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Bataar
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26 Feb 2021, 12:35 pm

Fnord wrote:
Bataar wrote:
Who defines what constitutes hate and bigotry?
Merriam-Webster's Dictionary defines "hate" this way:

(a) intense hostility and aversion usually deriving from fear, anger, or sense of injury; (b) extreme dislike or disgust : antipathy, loathing; (c) a systematic and especially politically exploited expression of hatred.

It also defines "bigotry" this way:

(a) obstinate or intolerant devotion to one's own opinions and prejudices : the state of mind of a bigot

Does that answer your question, or were you about to present your own subjective definitions?

No, those definitions work for me. Now explain why Gina Carano was canceled as she clearly expressed no hate or bigotry in her comment.

And clearly, by that definition, most, if not all woke folk are bigots.



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26 Feb 2021, 12:43 pm

Bataar wrote:
Fnord wrote:
Bataar wrote:
Who defines what constitutes hate and bigotry?
Merriam-Webster's Dictionary defines "hate" this way:

(a) intense hostility and aversion usually deriving from fear, anger, or sense of injury; (b) extreme dislike or disgust : antipathy, loathing; (c) a systematic and especially politically exploited expression of hatred.

It also defines "bigotry" this way:

(a) obstinate or intolerant devotion to one's own opinions and prejudices : the state of mind of a bigot

Does that answer your question, or were you about to present your own subjective definitions?

No, those definitions work for me. Now explain why Gina Carano was canceled as she clearly expressed no hate or bigotry in her comment.
You would be better off to pose that question to DisneyCo, unless you just want to start an argument here.
Bataar wrote:
And clearly, by that definition, most, if not all woke folk are bigots.
And clearly, that is your personal opinion; nothing more.


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Bataar
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26 Feb 2021, 12:46 pm

Fnord wrote:
Bataar wrote:
Fnord wrote:
Bataar wrote:
Who defines what constitutes hate and bigotry?
Merriam-Webster's Dictionary defines "hate" this way:

(a) intense hostility and aversion usually deriving from fear, anger, or sense of injury; (b) extreme dislike or disgust : antipathy, loathing; (c) a systematic and especially politically exploited expression of hatred.

It also defines "bigotry" this way:

(a) obstinate or intolerant devotion to one's own opinions and prejudices : the state of mind of a bigot

Does that answer your question, or were you about to present your own subjective definitions?

No, those definitions work for me. Now explain why Gina Carano was canceled as she clearly expressed no hate or bigotry in her comment.
You would be better off to pose that question to DisneyCo, unless you just want to start an argument here.
Bataar wrote:
And clearly, by that definition, most, if not all woke folk are bigots.
And clearly, that is your personal opinion; nothing more.

Are you denying that you as well as most of the leftists on this board show an intolerant devotion to your own opinions and prejudices?



Fnord
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26 Feb 2021, 12:49 pm

Bataar wrote:
Fnord wrote:
Bataar wrote:
Fnord wrote:
Bataar wrote:
Who defines what constitutes hate and bigotry?
Merriam-Webster's Dictionary defines "hate" this way:

(a) intense hostility and aversion usually deriving from fear, anger, or sense of injury; (b) extreme dislike or disgust : antipathy, loathing; (c) a systematic and especially politically exploited expression of hatred.

It also defines "bigotry" this way:

(a) obstinate or intolerant devotion to one's own opinions and prejudices : the state of mind of a bigot

Does that answer your question, or were you about to present your own subjective definitions?
No, those definitions work for me. Now explain why Gina Carano was canceled as she clearly expressed no hate or bigotry in her comment.
You would be better off to pose that question to DisneyCo, unless you just want to start an argument here.
Bataar wrote:
And clearly, by that definition, most, if not all woke folk are bigots.
And clearly, that is your personal opinion; nothing more.
Are you denying that you as well as most of the leftists on this board show an intolerant devotion to your own opinions and prejudices?
Are you trolling for an argument?


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Bradleigh
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26 Feb 2021, 4:42 pm

Bataar wrote:
Are you denying that you as well as most of the leftists on this board show an intolerant devotion to your own opinions and prejudices?


I kind of think this might include me. But I hold no prejudices against anyone, I don't care about their race, sex, gender, age, religion or nationality, and won't mock them for it.

I am intolerant of intolerance, but that itself is not actually intolerance. Is it intolerance to not support someone if they wanted to be a Nazi? Someone does not become a bigot because they do not stand for things that are essentially discrimination, that is backwards thinking.


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09 Mar 2021, 4:00 pm

New Nonpartisan Faculty Group Will Promote and Defend Free Speech, Academic Freedom

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Two hundred professors launched the nonpartisan Academic Freedom Alliance this week to advocate for free speech in academe and, in some cases, legally defend professors’ academic freedom. Members include Cornel West, Robert P. George, Jeannie Suk Gersen, Jay Parini and Claire Potter. Membership is currently by invitation only, but the group plans on opening up to all academics.

