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Zyborg
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23 Mar 2009, 10:06 am

Very interesting and conceptually attractive documentary. It has spawned growing mass-movement against corporate elites.

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid ... t+addendum



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23 Mar 2009, 5:16 pm

I usually don't watch long movies, I might be persuaded to watch a small clip that seems interesting, but not much beyond this. In any case, I don't trust the zeitgeist movement, and as such I won't spend much time with them, as other sources, sources that seem reliable to me, have considered the film dishonest, or better, selectively honest.



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23 Mar 2009, 5:57 pm

It was an interesting documentary to say the least. Much of the original Zeitgeist was rubbish, but Addendum makes an argument against our current system (religion, fractional reserve banking, and capitalism, or the whole idea of a monetary system in the first place) which borders irrefutability.

The solution it gives to the problem it presents (the Venus Project), however, is a different story. I love the idea of a resource-based economy, but it's so advanced, so far beyond anything this world has ever attempted, that I can't imagine it happening anytime soon. And needless to say, those who make the world turn right now, our overlords, whatever you wish to call them, would offer great resistance to such a system -- implemented honestly anyway.



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23 Mar 2009, 11:29 pm

its a good film, but i oppose ALL cult-worship of anything, and its so easy for people to worship stuff like this.

its not really anything super-revelational. world runs by money, world religions stem from stone-age myths., i dont need to be told that jesus/buddha/mohammed didnt exist :D

corporate elites should be viewed as demons from the underworld regardless of revealing movies, i think :]


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24 Mar 2009, 1:49 am

I am always highly suspicious on two hour long films telling that they have to solution for everything. If I want to watch something over two hours it must certainly be worth.

If the author has really something to say, he/she shall write it down. It is faster to read a text than to watch endless animations. It is also more efficient to check a text, because you can lookup anything in the middle on which you have some knowledge and look what the author writes: I use this as a standard tool for assessing the quality of a text (and the text's worthiness of occupying my time).



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24 Mar 2009, 2:29 am

Dussel wrote:
I am always highly suspicious on two hour long films telling that they have to solution for everything. If I want to watch something over two hours it must certainly be worth.

If the author has really something to say, he/she shall write it down. It is faster to read a text than to watch endless animations. It is also more efficient to check a text, because you can lookup anything in the middle on which you have some knowledge and look what the author writes: I use this as a standard tool for assessing the quality of a text (and the text's worthiness of occupying my time).

I agree with you. There are a *lot* of films like that out there too. I mean, it is difficult to go to the internet without running into some anti-central bank, anti-tax, or pro-9/11 conspiracy film out there. But yeah, I generally dislike audio or visual presentations, they take up more time than I may want to spend on something.



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24 Mar 2009, 7:42 am

Agreed on the preference for written materials. They are easier for me to digest, and besides, I have yet to meet a decent film documentary. From what I recall, the whole Zeitgeist thing is just a patchwork of random conspiracy theories.

ZEGH8578 wrote:
world religions stem from stone-age myths., i dont need to be told that jesus/buddha/mohammed didnt exist :D

Jesus, Buddha (usually referring to Siddartha Gautama), and Mohammad are all historical individuals. That they existed is not seriously questioned, though the truth of the religions each founded are considered more contentious.


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Strangerthanfiction
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24 Mar 2009, 9:14 am

Hi all, my first posting here so I don't want to do a massive page, but the Zeitgeist films have been dubunked in terms of both content and reasoning. The whole thing is a marketing ploy and experiment in social manipulation by a Mr Lucas, who owns God-like Productions (and also the company LOP, a malware/spyware producer) who made the film, funded in part by the Ramtha channeling cult.

STF



Zyborg
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24 Mar 2009, 10:16 am

Strangerthanfiction wrote:
Hi all, my first posting here so I don't want to do a massive page, but the Zeitgeist films have been dubunked in terms of both content and reasoning. The whole thing is a marketing ploy and experiment in social manipulation by a Mr Lucas, who owns God-like Productions (and also the company LOP, a malware/spyware producer) who made the film, funded in part by the Ramtha channeling cult.

STF


Proof?



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24 Mar 2009, 11:30 am

Orwell wrote:
Agreed on the preference for written materials. They are easier for me to digest, and besides, I have yet to meet a decent film documentary. From what I recall, the whole Zeitgeist thing is just a patchwork of random conspiracy theories.

