My question for atheists.

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snapcap
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29 May 2012, 12:57 pm

ruveyn wrote:

snapcap wrote:

Atheism is just another belief people hold depending on their life experiences.

Actually it is the lack of a certain belief.

Atheism, as such, is a negative thing.

ruveyn

If that was true, then there would be no difference between rocks and atheists.

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ruveyn
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29 May 2012, 12:59 pm

snapcap wrote:

If that was true, then there would be no difference between rocks and atheists.

I said the lack of a certain belief (belief in the existence of god) not the lack of any belief.

ruveyn

snapcap
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29 May 2012, 1:05 pm

ruveyn wrote:

snapcap wrote:

If that was true, then there would be no difference between rocks and atheists.

I said the lack of a certain belief (belief in the existence of god) not the lack of any belief.

ruveyn

It's kind of misleading, because anything could be said to have a lack of a certain belief. What meaning is there in that?

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Rainy
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29 May 2012, 2:06 pm

snapcap wrote:

ruveyn wrote:

snapcap wrote:

If that was true, then there would be no difference between rocks and atheists.

I said the lack of a certain belief (belief in the existence of god) not the lack of any belief.

ruveyn

It's kind of misleading, because anything could be said to have a lack of a certain belief. What meaning is there in that?

An atheist is also a human. And not an infant.

I suggest considering atheism a disbelief, and non-religious to describe no beliefs.

snapcap
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29 May 2012, 2:11 pm

Rainy wrote:

snapcap wrote:

ruveyn wrote:

snapcap wrote:

If that was true, then there would be no difference between rocks and atheists.

I said the lack of a certain belief (belief in the existence of god) not the lack of any belief.

ruveyn

It's kind of misleading, because anything could be said to have a lack of a certain belief. What meaning is there in that?

An atheist is also a human. And not an infant.

I suggest considering atheism a disbelief, and non-religious to describe no beliefs.

I think the definition "the belief that God doesn't exist" is the best answer here.

I get the feeling that definitions that wander away from that is just an attempt for atheists to distance themselves from theists...

In an imaginary way!

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ruveyn
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29 May 2012, 6:00 pm

snapcap wrote:

I think the definition "the belief that God doesn't exist" is the best answer here.

Not to be confused with the disbelief that God does exist.

ruveyn

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29 May 2012, 7:53 pm

ruveyn wrote:

snapcap wrote:

I think the definition "the belief that God doesn't exist" is the best answer here.

Not to be confused with the disbelief that God does exist.

ruveyn

Saying atheism is the disbelief that God does exists leaves out what the atheist does believe, and they do believe something regarding the existence of God.

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ruveyn
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29 May 2012, 7:56 pm

snapcap wrote:

ruveyn wrote:

snapcap wrote:

I think the definition "the belief that God doesn't exist" is the best answer here.

Not to be confused with the disbelief that God does exist.

ruveyn

Saying atheism is the disbelief that God does exists leaves out what the atheist does believe, and they do believe something regarding the existence of God.

It is possible they might believe the issue of God's existence is irrelevant to anything practical or useful. It is like believing many or a few angels can stand on the head of a pin.

ruveyn

snapcap
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29 May 2012, 8:13 pm

ruveyn wrote:

snapcap wrote:

ruveyn wrote:

snapcap wrote:

I think the definition "the belief that God doesn't exist" is the best answer here.

Not to be confused with the disbelief that God does exist.

ruveyn

Saying atheism is the disbelief that God does exists leaves out what the atheist does believe, and they do believe something regarding the existence of God.

It is possible they might believe the issue of God's existence is irrelevant to anything practical or useful. It is like believing many or a few angels can stand on the head of a pin.

ruveyn

They could find it irrelevant, but they are being dishonest with themselves if they say that they disbelief the exist of God either way.

A disbelief in something is the same as someone, or something, that hasn't been exposed to something to make a decision about, even if it's an idea. Those kinds of atheists are comparing themselves to sticks and rocks, hence my signature.

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NarcissusSavage
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30 May 2012, 1:02 am

Snapcap, please stop speaking for other people. Please.

We are aware you do not understand it... and you don't have to understand it. But there are people who "lack a belief in a god".

