how many think not being PC is racist/sexist?

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I don't see that as being "liberal", I see it as being individualistic, beyond the ego complexes that hold back ordinary common people who just live as cogs in the machine. What it means to be a human being, free will and compassion, and the right to preservation and happiness.
But free will is not what most people have, it's what they THINK they have.... Most peoples' ideas and values aren't theirs, they were given to them in a package deal of some sort. And most people are merely a product of their indoctrinations. To rise above that, is to embrace true freedom, the freedom to decide for yourself, to make your own opinions, and to be responsible for yourself, free from caring about what others think of oneself, free from caring about fitting in anywhere, free to grow beyond your ego and free to admit to your mistakes without regret, the freedom to develope one's mind beyond the masses. It's a lonely path indeed...... But we aspies have lots of practice with that, do we not?...... And of coarse, we will be held back paying for the mistakes of the masses and sheep because they will outnumber us. But, I can not put into words how liberating it is, to own your own thoughts and opinions, and to be yourself.

Dude, first of all, you're not American. Second, if it's normal and healthy for people to be loyal to their own ethnic kin, as you put it, you should have no problem with cultures being loyal to being African-American, Asian-American, Jewish American or otherwise. It doesn't mean they're not acknowledging their Americanism. They are saying they have a unique identification within America.

I'm a White, Male, American and I recognize that just by being born that way, doors didn't just open for me, they were "held open" from the day I was born. I celebrate my American heritage just like everyone else. But, I also think people who are ethnic have every right to be proud of it and celebrate that as well. They should do so without feeling like they're threatening (as Merr put it) someone else's identify or isolating themselves just because they use a hyphen. African Americans didn't ask to be here. They were brought here against their will, yet have made major contributions to this country. There is no other westernized nation where you'd find a Condoleeza Rice, one of the most powerful people in the world, speaking on thier behalf. Let alone one where a poor, bi-racial kid could compete with every other White man for the presidency. As a matter of fact, how many White men do you know who were president of the Harvard Revue? For them to achieve this after coming from where they did, they should never, ever forget it!

All the cultures in the U.S. should be proud of who they are. And, nobody should belittle them for using a hyphen, because it wasn't their idea in the first place. If they stop recognizing their culture, then it dies, and they have nothing to pass on down through the generations. I am not a White man who is threatened by other races. I also don't go for that PC crap. I am who I am and I want my kids to grow up respecting other people and not always feeling the need to pick on them for acknowledging their history.

Last, I hate to tell you this, but in the U.S., when you see White men parading around boasting about their Whiteness and how proud they are, they usually have white sheets over their heads. They're not celebrating their heritage because they're proud of who they are. They're doing it because they hate other groups and want to make a statement. I'll never buy that "White Power" or "Proud of European" background stuff. Most of those people couldn't point Europe out on a map to save their lives. Let alone, tell you about the history of Europe. For all that matters, they probably couldn't spell 'europe.'

Codorac I tend to agree with you in that I do not have a problem with Europeans claiming their homeland, culture, etc or looking out for theirselves, as other countries do. In fact, I dont think it would be fun to take a trip to Europe and NOT see European culture- which is what I suspect might happen in some places (partly because of immigration, and partly because so many places are being Americanzied as well. I rmember reading about a muslim unviersity in some city in Germany, I forget which one it is, I thought it was kind of weird and was a little annoyed about it myself). In my opinion, if you move to a different country, you assmilate. If you dont want to, dont move. Im not going to move to Mexico and start an english speaking community and demand rights, or move to Russia if I hated Russian culture or had no plans of adotping to their ways. It's like going to a Muslim country and refusing to wear a hijab/or anytihng to cover up as a woman, and then expecting everyone to adapt to me. it jsut doesnt fit with the cultre and isnt really respectful of the natives...But I suspect the situation in Europe is probably vastly different than the situation here in the US, since Europe has been your homeland for hundreds of years. What I speak of in my posts deals mainly with issues here in the US, which are completely different for reasons stated above.

I also am not knocking any white/black/yellow person who wants to be "brothers" with members of another race. To say that these people who are colorblind are parroting PC marxist bs is well, bs. Some people really dont see color. I dont go around going "oh a black man! oh a white man!" everyday either. For me it is perfectly natural to see people as people, as that is just how I was raised and I suspect many people like it that way, as they have friends of all races and just dont see a point in sticking to a kind when your kind is your friends, no matter who they are. And yeah, that may sound like a bunch of happy nonsense, but really how else can I explain it? I have a theory that if you are friendless and sitting in your school cafeteria alone, you're prolly going to be colorblind, because it is whoever smiles at you, waves and invites you over that forms your opinion of humanity/kin etc.

