white slaves

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Historically in the USA whites have gained while black Americans and Native Americans have suffered. That's undoubtedly true.

The rules of nature still hold though. Peoples differ, and they compete. White Americans who gain some sort of feeling of redemption from celebrating their impending minority status are being naive, IMHO.

If the WASP elite in the US looked after the interests of their own kin, as the founding fathers did, they would not be doing what they're doing.

Your information about the USA is false. This country was started by whites, but people arleady lived here,a nd people were brought here starting from the 1600s to build an entire economy on their labor. This country is just as much mine as it is my friend whose European family came here in the 1800s and mine who has been here since the 1700s (and before since I am also part american indian). ThE usa is different than europe. I can see where you are coming from from British/European standpoint, but this country is not surrounded by white countries. Ths\is country is surrounded by people of all colors who have all contributed, no matter what any outdated textbook says.. The southern border was originally inhabitied by Mexicans, than Americans (with both blacks and Mexicans whites fighting on the same side) won a war and the southern states were annexed with the original mexicans living there becoming american citizens. This country was not built by whites only. To say so would be to undermine generations that have lived here and made lives and successes of themselves for centuries.

People compete, but I've seen differently. It may shock you but I've actually seen people become good friends, and perhaps help eachother out once and a while.


I dont buy into the notion that this world is only a giant Darwinian experiment. Poeple arent as brutal and as cruel and calculating as you suspect. But if you want to be with your own kind, or stop your homeland from becoming too different, that's fine and that's natural. But I dont buy into the idea that people who are friends are going against nature and that we are constantly competing. The only thing I am sure of is that we are definitely dying, and what difference is this going to make in 1000 years when an asteroid hits the earth and there's no history left to fight over. What a futile fight. Oh well.

Codoroc, I asked you to give me an example. I didn't ask you to attack me for who I am as a person. Your last paragraph rubs me the wrong way. What is the problem with you and others like you who can't have a conversation on this board without insulting someone?

I don't see things the way you do. And, America was not built by Whites. America was built from the slave labor of African Americans, Native American Indians and our railroads were built by Chinese immigrants. And, our Constitution created by those "White Men" says it welcomes people with open arms. The problem today is that most people don't want to go through the proper channels.

I don't like America's immigration policy either. I think it lets Mexico off the hook for not caring for its own citizens while American taxpayers foot the bill. But, I am not racist against Mexicans because I don't like that policy, nor do I fear the extinction of wh***y.

My wife used to live in London and we've spent a lot of time there. What I do know is that many Britons resent Indians (from India) because they "steal" the high-powered jobs in banking, medicine and are entrepreneurial. They are very successul and we've heard Whites hate that. This is racist jealous...people disliking another race because they're successful. I don't go for that!

Being a Conservative does not make me a racist bigot, no matter how firm I stand on political issues. And, if you see some of my threads where I'm talking about problems in the AA community, you can see I'm pretty firm. But, that doesn't mean I hate them for the color of their skin. And by the way, most AAs here are legal not immigrants.

I am one of the WASP elite and am looking after my own kin. My family is well provided for, thank you for asking.

Before slavery of african americans actually many people were ensalved regarddless of their race or background, it was jsut what people did. This i no way minimizes how horrible slavery was for the many africans who were brought here on ships.

Some of the worst prejudice of the 19th and 20th century, including lynchings and race riots, was directed against Irish and Italians.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mass_racia ... ted_States

Now, just about everyone celebrates St Patrick's Day, whether or not they're either Irish or Catholic, and pizza and spaghetti have become staples of the American diet.

But, some of you might find this article interesting:

http://query.nytimes.com/mem/archive-fr ... oref=login

One of the arguments against extending slavery to the Western states of the USA was that the presence of slaves would increase amalgamation between blacks and whites, which some people considered bad.

I totally agree with you. Slavery is slavery, no matter who the victim or what color they are. It was terrible what blacks had to go through. And I'm not making any excuses for what my forefathers did. My point was merely to show a different side of slavery and racism, to counter overly-PC people who wanna think that it's as simple as blaming everything on white males. Also, to show that whites have more in common with blacks than people realize, where slavery is concerned....
Slavery was never really about race, when you look at the big picture, it's always been about power and control. Whites have owned whites, whites have owned blacks, blacks have owned and still do own blacks in Africa, arabs owned whites and blacks. Arabs were actually the most brutal slave owners of all the races.
Even today, slavery still goes on, human trafficking, where women and children are snatched off the sidewalk and forced into prostitution and slavery, and are being raped multiple times on a daily basis.... I personally consider sweat shops slavery, I mean yeah they choose to work there but it's not like they've got a lot of choice though. They've got to feed their families.

One of my favourite Mark Twain books, Puddin'head Wilson, deals with two babies, born the same day to the same father. One baby is from his white wife, and the other from his slave (who is also white, but considered "mulatto"). His wife dies shortly after giving birth. The slave woman, who is left caring for both babies, switches their identities, so that her own son could enjoy the priviledges of being White and free.

http://etext.virginia.edu/railton/wilson/pwhompg.html

The Homer Plessy case was an interesting one:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Homer_Plessy

At the start of the civil war, the majority of the residents of a number of southern states were slaves. Today, Whites are the majority in all of the states (including the Southern states).