That is what atheism is, a lack of an affirmative belief in god. (To be without a god, to be godless) Some atheists have a belief in the negative, ie they have the belief that there are no gods. But! Some atheists simply lack a belief in gods altogether. They are absent a belief in this matter.

Again, you don't have to understand that mindset, I certainly don't ever expect you to be capable of it.... but there are people who are, and do have that mindset. To claim that there isn’t is dishonest, to claim it is impossible and they are wrong is insulting and quite arrogant of you.

So again, please stop speaking for the worldview of others. You are not in their mind, you cannot speak for their thoughts, and certainly are not the authority of what beliefs or lack thereof are possible.

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I am Ignostic.
Go ahead and define god, with universal acceptance of said definition.
I'll wait.

snapcap
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30 May 2012, 1:50 am

NarcissusSavage wrote:

Show me how I'm wrong then. The idea of God is pervasive all over the world. You believe it to be true, with a certain flavor, or you believe it to be false, for your own reasons. Saying you don't believe either way is taking the position of an infant.

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NarcissusSavage
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30 May 2012, 2:10 am

snapcap wrote:

NarcissusSavage wrote:

The concept of god is logically incoherent, and therefore not a concept at all. Thus I have no belief in a lack of a concept. The word "god" has multiple incoherent meanings, depending on who you are speaking to, and each one is meaningless or incomprehensible, imo. So until someone presents a concept of god that is logically valid, meaningful, and comprehensible, I cannot have a belief in it, negative or affirmative. That is how you are wrong.

Example.

The green sound sleeps in uniformity.

Do you believe this is true? Do you believe the green sound sleeps in uniformity, or do you believe the green sound does not sleep in uniformity? Because personally, I don’t have a belief either way, because it is a nonsensical statement. Just as the concept of god is nonsensical. Thus I have no beliefs either way about that particular brand of nonsense either.

_________________
I am Ignostic.
Go ahead and define god, with universal acceptance of said definition.
I'll wait.

snapcap
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30 May 2012, 2:22 am

NarcissusSavage wrote:

The concept of god is logically incoherent, and therefore not a concept at all.

It's not a concept, eh? Then what have we been talking about this entire time?

Not only is it a concept, it's a concept that transcends cultures. There are common threads between what God is, making the basic definition a meme the world over.

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Thus I have no belief in a lack of a concept.

Would you like a link? LOL

Quote:

The word "god" has multiple incoherent meanings, depending on who you are speaking to, and each one is meaningless or incomprehensible, imo.

So the meaning of God has different meanings on different levels, and is constantly evolving over time. Can you name anything else that does the same thing?

Quote:

So until someone presents a concept of god that is logically valid, meaningful, and comprehensible, I cannot have a belief in it, negative or affirmative. That is how you are wrong.

You put too much FAITH in YOUR logic. Logic doesn't make the world go round, but it does help us navigate through it.

Quote:

Example.

The green sound sleeps in uniformity.

Do you believe this is true? Do you believe the green sound sleeps in uniformity, or do you believe the green sound does not sleep in uniformity?

I have no idea what you are talking about. I think you just made up some absurd notion to compare to the idea of God. This idea has no use that I'm aware of, and I have no evidence to believe it to be true, so I'm going to say it's not. I believe it's not true.

See, that wasn't that hard.

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Because personally, I don’t have a belief either way, because it is a nonsensical statement. Just as the concept of god is nonsensical. Thus I have no beliefs either way about that particular brand of nonsense.

If it's nonsensical, you should believe it to be not true.

Are you not sure of yourself? :lol:

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Rainy
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30 May 2012, 2:41 am

It's funny how people these days seem to have a hard time grasping the concept of "I don't know".

Do you believe a coin will land heads or tails before you flip it?

snapcap
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30 May 2012, 2:52 am

Rainy wrote:

It's funny how people these days seem to have a hard time grasping the concept of "I don't know".

Do you believe a coin will land heads or tails before you flip it?

I think it's funny how people can't discriminate between knowledge and belief.

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Rainy
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30 May 2012, 3:00 am

Knowledge is a belief.

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You know, you're generally supposed to say "I have no idea" when you have no idea what's going on.

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