Russian army has invaded the Crimea

Post Reply New Topic

And I'm just a fox who uses peoples computers when they are out.

And to make matters worse, I'm a closet democrat.

I KNEW IT!! !! !

Honestly, we are a bit hypocritica ofl ourselves here, remember Iraq?

Putin is doing what we were doing, defending our national interests.

It was either what Iraq was doing or what we were lead to believe that they were doing which threatened our national interests. Hussein invaded Kuwait, who was just minding their own business. We jumped in to help Kuwait. The main motivation behind going in AGAIN was never WMD's. It was that Iraq harbored terrorists, and the terrorist rats have fled the burning building of Afghanistan to take over in Iraq. WMD's, Saddam gassing his own people, and so forth was really just a means of selling it to the American public. It's a fact that Saddam HAD done some pretty horrible things in the past, and it's also a fact that we never found evidence of what we were looking for, and at the same time it's also a fact that Saddam refused to fully cooperate with inspectors. So we DID have SOME legitimate pretext for war, just maybe not what we'd have liked in retrospect.

The difference between what we did and what's going on in Ukraine is the current (interim) government hasn't ever harmed anyone. They sent Yanukovich packing because his ability to lead was completely destroyed. But Yanukovich also created many more problems than he solved and utterly refused to act in the interests of the Ukrainian people. It's been everything from rigged elections to political arrests since he came to power. The Ukrainian people got sick of it and demanded that they get Tymoshenko back. I haven't checked the news in the last 5 hours, but as far as I was aware she and others have encouraged the people to stay calm and not throw the first punch in this standoff. As far as I'm aware, they haven't hurt anyone…but with Yanukovich in charge, protestors died. He was moving them closer to Russia, which they did not want.

Think about it this way: Imagine the same kind of thing happening in the US. Let's say LaRouche became governor of Texas, and then asked Mexico to come in and put down the riots that would follow. So when the majority of Texans get sick of LaRouche and have him recalled, he runs scared down to San Antonio and stirs up a Latino opposition.

And I think that's exactly what happened…Yanukovich pulled the same kind of crap some low-life like LaRouche would have if he'd been governor of Texas. And then the interim government in Texas would be expected to wait for permission from the US federal government while Mexico rolls into the border towns, y'know, to "protect immigrants" who happened to be Mexican nationals. Yanukovich ran to Putin like some big baby, and all those "ethnic Russians" in the east are probably just plants. I wouldn't be surprised if they were, anyway, and if I'm wrong, so what? Putin has a reputation for lying, and all the noise in the east is likely so much propaganda.

The Ukrainians can't hurt the Russians, nor do they WANT to, and nobody wants to hurt anyone except a few fringe fascists. Russia has no business being there. I'm really hoping the West will do more than just "isolate Russia." What worries me is everything coming out of the west so far seems to be "just words." I say "Slava Ukrayini!"

Ten handy phrases for bluffing your way through the Ukraine crisis

http://blogs.spectator.co.uk/coffeehous ... ne-crisis/

*Edit: Fixed the stupid million mile link

Last edited by 91 on 04 Mar 2014, 11:09 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Saddam Hussein in fact had not harbored terrorists - it had been his policy to execute them, as his was a secular dictatorship and they had pie-in-the-sky dreams of a Middle East wide theocracy. The claim that he was protecting terrorists was yet again one of the Bush administrations many untruths about that war.

That first part is not true. The Saddam Government was listed as a state sponsor of terrorism for good reasons. That being said his government tended to support more secular nationalist groups, rather than groups like Al-Qaeda.

"Yes. Saddam Hussein’s dictatorship provided headquarters, operating bases, training camps, and other support to terrorist groups fighting the governments of neighboring Turkey and Iran, as well as to hard-line Palestinian groups. During the 1991 Gulf War, Saddam commissioned several failed terrorist attacks on U.S. facilities. Prior to the 2003 invasion of Iraq, the State Department listed Iraq as a state sponsor of terrorism."
-http://www.cfr.org/iraq/terrorism-havens-iraq/p9513#p2

The invasion of Iraq was idiotic, sure, but Putin opening fire on some of Russia's best friends on planet Earth would rank right up there. Thankfully it appears to be calmer now.

One thing is certain: Putin is a brazen liar. That press briefing was.....wow.

As someone with a good amount of Ukrainian heritage from my mother's side, I'm actually fairly pissed off at Russia right now. Ukraine has been going through some extremely chaotic, violent times, and Russia has no business stepping in without permission and stirring the pot even more. I sort of understand their motive, but at the same time, I believe that what they are doing is just going to make the already bad situation there even worse.

My thoughts go out to all the people in Ukraine, who have been going through this s**t for far too long.

Apparently Russia has threatened Ukraine with direct force unless they surrender control of the Crimea.

http://nypost.com/2014/03/03/russia-dem ... surrender/

I should have qualified my statement by saying he did not support religious terrorists. But even if he had, that was hardly the reason why we invaded Iraq.

Ironic that you should mention Texas - the state which proves the US has no opposition to encouraging secession in neighboring countries for the sake of annexing the newly independent states that result. But given that Crimea is an autonomous republic, it's more akin to LaRouche becoming President because Buck Williams, the man from Texas, was impeached following massive protests and congress voted to replace him. The Texans don't like this, refusing to recognise LaRouche, and call in help from Mexico because they're scared that the US will send the military in.

Don't forget, the elected Crimean government don't have a problem with the Russians being there, and last I heard, the Russians were only in Crimea. It appears - though I am not an expert on eastern european ethnic tensions - that the Crimean government took this opportunity to seek independence.

60% speak Russian, their party elected the President, now the President has been run out, the members of Parliment from his party run out, their political party banned, and the Russian language banned.

None of this was legal under the Constituion.

No election under these conditions would be legal.

The Ukraine does not have a legal governmeet, and their Navy has joined the Crimera.

The Russians were already there, and had agreed to be avilable to aid the Crimea Government.

This qualifies as a Natural Disaster, and supplying the local self defense units with unifiorms and weapons, trucks, at the request of local authorities, is part of the Navel Base Lease.

Ukraine has a draft, a year of military training for all men, so the local body of men only needed uninforms and weapons. These are Crimeian Self Defense Units, not Russian Army.

His party voted for him to be impeached. The vote was unanimous. The legality problem wasn't with the President's party but with the court system, which was set aside.

False. Ukrainian was essentially demoted in 2012 by the pro-Russian government who then allowed regional languages to become the local standard. The new government is looking for ways to repeal that but the first effort was vetoed. So rather than "ban Russian", nothing has changed yet.



False. Their navy fled for Odessa. Only two ships remain in Sevastopol and neither have surrendered. The Russians now have them blockaded and are demanding they surrender. Their flagship, just returning from NATO exercises, was ordered to avoid Sevastopol and it docked in Odessa today. You might be confusing the defection of the Navy Chief with the navy itself but he didn't take any ships and was replaced. They want to charge him with treason.



This is pure fantasy. That you swallow every world Putin says it just strange. The rest of it is also right from Putin's lips.

http://www.policymic.com/articles/84219 ... -now-faces