So, what happened? Did most of the southern Blacks emigrate from the South after the Civil War? Or, did large numbers eventually adopt White identities?

The largest enslavement of whites on a historically signifigant scale was done NOT at the hands of the Arabs, but by the Turks,Mongols, and Tatars. It started with the Mongol invasion but with the rise of the Golden Horde in central asia the demand for slaves was very big. Many slaves were brought to central asia from nothern india but when Russia was under the "mongol yoke" the Tatars and Mongols frequently raided settlements and carted off Eastern Europeans who were then sold into slavery within the central asian Khanates. This practice was continued by the Ottomans and was eventually abolished in the 19th century.

Here is an interesting contemporary review of Mark Twain's Puddin' Head Wilson:

http://etext.virginia.edu/railton/wilson/pwsouthn.html

The writer is obviously offended by the book. She considers it to be false, and an insult to Southerners.

She takes issue with quite a lot of Mark Twain's observations, even going almost so far as to characterize slave owners as being kind and affectionate to their slaves. However, it is quite notable that one issue with which she takes no quarrel is the practice of slave owners to father their own slaves.

The author claims that slave mammies would have been as brutal to their masters' children as to slave children, which makes me wonder whether the review might in fact have been a spoof, possibly written by Mark Twain himself, in order to increase interest in (and sales of) his book.

I haven't read the Puddin'tain book, but you've aroused my curiosity. I did read something less historical, but very good about passing. "The Human Stain" by Phillip Roth. It was made into a movie with Anthony Hopkins and Nicole Kidman. Hopkins was a respected White professor accused of racism, when all the while he was actually African American passing for White, but nobody knew it.

I think after the Civil War people got by the best way they could and if that meant passing, they probably did it. It was survival. If my memory serves me right, that Halle Berry movie called "Queen" was about her passing for white after the Civil War.

What about the Roman Empire? If you add on medieval and Rennaissance Europe and the Nazis afterwards, and the Greeks beforehand, surely the vast majority of European slaves have been enslaved by Europeans.

Well this is true. Whites have probably enslaved more whites than anyone, and to be honest blacks have probably enslaved more blacks than anyone too (because theyr still enslaving their own people today in Africa)..... Slavery is slavery, no matter who is the victim, no matter who is the assailant. Slavery is not about race so much as it is about alienating unalienable human rights.
My main point in this thread though, more than discussing slavery, was to counter the PC "hate wh***y" mentality here by showing an instance where whites were oppressed by another race... We're we were the victims.
"This is most obnoxious part about being white. But its important to understand that this "expertise" is based on white peoples own self-hatred.

White people are so ignorant of history they actually believe that they’re the only people in history ever to have "oppressed" other people. They are also totally convinced that no people have ever "oppressed" white people.

The invasions and untold slaughters into Europe by the Mongols, Moors, Arabs, Turks, Huns, and other assorted Asian or North African peoples is one big blank of history. Even more comical is the idea that places like "the New World" were like great big Grateful Dead concerts before Europeans arrived. Never mind the Aztecs wiping out the Incas or sacrificing over 20,000 babies so the sun would rise in the morning, white people don’t want to hear it.

Don’t tell a white person that the Arab slave trade consumed 10 times more black Africans compared to their own slave trade as the white will explain that the Arabs treated their slaves much better. And NEVER bring up the fact to a white person that the Muslims also enslaved an untold number of white slaves out of Europe during the "Dark Ages."

This is a form of White supremacism that is very misunderstood. Its basically telling the world "well, we expect you to slaughter, invade, colonize people but we’re white, so its very bad if we do it and not so much if you do." Its basically telling the world that their a bunch of animals, who of course act like animals but only whites should be held accountable because they’re white (Read: Human).

The reason whites become "experts" in other cultures is to suppress the hate they feel towards their own feelings of superiority. It sounds confusing but its kind of like letting your little niece win in checkers to make her feel good and afterwords feeling bad about it. A white person must never show any positive feelings towards anything accomplished by a white person but must always point out that when a non-white accomplishes something that they were the "first" fill-in-the-blank to do so. At the same time, if a white person accomplishes something its for "humanity" or for "mankind." To you non-whites reading this, I know this must sound confusing as hell but we’re a very strange people.

On one hand, I think it might be good if white people developed a racial identity, a white culture.... But, I wouldn't wanna see it being ran by racist KKK scum or Neo Nazi a**holes. That isn't how I would want a white culture to come off. I'd rather send a different message, "hey, we can be proud of our heritage without being racist, and we can co-operate and co-exist with other races, all of whom are equal to our own, in a team effort".
On the other hand, I think it would just add more division, more white racism. More group think, more ignorance......
I dunno, maybe the answer is to stop caring about race, one way or the other, and for people to let go of any feelings tied to race.... Maybe we just need to get to a point where we don't see it. We're neither proud nor ashamed, reguardless of what color we are.... But that's a long ways from happening.