance to them and it's not just some maniac they are siding with because they're a little naughty as some people want to believe as if it's a fairytale.
Fun fact, guess what is sitting not too far from the Syrian coast? The british royal air force overseas base of akrotiri on cyprus hehe.
23 Apr 2017, 1:41 am
sly279 wrote:
Jacoby wrote:
Chronos wrote:
Jacoby wrote:
Maybe the alt-right doesn't want to get stuck into another decades long cold war with an 'enemy' that isn't really an enemy? Obsessing about Russian interference has been a long tried and true deflection technique. If you can justify a relationship with Saudi Arabia and China then why not Russia? Russia and the US have many shared interests and together would make the world a much safer place, I have no interest in another 'great game' to be played like some do.
People brought up during that time seem to carry a lot of xenophobic prejudice against Russia, it's manipulation
People brought up during that time seem to carry a lot of xenophobic prejudice against Russia, it's manipulation
Understand that while the Russian people may be happy to have no tensions between their country and the US, Putin, being an ex-KGB agent who grew up in soviet Russia during the cold war, seems to continue to posses certain soviet perspectives on US/Russia relations. Namely, the idea that it is Russia that should be the foremost world power, and the US should not. This mentality means that Russia should not be completely trusted.
It goes both ways, if Russia is a FSB/KGB state then the US is a CIA one. There are a lot of people that don't want to have normal relations with Russia, there are a lot of people that want to continue to pressure and break apart Russia so it never can be put back together again. Intelligence agencies should never be trusted ever, they do not have the best interests of their people at heart. Textbook example of this is what these so called 'intelligence agencies' have done since Trump has been elected, the fact that we speak of a deep state in this country should be profoundly disturbing.
We should work with the Russians when we can, what is the danger of trusting them? It is the US that is the much more powerful nation so it shouldn't be the US who is scared.
What you're missing due to your pro Russia Bias, is it's a two way street. There's people in Russia (Putin) who don't want to work with the USA. You can't pin al, the bad relations solely on the USA. I'd like to see improved cooperation with Russia but as long as Putin lives he'll always be in charge and as long as he's in charge they'll never be any cooperation with the USA. How can you say people here have a Cold War mindset. It outin and ex KGB agent and all of Russia just forgot the Cold War, f**k ww2 was much long ago and Russians still hold s grudge against Germans, they won't soon be friendly with the USA.not unless we knell to them and follow their orders like a lap dog and I pray that never happens.
Why can't we work with Putin? The US is a much more powerful country than Russia and Russia knows this, I don't think they have an interest in picking a fight with us but they won't be bullied either. They don't want sanctions, they don't want proxy, they really don't want real war. The US and Russia have a lot of similarities and have some shared interests, I think we can work together and that the world would be a better place because of this. If believing this means I'm a Russophile or have a bias then so be it.
23 Apr 2017, 1:58 am
Jacoby wrote:
sly279 wrote:
Jacoby wrote:
Chronos wrote:
Jacoby wrote:
Maybe the alt-right doesn't want to get stuck into another decades long cold war with an 'enemy' that isn't really an enemy? Obsessing about Russian interference has been a long tried and true deflection technique. If you can justify a relationship with Saudi Arabia and China then why not Russia? Russia and the US have many shared interests and together would make the world a much safer place, I have no interest in another 'great game' to be played like some do.
People brought up during that time seem to carry a lot of xenophobic prejudice against Russia, it's manipulation
People brought up during that time seem to carry a lot of xenophobic prejudice against Russia, it's manipulation
Understand that while the Russian people may be happy to have no tensions between their country and the US, Putin, being an ex-KGB agent who grew up in soviet Russia during the cold war, seems to continue to posses certain soviet perspectives on US/Russia relations. Namely, the idea that it is Russia that should be the foremost world power, and the US should not. This mentality means that Russia should not be completely trusted.
It goes both ways, if Russia is a FSB/KGB state then the US is a CIA one. There are a lot of people that don't want to have normal relations with Russia, there are a lot of people that want to continue to pressure and break apart Russia so it never can be put back together again. Intelligence agencies should never be trusted ever, they do not have the best interests of their people at heart. Textbook example of this is what these so called 'intelligence agencies' have done since Trump has been elected, the fact that we speak of a deep state in this country should be profoundly disturbing.
We should work with the Russians when we can, what is the danger of trusting them? It is the US that is the much more powerful nation so it shouldn't be the US who is scared.
