Is abortion considered murder?

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08 Jan 2012, 4:09 pm

I would consider abortion to be the murder of the unborn. This belief is not influenced by religion at all.
It is influenced by the respect for human life and scientific fact.

This website is based on scientific facts and I find it disturbing that some people don't consider abortion to be morally wrong.
:arrow: Scientific facts on abortion

Quote:

Fertilization normally takes place within one day of intercourse, but can occur up to six days later.At fertilization, the genetic composition of a preborn human is formed. This genetic information determines gender, eye color, hair color, facial features, and influences characteristics such as intelligence and personality.

Genetically speaking, with the exception of identical twins,once a woman conceives a preborn human, the odds against her conceiving the same one again are greater than 10600 to one.[36] [37] For perspective, there are roughly 1080 atoms in the known universe

I am not an extreme pro-life activist and don't necessarily think it should be illegal. I have nothing against birth control and don't ever plan on bombing any abortion clinics.

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Last edited by artrat on 08 Jan 2012, 4:12 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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08 Jan 2012, 4:11 pm

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3_gst-Ryh3g[/youtube]

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artrat
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08 Jan 2012, 4:15 pm

Is there no way to edit a poll? The first choice is not meant to be the title.

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Last edited by artrat on 08 Jan 2012, 4:17 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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08 Jan 2012, 4:16 pm

Not after votes have been cast, I believe

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08 Jan 2012, 4:47 pm

depends on your definition of murder,

if by murder you are talking about the destruction of a consciousness, generally no (depending of when you look at the fetus)

if by murder you mean the destruction of any kind of human life then yes, but all humans would be guilty of genocide were that the case, as there is no differentiation between a single cell and a functioning organism.

so decide on your definition and argue from that.

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08 Jan 2012, 5:01 pm

artrat wrote:

I am not an extreme pro-life activist and don't necessarily think it should be illegal. I have nothing against birth control and don't ever plan on bombing any abortion clinics.

I'm on the same boat as you, though I don't consider it murder since murder involves malicious intent.

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08 Jan 2012, 5:05 pm

Oodain wrote:

if by murder you mean the destruction of any kind of human life then yes, but all humans would be guilty of genocide were that the case, as there is no differentiation between a single cell and a functioning organism.

The entire human population would be worse than Adolf Hitler, Pol Pot, Nicolae Ceaușescu, Benito Mussolini, Tojo, General Pinochet and Joseph Stalin combined if that were the case (given the amount of sperm each man and woman wastes when they have sex or a man has a tug). As it is, it's clearly BS.

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08 Jan 2012, 5:13 pm

Oodain wrote:

There is the choice of weather to abort or to have a child. While the child is not yet conscience it still kills a preborn life.

People could say that it is not murder but it is the destruction of a human life. The genetic composition is determined within six days of fertilization.

Instead of aborting a human life more people should use birth control and protection during sex.

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08 Jan 2012, 5:23 pm

I don't consider abortion murder and I am confused by your standpoint.

"At fertilization, the genetic composition of a preborn human is formed."

So.... what's your point??? OH MY GOODNESS! WE HAVE GENES... ergo.... person????? Not everything with human genes is a person. A dead person still has human genes. Unique human genes in fact, but they are NOT a person. If we kept that person's liver alive and burned the rest, then that liver will have unique human genes BUT it is still not a person. The point can be flogged endlessly down this direction as well, as uniqueness is definitely not sufficient to prove a single iota here, which gets me thinking that this is really some form of mysticism/essentialism/other thing-ism.

Look the basic issue is that I know what a person is through something very basic: I am empirically introduced to a class of entities I can consider "persons". This includes seeing people and their behavior. This includes interacting with them and communicating with them. This includes reading narratives, where the introspective qualities of these "persons" are shown. This even includes scientific analysis of the brain functions of these entities. The issue is that none of these really seem to be the same for fetuses/zygotes/etc. I mean, when we talk about brain function, we don't mean the mere existence of electrical impulses, or some autonomous thumb-sucking, we instead refer to a set of cognitive processes including a broad array of advanced introspective and perceptual and rational abilities, and these simply don't exist for most of the things we end up aborting.

Honestly, I am confused by most of the people who do consider abortion murder.

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08 Jan 2012, 5:46 pm

artrat wrote:

Oodain wrote:

potential is not actual.

i might have the potential to invent controlled fusion but untill that at least imparts on reality in any serious way it is not controlled fusion in any way.
i agree protection adn birth control is the right solution if you dont want a child but it isnt a hundred percent effective and sometimes accidents happen.

nor should abortion be taken lightly, it will affect a womans body for months afterwards and not in a good way either, the hormone storm the body started doesnt simply die down.

to think how many children are abused either physically or mentally because of maladjusted parents i think we should encourage serious thought about when and how one wants to have children.
i would much rather see a set of parents have an early abortion and then later choose to have a child, ensuring the best of intentions towards that child.

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08 Jan 2012, 5:51 pm

Awesomelyglorious wrote:

It is the destruction of genetic composition which will eventually lead to a human life.

The mother was given the right to live so why should the child have that right stolen form them?

If you were thinking that I actually believed in mysticism then you are wrong. It's just my morals and respect for life that defend my views of abortion.

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08 Jan 2012, 5:57 pm

artrat wrote:

the genetic code is not the diferntiating factor here, nor is life.

as said before you would have to acknowledge yourself as a murderer were that the case.

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08 Jan 2012, 6:19 pm

It's not a human life, it's a bunch of cells with some electrical activity. What it could potentially be doesn't change reality. It's a long 9 months road which has a great effect on the to-be-baby as well. The fetus is no better than that chicken you had for dinner
People should abort more. It's not about a life, it's about the quality of one's life. If people viewed life in a more practical way the world would be much better. You have to assume responsibility for your children, it's not like it's a great privilege just to be alive. Fetus does not have any rights whatsoever. But that chicken, on the other hand, does! Did.. So much for that respect for life.

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Honestly, I am confused by most of the people who do consider abortion murder.

Exactly, it's just so odd.

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08 Jan 2012, 6:29 pm

mar00 wrote:

So when did you become human? At what point would you're opinion have changed from, "it's Ok to abort me" to "it's not Ok for me to be aborted/life terminated"?

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08 Jan 2012, 6:45 pm

There is the analogy of a lifeboat tied to a sinking ship that everyone is trying to board. It can't fit everyone onto the boat. The choice of the lifeboat captain is will they cut the rope keeping it attached to the sinking ship and save the lives of those who have managed to make it to the lifeboat. Or will they stay and try to rescue as many people as they can.

I believe the person who originally came up with this scenario believed that the person who loves life is the one who cuts the rope and leaves rather then waits for the lifeboat to be overwhelmed or be taken down with the sinking boat and having everyone killed.

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08 Jan 2012, 7:03 pm

well.. I think it is killing a human but depends on the situation if its murder or not.. Sometimes it is necessary if the child would have a V.poor quality of life.. like missing several orgens I am not talking PDDs or if the child is causing the mother to die.. there is no point letting both of them die..

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