ZEGH8578 wrote:
world religions stem from stone-age myths., i dont need to be told that jesus/buddha/mohammed didnt exist :D

Jesus, Buddha (usually referring to Siddartha Gautama), and Mohammad are all historical individuals. That they existed is not seriously questioned, though the truth of the religions each founded are considered more contentious.


_orwell_ you should know better.

theyre not questioned, cus people will lose their minds if they are questioned.
theyre the #1 central figure of the worlds 3 LARGEST religions.

it would be like scientifically question god, allah or buddhism.

historically, who are they? what is the evidence for siddartha having existed? jesus? THE BIBLE? come on..


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ruveyn
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24 Mar 2009, 11:54 am

Zyborg wrote:
Very interesting and conceptually attractive documentary. It has spawned growing mass-movement against corporate elites.

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid ... t+addendum


This documentary is a study in contradiction. It first curses debt based money and then proceeds to ignore the advances in technology catalyzed by the investment of this phony baloney money to produce real material wealth and progress.

ruveyn



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24 Mar 2009, 12:38 pm

Zyborg wrote:
Strangerthanfiction wrote:
Hi all, my first posting here so I don't want to do a massive page, but the Zeitgeist films have been dubunked in terms of both content and reasoning. The whole thing is a marketing ploy and experiment in social manipulation by a Mr Lucas, who owns God-like Productions (and also the company LOP, a malware/spyware producer) who made the film, funded in part by the Ramtha channeling cult.

STF


Proof?


By all means:) This isn't quite the full story, but you can check out any of the links, read testimonies of those involved inthe Godlike site, do a Google search on the words Tavistock, Lop, etc. Some of this is a couple of years old now, but still relevant with the release of the new film.

As anybody can use google to prove that the 'facts' in Zeitgeist 1 and 2 are wrong pretty quickly, you have to wonder why the producers, Godlike Productions - who say they're intent on providing us with the truth - didn't check any of these details first? Simply because they didn't care, they don't claim them to be true. The disclaimer on their site quite plainly says that much of what they have on site IS fiction, and that timelines and facts have been changed. Zeigeist 1 and 2 are both works of fiction - and a badly made one too. The conclusions it draws about all forms of religion being based on Sun worship and/or Hinduism are wrong.

Godlike was formerly a large and happy discussion forum that was taken over by one Jason Lucas, now it's solely a front for Lucas and his ideas, but there is far more that's worthy of our attention at Godlike. Godlike are directly connected with spyware/malware company Lop.com, who are in turn connected to C2 Media (and too the nutty Rama cult who seem to have 'helped' fund Zeitgeist):

http://www.nomorespyware.50megs.com/c2media.html
"...C2 Media, located on London, England, likes to bill itself as a "legitimate advertising company". Anyone who has ever been infected with their advertising parasite, Lop, probably refers to them by other names. They feel that it is well within their rights to offer advertising to the average net-user. By "offer", they mean altering your IE browser through browser hijacks, adding toolbars and buttons, adding files and .dll files on your system, adding registry keys, and making itself at home in the Application Data folder. They sneak themselves onto computer systems by being obscurly bundled into other programs. It is also difficult to remove, requiring the user to perform part of the removal in Safe Mode and also accessing the regedit, something a novice or new user isn't proficiant at.

In articles, Lucas (owner too of GLP), compares this sort of infiltration as being perfectly acceptable and no different than watching a television commercial.

(http://www.ftc.gov/os/comments/spyware/040312lucas.pdf) He claims that people must pay to use the internet in the form of accepting unwanted advertising the same way we "pay" to use television and radio by listening to commercials. He seems to overlook the fact that the majority of people using the internet do pay for it's use....through their ISP services. And that the portion of the population using free ISP's are being served sponsored advertising through the free ISP. I feel that anyone paying $30 to $60 a month for the privilege of using bandwidth should not be required to suffer their unwanted adware, nor should they be allowed to alter the user's personal property, i.e., their computer. Those who use free ISP services are also served with advertising sponsored by the ISP service, which is their agreed upon terms with the service. Why does C2 Media feel these people should "pay" even more by turning over control of their computers to C2 Media?..."