What you're missing due to your pro Russia Bias, is it's a two way street. There's people in Russia (Putin) who don't want to work with the USA. You can't pin al, the bad relations solely on the USA. I'd like to see improved cooperation with Russia but as long as Putin lives he'll always be in charge and as long as he's in charge they'll never be any cooperation with the USA. How can you say people here have a Cold War mindset. It outin and ex KGB agent and all of Russia just forgot the Cold War, f**k ww2 was much long ago and Russians still hold s grudge against Germans, they won't soon be friendly with the USA.not unless we knell to them and follow their orders like a lap dog and I pray that never happens.
Why can't we work with Putin? The US is a much more powerful country than Russia and Russia knows this, I don't think they have an interest in picking a fight with us but they won't be bullied either. They don't want sanctions, they don't want proxy, they really don't want real war. The US and Russia have a lot of similarities and have some shared interests, I think we can work together and that the world would be a better place because of this. If believing this means I'm a Russophile or have a bias then so be it.
Work with him, but understand, he will never be our friend, not because of us or anything we do, but because of him.
Kraichgauer
Veteran
Joined: 12 Apr 2010
Gender: Male
Posts: 49,751
Location: Spokane area, Washington state.
23 Apr 2017, 10:23 am
Jacoby wrote:
sly279 wrote:
Jacoby wrote:
Chronos wrote:
Jacoby wrote:
Maybe the alt-right doesn't want to get stuck into another decades long cold war with an 'enemy' that isn't really an enemy? Obsessing about Russian interference has been a long tried and true deflection technique. If you can justify a relationship with Saudi Arabia and China then why not Russia? Russia and the US have many shared interests and together would make the world a much safer place, I have no interest in another 'great game' to be played like some do.
People brought up during that time seem to carry a lot of xenophobic prejudice against Russia, it's manipulation
People brought up during that time seem to carry a lot of xenophobic prejudice against Russia, it's manipulation
Understand that while the Russian people may be happy to have no tensions between their country and the US, Putin, being an ex-KGB agent who grew up in soviet Russia during the cold war, seems to continue to posses certain soviet perspectives on US/Russia relations. Namely, the idea that it is Russia that should be the foremost world power, and the US should not. This mentality means that Russia should not be completely trusted.
It goes both ways, if Russia is a FSB/KGB state then the US is a CIA one. There are a lot of people that don't want to have normal relations with Russia, there are a lot of people that want to continue to pressure and break apart Russia so it never can be put back together again. Intelligence agencies should never be trusted ever, they do not have the best interests of their people at heart. Textbook example of this is what these so called 'intelligence agencies' have done since Trump has been elected, the fact that we speak of a deep state in this country should be profoundly disturbing.
We should work with the Russians when we can, what is the danger of trusting them? It is the US that is the much more powerful nation so it shouldn't be the US who is scared.
What you're missing due to your pro Russia Bias, is it's a two way street. There's people in Russia (Putin) who don't want to work with the USA. You can't pin al, the bad relations solely on the USA. I'd like to see improved cooperation with Russia but as long as Putin lives he'll always be in charge and as long as he's in charge they'll never be any cooperation with the USA. How can you say people here have a Cold War mindset. It outin and ex KGB agent and all of Russia just forgot the Cold War, f**k ww2 was much long ago and Russians still hold s grudge against Germans, they won't soon be friendly with the USA.not unless we knell to them and follow their orders like a lap dog and I pray that never happens.
Why can't we work with Putin? The US is a much more powerful country than Russia and Russia knows this, I don't think they have an interest in picking a fight with us but they won't be bullied either. They don't want sanctions, they don't want proxy, they really don't want real war. The US and Russia have a lot of similarities and have some shared interests, I think we can work together and that the world would be a better place because of this. If believing this means I'm a Russophile or have a bias then so be it.
Russia knows how much stronger we are in comparison to them. They don't want a military engagement with America, but there are other ways to wage war. The spymaster, Putin, wants to run America and other countries through manipulation by means of espionage and extortion. The FBI has recently come to the conclusion that the dossier by British intelligence that the Russians were holding Trump's "watersports" fetish over his head was in fact true. That, and how the Russians were infiltrating Trump's Presidential campaign was also true. Now, Putin is throwing his support behind the French racist candidate, Matien LaPenn, hoping to tear apart NATO.