“The AFA will provide strength in numbers for its members,” physicist Shivaji Sondhi of Princeton University said in a statement. “As membership continues to expand, administrators will have to think twice before baselessly censuring or terminating an employee.”

Keith E. Whittington, William Nelson Cromwell Professor of Politics at Princeton, and chair of the AFA’s Academic Committee, in an interview said that the group’s makeup -- which spans the ideological spectrum -- is key to promoting free speech and academic freedom.

“There are people on university campuses as well as off university campuses who are not very committed to those principles and would like to see them significantly modified or changed,” Whittington said. “I think it's important that we be able to talk across some of these divides in order to convey the real sense that there's a sense of shared threat here. I do think it's true that those on the right and those on the left can easily imagine that they're the only ones being threatened.”


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09 Mar 2021, 7:39 pm

:chin:

Why, exactly, is anyone "fighting back," against anti-racism & anti-bullying/bigotry? :? What kinds of people are against anti-racism or anti-homophobia? :chin:


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binstein
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09 Mar 2021, 7:54 pm

Fnord wrote:
It is that the "Cancel Culture" is insidious, and has infiltrated not only the media, but all facets of the political and religious landscapes, as well.

Being "woke" was originally about understanding the hassles endured by people of other races and cultures, and accepting those people's stated hardships as valid.  Than along came the "Cancel Culture", which twists everything it touches into an effort to actively silence anyone who disagrees.

Think about it ... if you step back and examine every identifiable movement, you will eventually see how that culture has mutated from a "Let us self-advocate" culture to a "Let us get everybody else to STFU" culture.

Republicans, Democrats, Catholicism, Judaism ... it seems that every identifiable culture has been infected with the "Cancel Culture" virus.[/color]

And this is what I call Irony.



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15 Mar 2021, 10:26 am

Image


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Tim_Tex
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15 Mar 2021, 10:39 am

Fnord wrote:
Many peasant rebellions have either failed or achieved unexpected results.  Only the successful ones are lauded -- the Amistad and Caine mutinies, for example.


What about the Niedermayer mutiny in ‘Nam?


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Fnord
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15 Mar 2021, 10:51 am

Tim_Tex wrote:
Fnord wrote:
Many peasant rebellions have either failed or achieved unexpected results.  Only the successful ones are lauded -- the Amistad and Caine mutinies, for example.
What about the Niedermayer mutiny in ‘Nam?
What about it?  Was it directly responsible for America's defeat in Vietnam, or was it only a contributing factor?

Did it happen as reported by the AP, or did the AP exaggerate and "journalize" the events to make for a more compelling story?

Are the eye-witness accounts of those who were actually present all lies, or were they the only ones telling the truth?

We may never know what really happened.


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kraftiekortie
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15 Mar 2021, 10:51 am

Being a peasant is not something that anybody would aspire to.

Peasants want to stop being peasants. inevitably, they will rebel. They might not even care if they are successful. It's all in the aspiration to get out of being a peasant, somehow, some way.



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15 Mar 2021, 11:26 am

ASPartOfMe wrote:
goldfish21 wrote:
So, basically, not only are you autistically against change to the max, but also you really just hate the idea of young people making progressive societal improvements that create better balance and equality in power dynamics by ethnic or minority group. Got it. Woke = baaaaadddd.. especially since it involves being nice to people that are different than you.

Woke is the opposite of nice, it is about cancelling people, confronting people, making people “uncomfortable” 24/7 for the purpose of exhausting people that disagree with them.

It is about being against the goal of colorblindness.

You are right in that me being autistic very much informs my opposition to woke but not for the reasons you think.

Woke emphasizes intersectionality. In and of itself the idea is not wrong. The more minority groups you belong to the more chances you will be at a disadvantage and discriminated against. But it is turning into your groups completely define you and instead of being a part of who you are.

This groupcentric world view is a key to understanding my opposition. While I identify as autistic there is that expression “if you have met one autistic you have met one autistic”. Allowing individuality is important. Many autistics such as me thrive better and are happier by ourselves.

As an autistic why would I want to err on the side of free expression for ableists, why would I want to allow their hate speech? Woke is for minorities, why would I be against that? It is precisely to because I am a member of this very small minority. For the most part the wokes have stayed away from autism concentrating on racial, sexuality, and gender issues. Eventually they will get around to us and I don’t think that will be a good thing. Wokes love diversity when it is diversity they like and if you don’t agree conform, conform and Autistics are often non conformists and as such may very well be viewed as a hate group that needs canceling. Advocate for not curing a disease that makes peoples lives miserable and kills them, that is hate speech. I can envision Autistics literalness and lack of understanding of euphemisms being misunderstood as hate. It has already happened a few times.


