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Tim_Tex
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10 Oct 2010, 3:58 am

I have always learned that the Republicans were anti-big government, and anti-taxation. Same goes with Libertarians and the Tea Party followers.

But how did it go from being in favor of small government and little to no taxation, to being stereotyped as being racist and intolerant?


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Dox47
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10 Oct 2010, 4:46 am

There is a long and complicated answer encompassing certain questionable moves by the GOP concerning the makeup of their base and such, but the short and simple answer is because it's convenient for certain people. For instance, it's much easier to point out a few crazies in the Tea Party/libertarian/Republican ranks and call the whole bunch kooks than it is to answer their arguments on the merits; it's a custom tailored guilt by association fallacy used to discredit political opponents by members of the opposite ideology. When you get right down to it, it's a lot easier to string together some loaded buzzwords and try to hang unpopular sentiments around your opponent's neck than to actually debate them; and lest I be accused of tunnel vision on this I'll readily admit that these tactics are used by people of all political stripes and views, I believe the technical term is "smear campaign".


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BigK
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10 Oct 2010, 4:56 am

Most people really do not read all the depth political analysis. They only read the headlines.

The headlines were that Palin was your vice presidential candidate and she might even run for president. 8O

You're scaring people folks. :D

Just out of interest Dox, do you consider yourself one of the kooks? :wink:


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countzarroff
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10 Oct 2010, 6:12 am

I love Big Government, it pays for schools, roads, police, fire department, town events, science programs, etc. The Tea Party is crazy, taxes are awesome as long as the money is put to good use.

"Oh but countzarroff, I worked hard for my money" Boo hoo, we all do, I care more about city kids who need a good public school than you being able to get your 19th car. Pay your taxes and shut up.



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10 Oct 2010, 6:59 am

countzarroff wrote:
I love Big Government, it pays for schools, roads, police, fire department, town events, science programs, etc. The Tea Party is crazy, taxes are awesome as long as the money is put to good use.

"Oh but countzarroff, I worked hard for my money" Boo hoo, we all do, I care more about city kids who need a good public school than you being able to get your 19th car. Pay your taxes and shut up.


Communist! :D


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Tensu
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10 Oct 2010, 7:45 am

countzarroff wrote:
as long as the money is put to good use.


That's the problem: the money isn't being put to good use. It's being used to fund redundant agencies and positions.



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10 Oct 2010, 8:11 am

a person i consider to be a towering figure of personal integrity, harry s. truman, said-

"the only efficient form of government is a dictatorship."



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10 Oct 2010, 8:55 am

It is a populist movement. Populist movements are filled with idiots.



Orwell
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10 Oct 2010, 8:57 am

Tim_Tex wrote:
I have always learned that the Republicans were anti-big government, and anti-taxation. Same goes with Libertarians and the Tea Party followers.

But how did it go from being in favor of small government and little to no taxation, to being stereotyped as being racist and intolerant?

Because the GOP has (since the time of Nixon) pandered to rural whites. On some occasions, Republicans have skirted the line between courting a certain demographic and outright racism.

Also, the GOP is not anti-big government or anti-taxation. Reagan signed in the biggest peacetime tax hike in American history. Bush Jr. added several new inefficient federal bureaucracies. Republicans have historically been worse about the deficit than Democrats.


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ruveyn
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10 Oct 2010, 11:16 am

countzarroff wrote:
I love Big Government, it pays for schools, roads, police, fire department, town events, science programs, etc. The Tea Party is crazy, taxes are awesome as long as the money is put to good use.



Like giving loans to GM to make poor cars? Or keeping banks from going under so they can create more bogus bonds? What is Good Use and who decides? I think each person should decide for himself what Good Use is for -his own money- and not the government.

ruveyn



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10 Oct 2010, 11:18 am

ruveyn wrote:

Like giving loans to GM to make poor cars? Or keeping banks from going under so they can create more bogus bonds? What is Good Use and who decides? I think each person should decide for himself what Good Use is for -his own money- and not the government.

ruveyn


What a nice, if trite, talking point. The problem is I don't think you actually support the "each person should decide for himself what Good Use is" mantra, as you're not an anarchist and you have said that you support some taxation.


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ruveyn
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10 Oct 2010, 11:21 am

Master_Pedant wrote:
ruveyn wrote:

Like giving loans to GM to make poor cars? Or keeping banks from going under so they can create more bogus bonds? What is Good Use and who decides? I think each person should decide for himself what Good Use is for -his own money- and not the government.

ruveyn


What a nice, if trite, talking point. The problem is I don't think you actually support the "each person should decide for himself what Good Use is" mantra, as you're not an anarchist and you have said that you support some taxation.


For those necessary services for which there is no subdivided market such as an army or an air-force.
Taxation is a necessary evil and we should have as little of it as is consistent with maintaining order in the society and protecting ourselves from foreign attack.

Anything else can be provided by privately capitalized organizations.

And you think promoting government programs isn't trite? How wrong you are.

ruveyn



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10 Oct 2010, 3:33 pm

It's because the common thread in all conservative reactionary ideologies is preserving the status quo. The rich stay rich, the poor stay poor, and all "inferior" people need to be reminded to stay in their place.



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10 Oct 2010, 4:12 pm

Tim_Tex wrote:
I have always learned that the Republicans were anti-big government, and anti-taxation. Same goes with Libertarians and the Tea Party followers.

But how did it go from being in favor of small government and little to no taxation, to being stereotyped as being racist and intolerant?


Because that's the narrative the establishment and media want to spread

they're afraid



Dox47
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10 Oct 2010, 6:33 pm

BigK wrote:
Just out of interest Dox, do you consider yourself one of the kooks? :wink:


I self identify as a small "l" libertarian simply because it's the closest I can get to my actual politics without breaking things down to my individual positions and opinions, and though I believe in some things that could be easily misconstrued I don't think I' the type likely to be singled out as the archetype by someone trying to smear a group. They'd prefer to find a racist that happens to also be for small government or religious fundamentalists that also support gun rights in order to make people like me look bad because we share an idea or two. It's like the Hitler association game; try to tie an idea to someone who also did terrible things or in this case holds socially unpalatable opinions and try to draw a non-existent connection to other people who share the one original idea. I like to point out that Hitler was a quasi new age vegetarian who loved gun control in these sorts of situations.


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marshall
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10 Oct 2010, 7:34 pm

If US Libertarians were truly about liberty I wouldn't have as much of a bad reaction to them. My reaction to the Tea Party type of Libertarian is not due to a perception of them being racist or intolorant. I think I have a pretty accurate perception of them being either hard-nosed and insensitive or paranoid and misinformed. I see more of the former than the latter here on WP.