The global elite doesnt have as much power as you think. Really what has power are in the interactions you have in daily life, unless a perosn is so susceptible to the media that everything they do and think is dictated by the idiot box, if you inhale everything mtv says and dont find things out for yourself- well THEN you may be subject to the global elite lol. Anyway, my daily interactions tell me who to be freins with. The person who smiles at me, is considerate, helpful, friendly...I could be in a room of black people and they all may not think Im cool enough (or whatever), yet the one asian person in the class may not care at all and will take time to get to know me (which has happened before). The global elite may be telling you that all people are the same, but really what tells you is an interaction like this. The global elite is not telling people that staying with their own kind is bad either- I see it everyday kids tend to be friends and date with people who look like them or people who like the same things they do. If there is a global elite, theyre not telling you to intermingle and lose your culture, they're telling you that that guy next to you is a person too. I know that sometimes it may feel like it is illegal for you to say you're a pride white person, but I dont think it's as condemned as you think, unless you combine it with "im rpoud because so-andso's are smelly with primitive cultures" That's just not pride at all.

But I understand that you may want to keep your homeland mainly EUropean/British. Or why you would feel more comfortable to people who share a history/cutlure with.

Yeah, I do think snake is right here. The reason why people dont trust the white pride movement is because as of now, it is led by racists, and no Im not meaning to slander whites. The people who lead these movements believe in superiority, not pride. They believe in animalizing/dehumanizing others, not uplifting their own as a people among people. Most of the people I have heard talk about white pride say "ni##er this, ni##er that" among other things- if people could start some type of movement that emphasized pride and not hate masked with the flowery facade of pride, then I believe a white history month would take place. I know that the leading message behind many pride movements that are black are not ones that slander whites, call them names, etc. Any organization that does so is not accepted by the masses. yes, some blacks feel that whites have done them wrong, but in the end, if you speak to them, they see you as a BROTHER, not a inferior, as a human being, not an animal, as someone they can learn from and hope will learn from you as well, The whole message of "black pride" was not to be embarassed to be black, and to be united with the world, not to separate with hate. A while ago I read a site about a European American pride group that was against hate, but I forget where they were- that was about 4 years ago. But they sounded they were really proud of their people and werent trying to put down others with it.

There are two socio-economic classes that do what they want.
-- The rich - because they can usually buy their way out of any trouble they create for themselves
-- The poor - because they have nothing to lose.
I don't know if you have noticed but the white hate groups are mostly staffed with the powerless poor whites, and the reason that they take on a doctrine of hate is because they can't figure out anything better. If you make an estimate of their IQ's you will realize that overwhelmingly they are far from the "sharpest knives in the drawer". They feel conspired against and they are looking for a conspirator. When they see someone of a minority getting affirmative action treatment, they want some too. When they see that those of minorities are often poor, or start out that way they feel that they are in competition with those minorities and don't want to see them rise if they don't. It would be a simplification to allege that this is an entire explanation of the phenomenon but it certainly is a large piece of it.


Merr, I could hardly agree with you less. That is exactly where the PC factor comes in. Just try naming a group with the term "White People" in the name. It does not matter how pure the motives, The PC promoters will have it branded as racist before the ink dries on the paper. The whole concept of Freedom of Association which is supposed to be inherent in the first amendment to the constitition
---- Congress shall make no law .... abridging ...the right of the people peaceably to assemble -----
goes out the window when a group decides to limit membership racially or religiously .... The group is denied rights permitted to other groups. Examples include:
-- A private elks club had their liquor license withdrawn when they did not admit blacks
-- The Trigon Christian fraternity was threatened with expulsion of its members from the University of Michigan if the group refused membership to a jew who would not take the oath of initiation which mentioned Jesus Christ
-- Tax exempt status offered to virtually any non-profit organization is denied if race gender ethnic origin etc. is a criterion for membership.
The argument that this does not abridge the freedom of association clause is a bunch of pc hooey because what they are saying is ok, you can asociate but we are going to make it hard on you, and there is the threat of prosecution of the entire group if a single member does anything out of line. But it seems that minority groups get a blind eye turned their way. Predominantly white churches are threatened with loss of their 501 c3 tax exempt status if they even mention anything about a political candidate, yet predominantly black churches have their favorite candidates speak from the pulpit on their day of worship.
It bugs a lot of people that there is a double standard. The skin heads and racial hatred types are the only ones who feel that they have so little to lose that they might as well make a fuss.

Three words come to mind, "The Black Muslims" What a bunch of racist rot has been spewed forth from that group. Yet they get press coverage that is at least partially sympathetic and their leaders rise to national prominence and their names become recognized

Well I don't think the ones that call me "honkey" or drag a truck driver out of his truck an beat him can be counted in that category. Yeah, I know all about the cops that beat up Rodney King and got off, but that is a separate issue because there are way to many cops who physically beat people, just check out U-Tube. I just saw one the other day of a black officer at the jail who dumped a guy out of his wheel chair to search him. The guy was compliant and she dumped him on the floor breaking two of his ribs. So I think beatings by cops are not primarily a racial thing although that certain fuels it.

And thanks to the PC media you will not likely hear of them again. I myself have never heard of them. And I guess that is the point of the whole objection to the PC pogroms

Merr, I think you and I both hope for a world where in all cases people who are part of a group that has a particular identity are not be involved hatred or denigration of others. But I think you perceive that world as being closer than I do. I conceive the PC movement and practices as being an impediment to that kind of world and a very dangerous one at that.