_________________
-Bill, otherwise known as Kraichgauer
23 Apr 2017, 11:01 am
Run America to what ends? To not sanction them or to put troops on their borders? That's just rational self interest, what Russia wants is normalization of relations not war unlike the Cold Warriors still at the Pentagon and CIA who want to break their country into a tiny little pieces that could never be put together again. The US has cynically supported a lot of sectarian strife around the globe under the guise of humanitarianism, we've planted the seeds of ethnic nationalism and separatism as a means of weakening our perceived enemies rather than waging war. The Soviets did the same to us but we won out in the end, Russia is only a rump state of the previous Soviet empire. Do you think Putin wants to do to us what we did to the Soviet Union? Will being more antagonistic towards them accomplish anything to stop that?
No that 'dossier' is not legit Bill, did you actually read that ridiculous piece of fiction? I think if this election proved anything it is how ineffective and stupid our 'intelligence' agencies actually are. They are not all super powered spies capable of anything like they want you to believe, they're just professional ideologues or a vanguard if you will for the establishment. It's about what your opponent thinks you have not what is actually reality, the traditional means of control don't work any more however with the rise of the internet and the complete erosion of American's trust in the old mainstream media.
Kraichgauer
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Joined: 12 Apr 2010
Gender: Male
Posts: 49,751
Location: Spokane area, Washington state.
23 Apr 2017, 2:26 pm
Jacoby wrote:
Run America to what ends? To not sanction them or to put troops on their borders? That's just rational self interest, what Russia wants is normalization of relations not war unlike the Cold Warriors still at the Pentagon and CIA who want to break their country into a tiny little pieces that could never be put together again. The US has cynically supported a lot of sectarian strife around the globe under the guise of humanitarianism, we've planted the seeds of ethnic nationalism and separatism as a means of weakening our perceived enemies rather than waging war. The Soviets did the same to us but we won out in the end, Russia is only a rump state of the previous Soviet empire. Do you think Putin wants to do to us what we did to the Soviet Union? Will being more antagonistic towards them accomplish anything to stop that?
No that 'dossier' is not legit Bill, did you actually read that ridiculous piece of fiction? I think if this election proved anything it is how ineffective and stupid our 'intelligence' agencies actually are. They are not all super powered spies capable of anything like they want you to believe, they're just professional ideologues or a vanguard if you will for the establishment. It's about what your opponent thinks you have not what is actually reality, the traditional means of control don't work any more however with the rise of the internet and the complete erosion of American's trust in the old mainstream media.
No that 'dossier' is not legit Bill, did you actually read that ridiculous piece of fiction? I think if this election proved anything it is how ineffective and stupid our 'intelligence' agencies actually are. They are not all super powered spies capable of anything like they want you to believe, they're just professional ideologues or a vanguard if you will for the establishment. It's about what your opponent thinks you have not what is actually reality, the traditional means of control don't work any more however with the rise of the internet and the complete erosion of American's trust in the old mainstream media.
The ends Putin wants is to be able to rebuild the Russian Empire/Soviet Union, retaking all the former Republics, even though no one save the Russian colonists in those former republics want to return to Russian rule. What would life be like under Putin for Ukrainians, Belorussians, and the people of the Baltic States? They'd be lucky to be second class citizens, if that.
And how do you know that dossier is fake? Trump has admitted over and over how he's an adulterer, guilty at the very least of sexual harassment. Why shouldn't he have a fetish for "water sports"? And why wouldn't Putin make use of that to hold over Trump's head?
_________________
-Bill, otherwise known as Kraichgauer
23 Apr 2017, 3:17 pm
Do you seriously believe that Trump paid prostitutes to piss on a bed that the Obama's slept in months prior? Just read the thing and you'll understand how bogus it is, anybody who take a couple minutes instead of relying on reports from CNN would see this.
"Putin wants to rebuild the Soviet Union" is simply something that doesn't line up with the facts, it has been the US that has been provocative and encroaching closer & closer to Russia's borders not the other way around. Do you want to die for Estonia? I really couldn't care less about the outer fringes of NATO that have been provocatively expanded to include Warsaw Pact countries after promising not to expand NATO "one inch" east of Germany. Russia's actions over the years seem like rational justified responses.
Kraichgauer
Veteran
Joined: 12 Apr 2010
Gender: Male
Posts: 49,751
Location: Spokane area, Washington state.
23 Apr 2017, 7:29 pm
Jacoby wrote:
Do you seriously believe that Trump paid prostitutes to piss on a bed that the Obama's slept in months prior? Just read the thing and you'll understand how bogus it is, anybody who take a couple minutes instead of relying on reports from CNN would see this.
"Putin wants to rebuild the Soviet Union" is simply something that doesn't line up with the facts, it has been the US that has been provocative and encroaching closer & closer to Russia's borders not the other way around. Do you want to die for Estonia? I really couldn't care less about the outer fringes of NATO that have been provocatively expanded to include Warsaw Pact countries after promising not to expand NATO "one inch" east of Germany. Russia's actions over the years seem like rational justified responses.