Uh no, autistic people are not going to refuse to conform when they are also for diversity and ending racism and implicit bias in the work force. Unless they are bigots of course and want to keep their white privilege. Don't use autism as an excuse for bigotry.


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Tim_Tex
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15 Mar 2021, 11:38 am

Fnord wrote:
Tim_Tex wrote:
Fnord wrote:
Many peasant rebellions have either failed or achieved unexpected results.  Only the successful ones are lauded -- the Amistad and Caine mutinies, for example.
What about the Niedermayer mutiny in ‘Nam?
What about it?  Was it directly responsible for America's defeat in Vietnam, or was it only a contributing factor?

Did it happen as reported by the AP, or did the AP exaggerate and "journalize" the events to make for a more compelling story?

Are the eye-witness accounts of those who were actually present all lies, or were they the only ones telling the truth?

We may never know what really happened.


Niedermayer was the leader of the Omegas in Animal House. The mutiny part was from the end of the movie, where the captions showed the fate of the characters.


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Fnord
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15 Mar 2021, 12:10 pm

Tim_Tex wrote:
Fnord wrote:
Tim_Tex wrote:
Fnord wrote:
Many peasant rebellions have either failed or achieved unexpected results.  Only the successful ones are lauded -- the Amistad and Caine mutinies, for example.
What about the Niedermayer mutiny in ‘Nam?
What about it?  Was it directly responsible for America's defeat in Vietnam, or was it only a contributing factor?  Did it happen as reported by the AP, or did the AP exaggerate and "journalize" the events to make for a more compelling story?  Are the eye-witness accounts of those who were actually present all lies, or were they the only ones telling the truth?  We may never know what really happened.
Niedermayer was the leader of the Omegas in Animal House. The mutiny part was from the end of the movie, where the captions showed the fate of the characters.
LOL!! :lol: :lol: :lol:

I googled "Niedermayer revolt in Vietnam" and got some story about a platoon of soldiers refusing to follow orders, and some lieutenant getting "fragged".

Then I googled "Niedermayer animal house" and got...
Quote:
Mark Metcalf (born March 11, 1946) is an American television and film actor often identified as playing the role of antagonistic and aggrieved authority figure.  He is best known for his role as sadistic ROTC officer Douglas C. Neidermeyer in the 1978 American comedy film Animal House, a character he later emulated in the 1984 music videos for the songs "We're Not Gonna Take It" and "I Wanna Rock" by the heavy metal band Twisted Sister.

:lol:

Curiously, there was this blurb at the end of "Animal House": DOUGLAS C. NEIDERMEYER -- KILLED IN VIETNAM BY HIS OWN TROOPS


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ASPartOfMe
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15 Mar 2021, 3:49 pm

League_Girl wrote:
ASPartOfMe wrote:
goldfish21 wrote:
So, basically, not only are you autistically against change to the max, but also you really just hate the idea of young people making progressive societal improvements that create better balance and equality in power dynamics by ethnic or minority group. Got it. Woke = baaaaadddd.. especially since it involves being nice to people that are different than you.

Woke is the opposite of nice, it is about cancelling people, confronting people, making people “uncomfortable” 24/7 for the purpose of exhausting people that disagree with them.

It is about being against the goal of colorblindness.

You are right in that me being autistic very much informs my opposition to woke but not for the reasons you think.

Woke emphasizes intersectionality. In and of itself the idea is not wrong. The more minority groups you belong to the more chances you will be at a disadvantage and discriminated against. But it is turning into your groups completely define you and instead of being a part of who you are.

This groupcentric world view is a key to understanding my opposition. While I identify as autistic there is that expression “if you have met one autistic you have met one autistic”. Allowing individuality is important. Many autistics such as me thrive better and are happier by ourselves.

As an autistic why would I want to err on the side of free expression for ableists, why would I want to allow their hate speech? Woke is for minorities, why would I be against that? It is precisely to because I am a member of this very small minority. For the most part the wokes have stayed away from autism concentrating on racial, sexuality, and gender issues. Eventually they will get around to us and I don’t think that will be a good thing. Wokes love diversity when it is diversity they like and if you don’t agree conform, conform and Autistics are often non conformists and as such may very well be viewed as a hate group that needs canceling. Advocate for not curing a disease that makes peoples lives miserable and kills them, that is hate speech. I can envision Autistics literalness and lack of understanding of euphemisms being misunderstood as hate. It has already happened a few times.


Uh no, autistic people are not going to refuse to conform when they are also for diversity and ending racism and implicit bias in the work force. Unless they are bigots of course and want to keep their white privilege. Don't use autism as an excuse for bigotry.

Give us some credit. If we think for ourselves even progressive autistics are not going to agree with everything in the woke agenda and that will be a problem in a conformist atmosphere. Also, a problem is a literal and blunt language we use which could be a problem for wokes who often use euphemisms to both lesson offense and make radical or revolutionary change seem like reform.


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