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dionysian
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25 May 2011, 3:51 am

Nope, nothing at all.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/a-link-between-climate-change-and-joplin-tornadoes-never/2011/05/23/AFrVC49G_story.html


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Philologos
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25 May 2011, 7:48 am

A. May the newspapers never lack recycled paper bags and the hot air to fill them

B. Everyone complains about the weather but no one does anything about it. - S Clemens

C. The Pharisees also with the Sadducees came, and tempting desired him that he would shew
them a sign from heaven. He answered and said unto them, When it is evening, ye say, It will be fair weather: for the sky is red. And in the morning, It will be foul weather to day: for the sky is red and lowering. O ye hypocrites, ye can discern the face of the sky; but can ye not discern the signs of the times? A wicked and adulterous generation seeketh after a sign; and there shall no sign be given unto it, but the sign of the prophet Jonas. And he left them, and departed.

D. Might it not have been preferable - might it not even now be preferable - to muzzle the media politicmongers and let the research team see if anything should or can be done and advise somebody how might DO something instead of posturing? But we live in the empire of the sideshow barkers and our government is a vaudeville turn.



dionysian
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25 May 2011, 7:59 am

The author of the column wrote one of the most thoroughly sourced books I have ever read. It had mounds of research and plenty of sound advice.

http://amzn.com/0312541198

It's well worth a read. Or you can ignore it, if that's more convenient.


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Philologos
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25 May 2011, 8:45 am

Oooh, a Gore quote.

Here's the thing.

I am not personally in a position to DO the science, though I am equipped by this time in my life to make a shrewd guess as to whether a given scientist is inclined to be credible

I am not personally in a position to DO anything about the situation - whatever it proves to be, and I have lived to see a predicted ice age turn into a predicted meltdown - though if I were handed a button and reliably informed pushing it would fix things I could manage that.

I am not personally in a position to put in a position of power anyone who could DO anything, or to kick out any one who would not.

Whatever climate truth may be - and to whomever it may be inconvenient - what is inconvenient to me is that I am temporarily enmeshed in a universe and a solar system and a planetary ecology and a civilization and a country where I am barely empowered to do my job.

I am ALL too aware of what Richard Feynman said somewhere, to the effect that people would rather have a leader who claimed to be doing something than one who admitted to needing time to look into what to do.



leejosepho
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25 May 2011, 10:46 am

Philologos wrote:
... I am ALL too aware of what Richard Feynman said somewhere, to the effect that people would rather have a leader who claimed to be doing something than one who admitted to needing time to look into what to do.

Aye yes, the security of the delusion of (even eventual) control.


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ruveyn
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25 May 2011, 10:48 am

dionysian wrote:
The author of the column wrote one of the most thoroughly sourced books I have ever read. It had mounds of research and plenty of sound advice.

http://amzn.com/0312541198

It's well worth a read. Or you can ignore it, if that's more convenient.


Lots of scare there. I doubt some of it.

ruveyn



Jacoby
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25 May 2011, 11:00 am

There is a link between climate change and every weather related event that can conceivably happen according to it's believers. It's a lot like conspiracy theories where whatever disproves it is just part of conspiracy. A lot of these people who are true believers honestly think we cause earthquakes like the ones in Haiti or Japan for example, which has about the same basis in fact as homosexuals causing them.



leejosepho
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25 May 2011, 11:05 am

Jacoby wrote:
... which has about the same basis in fact as homosexuals causing them.

Ah now, do we really have to drag the queens into this?! :wink:


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Oodain
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25 May 2011, 11:15 am

Jacoby wrote:
There is a link between climate change and every weather related event that can conceivably happen according to it's believers. It's a lot like conspiracy theories where whatever disproves it is just part of conspiracy. A lot of these people who are true believers honestly think we cause earthquakes like the ones in Haiti or Japan for example, which has about the same basis in fact as homosexuals causing them.


"true believer"?
more like delusional,
there is plenty of data to support global warming, anthropogenic warming is another issue.
we certainly arent helping anything thats for sure.


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Philologos
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25 May 2011, 11:30 am

Well of course every piece of climate IS a product of any climate change [however caused] OR of any LACK of climate change [however caused].

AND I think we may agree that the climate has been in a state of constant flux since the beginning of recorded or inferable time.

And every weather incident is the outcome of that.

Which answers absolutely no questions - which I feel will not be answered so long as the media are involved [given what I know of too many academics].

AND still the weather marches on and the best we can do is seed an occasional cloud with no idea of the impact and broagcast an alert hoping the tornado will not veer.



leejosepho
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25 May 2011, 11:41 am

Philologos wrote:
... AND still the weather marches on and the best we can do is seed an occasional cloud with no idea of the impact and broagcast an alert hoping the tornado will not veer.

As an aside here: It seemed a bit surreal last night as my wife sat across the room watching live footage of a tornado moving across a terrain somewhere ...

... and of course, "Get out of its projected path!" was the most anybody had to offer.


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Philologos
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25 May 2011, 11:46 am

Which sometimes you caint't do - as the afternoon I watched dozens of small funnels zip past over head, none touching down. but nothing I could do if one did.



dionysian
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25 May 2011, 12:14 pm

Willful ignorance is probably my favorite kind.


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Philologos
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25 May 2011, 12:45 pm

I assure you that most of my ignorance is not willful. Most of my ignorance about the Chinese language and philosophies of the past 300 years is willful, of course. My ignorance about pop mod culture is semiwillful - I just don't go there.

Otherwise, though, I am always more than happy to be enlightened.

If you are in a position to provide evidence that the principles underlying weather are as simple as the basics of economics - so that I COULD evaluate the science -

OR if you can show me that I can effect climate change - even without steering tornadoes,

OR if you can show me that I can begin to persuade los politicos to do what at the moment I do not know to tell them to do..

go to it - I am more than happy to listen.

OF COURSE, despite what some people seem to have thought since timre immemorial [I never understood the "teach in" deal] access to the facts does not predict any particular conclusion.

That is not obstinacy - just I take other people'd data and do my own thinking, where I know some people who instead apply other folk's thoughts to their data.