Lucas is desperate to change the image of spyware to allow him to use it unfairly through Lop. This is part of his letter to the Federal Trade Commission to try and get them to accept spyware and adware as legal:

"...Much of the "evil" things heard about "adware" are over-exaggerations packaged
by the "anti-advertising industry" as a "fear sale" pressure tactic. This approach is
consistent with the interests of an "anti-adware" company in fostering fear and
discontent on the part of the general public regarding advertising software. The more
the public fears, the more the "anti-advertising industry" profits.

This, of course, is where the term 'spyware' takes on particular significance. The
term 'spy' has a menacing connotation for most people. Even though most 'adware'
actually does no spying, the "anti-advertising industry" advises the public that their
privacy is at risk from what is mostly a rather benign advertising software package. In
my opinion, at least half of all the 'facts' reported by even the most reputable 'anti virus' companies regarding advertising software are either untrue or half-truths. This is because it is obviously in their own financial interest to foster fear on the public mind so that it generates demand for anti-virus software. The fact is if you are in the 'anti
advertising' industry, the word 'spyware' sells (and that means money and profits for
those so-called "anti-virus" companies)...."

Godlike want malware to be legalised for two reasons, to make money, and because they're experimenting with social influence, through films like Zeitgeist. Look up the name Tavistock in connection with Lucas and Godlike.

Although it may sound like Godlike are simply appealing (rightly) for freedom of speech against the government, anyone thinking person must wonder why it's necessary to spread proven lies against the government and church to get freedom of speech? Godlike simply want the right to release films and stories that are either so totally ridiculous or contentious that people flock to the source to view them - whereupon GLP can see the effects of their work and make money from it,being a marketing company?

There are unfavourable reports on CM2 and its methods here:
http://www.nomorespyware.50megs.com/c2media.html
http://www.associatedcontent.com/art...ve.html?cat=47

"...Godlike Productions is involved in psychological operations , sometimes targeting specific individuals. There is evidence to indicate that some of the moderators and especially the owners have an agenda to stir up anti semitic sentiment by defending zionism as representing jews in general at the same time they vehemently attack anti zionists as anti semetic. There are also regularly threats allowed to be posted and remain as well as the personal information of those who were threatened, the goal is intimidation...."

GLP is a company who's films decry infiltration and underhand government tactics and lies of every kind - and yet it's a front for people who are using the same methods to influence the population and spread malware. If you support Zeitgeist, you support spyware and the loss of your privacy.

I'm also happy to provide links that prove that the alleged similarities between Buddha, Horus, Jesus, et al are non-existent. Most of it is based on the work of Archarya S (and god help us, Theosophy), an author who has distanced herself from the connections that Zeitgeist has made.



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24 Mar 2009, 12:42 pm

We have more physical proof for the Buddha than most other historical figures. We have stupas inscribed at the time of is death (some opened and the contents available) containing his bones and other relics.

STF



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24 Mar 2009, 1:28 pm

Strangerthanfiction wrote:
We have more physical proof for the Buddha than most other historical figures. We have stupas inscribed at the time of is death (some opened and the contents available) containing his bones and other relics.

STF


no, they arent proof, theyre relics. relics assigned to siddharta.

the only jesus-proof ive ever heard about is "he is mentioned in other religious texts" wow, that totally blows me off my feet :b


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24 Mar 2009, 8:16 pm

ZEGH8578 wrote:
_orwell_ you should know better.

theyre not questioned, cus people will lose their minds if they are questioned.
theyre the #1 central figure of the worlds 3 LARGEST religions.

it would be like scientifically question god, allah or buddhism.

historically, who are they? what is the evidence for siddartha having existed? jesus? THE BIBLE? come on..

Zeg, all three of those are historical figures whose existence is not disputed by serious historians, including a very large number of atheists. These people existed. Whether the religions they founded have merit is a separate question. Jesus is mentioned in secular records, and the Bible has better textual evidence behind it than any other ancient text, with far more ancient manuscripts than we have for other works. Again, whether the contents of the Bible (which we can say with a high degree of confidence match the original very closely) have any validity is a separate question.

Really, you just undermine your position when you make such factually incorrect assertions. You make yourself like an ignoramus and a sloppy debater. Worse, you come off as a generic uninformed Internet-atheist.


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