Abortion and Original Sin

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JakobVirgil
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11 Jun 2011, 3:31 pm

If we are conceived in Sin
and are sinful by nature.
then how are the unborn innocent?

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Inuyasha
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11 Jun 2011, 3:37 pm

JakobVirgil wrote:

If we are conceived in Sin
and are sinful by nature.
then how are the unborn innocent?

Children under a certain age are considered to be innocent because they lack the understanding of right and wrong, in fact original sin does not really apply to children under a certain age due to that lack of understanding.

Vexcalibur
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11 Jun 2011, 3:39 pm

Not entirely true, Inuyasha. You may be forgetting that many of us were raised by Christians.

I can claim with certainty that a good sizable percentage of the Christian sects that are the most opposed to abortion right now, do believe people are born with the original sin.

A quick glance at wikipedia tells me:

Catholics: The sin is human nature, so you can't be considered human without being considered to have the sin (Plus baptism is very early to "fix" this ).
Protestants: Hereditary guilt
Lutherans: You inherit Adamic guilt from the moment of conception.

etc.

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Last edited by Vexcalibur on 11 Jun 2011, 3:47 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Inuyasha
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11 Jun 2011, 3:46 pm

Vexcalibur wrote:

Not true, Inuyasha. You may be forgetting that many of us were raised by Christians.

So, nope, you are born with the sin. You don't suddenly get it once you can think.

While you may have original sin, you aren't of an age that you can understand sin.

This is the idea that a period of time exists as a small child before one has the mental ability to grasp and truly understand the laws of God. During the time of innocence children are spiritually alive because God does not hold them accountable.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Coming_of_age

Vexcalibur
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11 Jun 2011, 3:48 pm

You may not understand sin, but the mainstream Christian mentality is that you have inherited the corruption and sin of man.

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dionysian
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11 Jun 2011, 3:49 pm

So we should kill all babies and small children, before they come of age. That way, they are guaranteed admittance to heaven. Otherwise, we risk letting them rot in hell. It's the only compassionate thing to do.

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JakobVirgil
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11 Jun 2011, 3:49 pm

Inuyasha wrote:

JakobVirgil wrote:

If we are conceived in Sin
and are sinful by nature.
then how are the unborn innocent?

that depends on who you are reading
conception Lutheran, Catholics and Calvinists.
from just after birth <<Link>>
twenty years old <<link>>
what age do you say?

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Inuyasha
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11 Jun 2011, 3:50 pm

Vexcalibur wrote:

You may not understand sin, but the mainstream Christian mentality is that you have inherited the corruption and sin of man.

I'm aware of that, you're missing the point.

Under Jewish and Christian beliefs God does not hold young children accountable for it, because they quite simply don't understand it.

pandabear
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11 Jun 2011, 3:55 pm

Inuyasha wrote:

Vexcalibur wrote:

You may not understand sin, but the mainstream Christian mentality is that you have inherited the corruption and sin of man.

I'm aware of that, you're missing the point.

Under Jewish and Christian beliefs God does not hold young children accountable for it, because they quite simply don't understand it.

Adam and Eve didn't understand it, either, but they were still held accountable.

"In Adam's fall, we sinned all."

Not understanding this nonsense doesn't mean that we aren't held accountable for Adam's transgression.

JakobVirgil
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11 Jun 2011, 3:58 pm

pandabear wrote:

Inuyasha wrote:

Vexcalibur wrote:

You may not understand sin, but the mainstream Christian mentality is that you have inherited the corruption and sin of man.

I'm aware of that, you're missing the point.

Under Jewish and Christian beliefs God does not hold young children accountable for it, because they quite simply don't understand it.

and remember Jewish law says abortion is not murder.
(but is a sin)

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Inuyasha
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11 Jun 2011, 4:00 pm

pandabear wrote:

Inuyasha wrote:

Vexcalibur wrote:

You may not understand sin, but the mainstream Christian mentality is that you have inherited the corruption and sin of man.

I'm aware of that, you're missing the point.

Under Jewish and Christian beliefs God does not hold young children accountable for it, because they quite simply don't understand it.

However, young children are not held accountable, just as they are not held accountable in a legal case.

JakobVirgil
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11 Jun 2011, 4:08 pm

Inuyasha wrote:

pandabear wrote:

Inuyasha wrote:

Vexcalibur wrote:

You may not understand sin, but the mainstream Christian mentality is that you have inherited the corruption and sin of man.

I'm aware of that, you're missing the point.

Under Jewish and Christian beliefs God does not hold young children accountable for it, because they quite simply don't understand it.

However, young children are not held accountable, just as they are not held accountable in a legal case.

for most of Xtianity people are accountable from conception.
why should we be held to your minority view?

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pandabear
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11 Jun 2011, 4:13 pm

Inuyasha wrote:

However, young children are not held accountable, just as they are not held accountable in a legal case.

Human legal cases do not apply to God. God punishes an individual's sin down to the seventh generation, and even further.

We are ALL guilty of Adam's sin, even though we weren't there, and were in no position to do anything to stop him.

In a human court of law, of course we would have gotten off, scott-free. But, in God's law, we are as guilty and worthy of death as our ancestor Adam himself.

OddFinn
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11 Jun 2011, 4:21 pm

JakobVirgil wrote:

If we are conceived in Sin
and are sinful by nature.
then how are the unborn innocent?

Interesting. Do you think that sinful and innocent are complements or contrary?

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Vexcalibur
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11 Jun 2011, 4:22 pm

They are at least mutually exclusive.

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pandabear
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11 Jun 2011, 4:36 pm

If there were no belief in original sin, that even fetuses are guilty of original sin, then there would have been no advantage to the immaculate conception, nor in Mary's perpetual virginity.

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