Bush admits revelations from God!! !!

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irishmic

You truly never know what future historians well say, in 1 year they may say what you said, or in 20 years they might say the total opposite of what you said. That is always up to interpretation of the historians.

Even You might change what You think of Bush in 20 years, being a political science major.

You Truly Never Know.

I think irishmic has a few valid points. Kissinger wins no awards with me. GW has a tendancy not only to appoint his friends, but to sack scientists who tell him things he doesn't want to hear and replace them with people happy with "faith-based initiatives". Lilguy, Al-Jazeera is not the only source of information for the "other side", and most people there are just as open minded within their heritage as you are in yours. Saddam was bad but it doesn't follow that having removed him we have any right tomeddle in Iraq. The perception among many in Asia and the middle East is that we (the West, thanks to TB) are happy to use the facilities of countries with a record as bad as, if not worse than Saddams, to defeat a minor embarrassment to the Bush family. We happily support those regimes because they are friendly to us. If the perception there were that the west had the interests of the people and their right to self determination at heart there would be no effective method of recruiting insurgents. Instead we happily award contracts to our own companies, sell off oil-fields and use the provision of water/electricity and other vital services to blackmail the populace.
eamonn (and myself) talked about Northern Ireland, what a farce and total breakdown in communication that place is. 800 hundred years of oppression and we still don't understand. The troops went in to prevent Protestant violence against Catholics from getting out of hand, but because of the sympathies of many of the troops it didn't really turn out that way. People were demanding such things as 1 man 1 vote, access to decent housing, the end to police harrassment, civil rights in a nutshell. They are still looking for those rights. People read headlines, not history and that leads to all sorts of misunderstanding, all reasonable attempts at talks were dismissed or vetoed by the Loyalists. Even now when Loyalist violence is more likely (because someone moves a march route by a couple of hundred feet) access to power sharing is being barred.
Have a look at the Constitution being imposed on Iraq and tell me there are adequate safeguards for Sunni muslims, that co-operation is encouraged, or that minority rights are protected. IMHO we are replacing one catastrophe with another. The lessons are never learned and we keep up the "I want" approach.

That is why we need to get the United Nations more involved in Iraq. So that all sides are protected then. All the sides have enough power to go around in Iraq.

Just to blame Bush on everything that goes wrong, I think is getting real old.

We like to play the blame game to much I think. We need to move forward I think. That is the debate that what we need to do is to start talking about it. We need to move the debate forward.

Maybe even get the United Nations involved in Northern Ireland too if need be.

That is how I see it.

Litguy, stop having an arguments with a strawman, Kissinger and newsweek is indeed well known as right-wing and i dont blindly follow Al-Jazeera and irishmic probably isnt into pravda. Newsweek has more in common with pravda than most publications seeing as they are government approved and blatantly pro-Bush. Iraq hasnt been a threat to world security for a long time as they were too weak, though its now a threat thanks to Bush and co.

There are far bigger threats out there than Iraq was (including the US) but they arent as oil rich or in as weak a military position as Iraq and also Saddam Hussein tried to have Bush senior assasinated, there is a whole load of unsavoury reasons why the US went to war with Iraq and world security was way down on the list imo.

Whether the Irish are a threat to international security depends on the papers you read. There are some here who would tell you otherwise. According to some the IRA run training camps for Marxists the world over. My favourite recent example is the nonsense surrounding the FARC/ IRA meetings. As when when Bobby Sands declared Troscud on the British Government, there is no requirement to look behind appearance. Mr Sands called on ancient tradition to have his case heard fairly, he was ignored and became a much bigger thorn in the side of the government when he died, many people in the Uk still think he was just sulking. There have been very strong links between the Irish and the other Americas for centuries and there are strong Irish connections between all sorts of other countries, depending on how you want to portray the Irish, all you have to do is be selective about the history or what people are saying. There are links between Anarchist groups in Ireland and the Zapatistas, etc, etc. The main thing now is that the Irish are perceived to be "like us", with an accessible culture. The problem of the middle East is that people set them up as different and vent their prejudices. Do you think the rise of Islamic fundamentalism is unconnected to the way we interfere in the Middle East?
This has been a rant rather than anything, but there are some things that are applicable, so I'm not going to edit.

Don't know if John Pilger is known in the US, but he is a respected (if feared) investigative journalist in the UK. Her is one of his commentaries on the media.
http://www.informationclearinghouse.inf ... e10615.htm
Robert Fisk of the Independant also contibutes.
http://news.independent.co.uk/uk/this_b ... 319160.ece

Scary stuff. Cant say im surprised though. Anglo-American governments are the masters of cloke and dagger killings and propaganda. We get a little freedom here and get fed propaganda and most of us believe it all like sheep because the alternative is too scary for us to believe or even to try to contemplate . Sounds a bit like organised religion actually.