Muslims rebels will reinvigorate culture
21 Feb 2006, 3:13 am
ancientofdaze wrote:
I think that the rise of yob culture in Britain can be blamed largely on
(a) the massive unemployment during the Dark Ages of Thatcher
when so many people and their children were left loafing for years,
the social effects of which are still with us, and
(b) the megabillionpound booze industry which does doesn't care how many kids
have their faces bottled on a Friday night or kill themselves in cars on Saturday
or die early of liver disease and promotes slacker culture 'cos it's Good For Business.
(a) the massive unemployment during the Dark Ages of Thatcher
when so many people and their children were left loafing for years,
the social effects of which are still with us, and
(b) the megabillionpound booze industry which does doesn't care how many kids
have their faces bottled on a Friday night or kill themselves in cars on Saturday
or die early of liver disease and promotes slacker culture 'cos it's Good For Business.
Well, as I've not touched on this for a while here, I'll just reiterate a few of my thoughts on this:
I really don't think the two influences you mention play a major part in this. Yes, there may be some connection, but the general picture one gets from personal experience and anecdotal evidence is that "Yob culture" exists because it is allowed to, and because it is encouraged. The former is a result of liberal policies; the old rights vs responsibilities thing is important in this. People are allowed a greater degree of personal freedom (and that's not to say what's allowed is legal) because increasingly what constrains that freedom is how the law is enforced by the state, rather than how the community decide to police themselves. Trouble is, enforcement by the state cannot function effectively without a degree of community self-help. In fact, the two should ideally work together in a kind of symbiotic way. So, what's broken this relationship down? I think there are a number of factors. One is that the law, and those who enforce it, discourage people from taking things into their own hands, and sorting problems out themselves. For example, in years gone by, if a bunch of kids had been causing trouble it would have been seen as perfectly reasonable if an adult had gone out, reprimanded them, and perhaps administered a clip round the ear. These days, liberal diktat makes that abuse. Result: kids do what they want, because ultimately the only form of correction they'll receive is from the police, and the police are too tied up dealing with important issues, to get involved. So, theses kids grow up with the impression they can do as they please. Of course, not all kids do that. But if 20 years ago 2% of kids did, and today say, 5% do, you've got a situation where that malign influence has increased from 1 in 50 of the younger population, to 1 in 20; a small change, but when you put that lot down town on a Saturday night you get the problems we see now.
I also mentioned this "Yob culture" being encouraged. There are a number of ways this is done, specifically by the various communication media we are exposed to, as they operate within our capitalist system. Many advertisements encourage selfish, antisocial behaviour. Many depict women humiliating men, others encourage a "live now to hell with everyone else" attitude, some perpetuate the deleterious notion that it's always someone elses fault — the no-win no-fee legal scum. One could perhaps cite the boorish attitude of some TV presenters, too.
Anyway, this is a complicated subject and I've only touched on a few points. The anonymity provided by living in increasingly densely populated urban areas could play a part. Religion, or lack of, is a contributary factor, too. Though I'm atheist, I realise society has to operate within certain parameters, and religion can be used to maintain that system, if it is not used nefariously by a minority. Whatever, the UK is really becoming an unpleasant place to live, I'm just glad I've moved out of the city.
ancientofdaze
Raven
Joined: 9 Dec 2005
Age: 89
Gender: Male
Posts: 103
Location: west wales, uk, overlooking the ocean
22 Feb 2006, 9:02 pm
Klytus defined yobs as
Quote:
more like vandals, thugs, aggressive drunkards, that sort of thing. Antisocial turds in general.
I might add, they weren't invented yesterday, or even recently. Juvenile crime and the petty, or not so petty, delinquencies of youth have been a central concern in society from time immemorial.ascan observed and asked
Quote:
increasingly what constrains that freedom is how the law is enforced by the state, rather than how the community decide to police themselves. Trouble is, enforcement by the state cannot function effectively without a degree of community self-help. In fact, the two should ideally work together in a kind of symbiotic way. So, what's broken this relationship down?
I absolutely agree that "policing" is futile without community self-regulation. What has broken that is the kind of attitude exemplified by Madam Thatcher's notorious statement that "there is no such thing as society", or in other words, "there's only me, me, me."
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