OK, outlander. I see your point, I dont think we should be afriad of the term "white heritage" or anything else, just as we shouldnt be afraid of people using hyphens to think their ethnicity and their nationality. It is annoying when the pc media is always on the watch, but I think it's because people are afriad, you know? I wonder, since the white pride logos and white heritage logs conjsure up such a strong image of those supremacist groups and even hitler, how we'd be able to separate white pride from racism/extremism? How would we go about doing that besides people actively demonstrating that pride does not equate with hate?

I dont know about that group- I dont think I havent heard from them because of the PC police, but maybe because they were such a small group and that was when I was 17 so I dont quite remember the name. Plus, if you look at the reasons why many young people join these groups, its not out of learning their history/being proud, but to get involved in some epic fight for glory, like being part of a live-action real life Lord of the Rings novel, if you know what I mean. So I doubt the European American pride group had as much appeal as stromfront, for example, if you catch my drift. Im sure if I looked around the net somewhere Id be able to find them.

I'm tired of scripture-puking, insensitive, obnoxious, conservative twat-monkeys like yourself using that self-same complaint to justify every single, tasteless act short of outright murder. Wait, you use it for that, too, in some states. It's called the "Gay Panic Defense," a legal exception that allows teenaged punks to get away with outright murder as long as their victim might feasibly have been attracted to them. If it were ten years ago, you'd call me a "PC commie" for saying even that was MR. You people never really change, though. All that changes is what people like me let you get away with. You don't like Jesse Jackson? We'll call off that lunatic when you call off your own fricking Jesus-snorting psychopaths, alright? You're sick of him? We're sick of them.

It sounds like you've been listening too much to a very ignorant, foolish, old man who likes to use his radio show to vent his spleen. Discrimination is discrimination, any way you look at it, and the same is so for bigotry. If you can't tell the difference between a feminist and a fricking misandric dyke, I feel sad for you, whether you're liberal, conservative, or too craven to say. Bullies can have ovaries, too, don't you know.

MLK Jr. was more ahead of the curve than people give him credit for. He never really spoke of it publicly, being preoccupied with other matters, but he also tended to have liberal views on gay rights. Although he never made this a public issue, this actually was one of the issues that Coretta Scott King spoke on, at some length, in the time between his death and hers. In short, I suggest that MLK Jr. would have disagreed with you on this subject.

It shouldn't even be a factor in dating affairs.

Historical figures don't like being used as puppets, so, if you don't mind, pull your hand out of MLK Jr.'s ass, so we can have a reasonable discussion. The man's dead. Discussion is for the living. Dead men have said all they're going to say.

Griff, don't sleep on your side, we wouldn't want to brain to fall out of your ear..... Oh. because I'm not a blind liberal, I **MUST** be a blind conservative? Did it ever occur to you some of us are more mature than you, and actually care about facts over labels? f**k your stupid immature labels. Merr IS black, she is not half as offended as you are. As I stated before, not being a self-loathing racist against myself does not make me a racist against others. This is you unquestioning loyalty to a label speaking here Griff?
In case you haven't noticed (oh wait, your doing the "group think" thing and ignoring this) I did an entire column calling out rednecks and conservatives. It got locked down because I trashed one of those christian fanatics your talking about. Your problem is you have to think YOUR "clique" has no faults, you just wanna point fingers, "oh my s**t don't stink, all the world's problems can be blamed on the other side because my side is perfect". I'm not even christian, let alone a conservative. I don't even believe in religion. Stop pointing fingers until you can look in the mirror and see your own flaws. Liberals f**k up just as bad as conservatives, the blame falls on everyone, not just "them". There's always gotta be a "them" doesn't there?
As for if gender should be a factor in dating affairs, I think I have the right to choose which gender I go out with. I think that is a personal issue, but for me it is a factor, because i'm not gay. If your gay, fine, that's your thing, I'm not judging you. But you shouldn't judge me either. My sex/love life has nothing to do with you, and yours has nothing to do with me. So get over it.
Damn, PC is becoming a religion now, a cult, where whites and males loath themselves with guilt complexes and ethnics and females are pumped up on self-centered bias, double standard hate propaganda that leans on history as a crutch. I'm not gonna subjugate myself to double standards and act as if I have no right to defend my own preservation because of some s**t that happened 200 yrs ago, or because of something other white/male/straight people have done. I'm not them and I shouldn't be held accountable for their actions.
When your willing to think and speak like a mature **individual** adult, with your own opinions, then come and talk to me about this s**t.

Last edited by snake321 on 26 Feb 2008, 2:34 am, edited 2 times in total.

People like you belong in high school griff. Adults choose facts over cliques. Sadly, adults are becoming more and more rare. You want people to kiss your ass just because your a female, and i they don't, theyr "sexist". I think you need to reconsider what sexist is, take a long hard look in the mirror. Females aren't even more virtuous or perfect than males are, same with liberals and conservatives. Everyone needs to take their part of the blame and stop pointing fingers.