"Putin wants to rebuild the Soviet Union" is simply something that doesn't line up with the facts, it has been the US that has been provocative and encroaching closer & closer to Russia's borders not the other way around. Do you want to die for Estonia? I really couldn't care less about the outer fringes of NATO that have been provocatively expanded to include Warsaw Pact countries after promising not to expand NATO "one inch" east of Germany. Russia's actions over the years seem like rational justified responses.
Wait a minute; I'm talking about Trump getting his golden shower jollies over in Moscow, not in the White House! How else could Putin get him on film?
As for Estonia - - that very well might be the line in the sand for us. Who's to say Putin would stop once he gobbled back up the lost Soviet Republics?
_________________
-Bill, otherwise known as Kraichgauer
23 Apr 2017, 8:02 pm
Kraichgauer wrote:
Jacoby wrote:
Do you seriously believe that Trump paid prostitutes to piss on a bed that the Obama's slept in months prior? Just read the thing and you'll understand how bogus it is, anybody who take a couple minutes instead of relying on reports from CNN would see this.
"Putin wants to rebuild the Soviet Union" is simply something that doesn't line up with the facts, it has been the US that has been provocative and encroaching closer & closer to Russia's borders not the other way around. Do you want to die for Estonia? I really couldn't care less about the outer fringes of NATO that have been provocatively expanded to include Warsaw Pact countries after promising not to expand NATO "one inch" east of Germany. Russia's actions over the years seem like rational justified responses.
"Putin wants to rebuild the Soviet Union" is simply something that doesn't line up with the facts, it has been the US that has been provocative and encroaching closer & closer to Russia's borders not the other way around. Do you want to die for Estonia? I really couldn't care less about the outer fringes of NATO that have been provocatively expanded to include Warsaw Pact countries after promising not to expand NATO "one inch" east of Germany. Russia's actions over the years seem like rational justified responses.
Wait a minute; I'm talking about Trump getting his golden shower jollies over in Moscow, not in the White House! How else could Putin get him on film?
As for Estonia - - that very well might be the line in the sand for us. Who's to say Putin would stop once he gobbled back up the lost Soviet Republics?
Also that is literally what the dossier said, that Trump paid prostitutes to piss in a bed Obama slept in because he thought it was funny apparently. It's bizarre to the point that it's not even worth talking about. It's just straight up lies.
Kraichgauer
Veteran
Joined: 12 Apr 2010
Gender: Male
Posts: 49,751
Location: Spokane area, Washington state.
23 Apr 2017, 8:11 pm
Jacoby wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
Jacoby wrote:
Do you seriously believe that Trump paid prostitutes to piss on a bed that the Obama's slept in months prior? Just read the thing and you'll understand how bogus it is, anybody who take a couple minutes instead of relying on reports from CNN would see this.
"Putin wants to rebuild the Soviet Union" is simply something that doesn't line up with the facts, it has been the US that has been provocative and encroaching closer & closer to Russia's borders not the other way around. Do you want to die for Estonia? I really couldn't care less about the outer fringes of NATO that have been provocatively expanded to include Warsaw Pact countries after promising not to expand NATO "one inch" east of Germany. Russia's actions over the years seem like rational justified responses.
"Putin wants to rebuild the Soviet Union" is simply something that doesn't line up with the facts, it has been the US that has been provocative and encroaching closer & closer to Russia's borders not the other way around. Do you want to die for Estonia? I really couldn't care less about the outer fringes of NATO that have been provocatively expanded to include Warsaw Pact countries after promising not to expand NATO "one inch" east of Germany. Russia's actions over the years seem like rational justified responses.
Wait a minute; I'm talking about Trump getting his golden shower jollies over in Moscow, not in the White House! How else could Putin get him on film?
As for Estonia - - that very well might be the line in the sand for us. Who's to say Putin would stop once he gobbled back up the lost Soviet Republics?
Also that is literally what the dossier said, that Trump paid prostitutes to piss in a bed Obama slept in because he thought it was funny apparently. It's bizarre to the point that it's not even worth talking about. It's just straight up lies.
Kinda like it's not worth talking about a pedophile cult involving the Clintons and Lady GaGa out of a pizza shop, or that Obama had spied on Trump.
If Putin wants to gobble up the former Soviet Republics, then he's expansionist.
_________________
-Bill, otherwise known as Kraichgauer
