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Why was Ted Haggard so stupid
He wasn't able to think clearly 25%  25%  [ 2 ]
Because of his Christian values, he HONESTLY wanted to pay for his action 0%  0%  [ 0 ]
Even if he tried his best to hide it, upon investigation it would of been found out anyway 13%  13%  [ 1 ]
He was trying to "balance" between the risk of being found guilty verses a rist of being found a liar, and the combination of these made him inconsistant 38%  38%  [ 3 ]
He was just worried about wellbeing of the church that he found 0%  0%  [ 0 ]
Other 25%  25%  [ 2 ]
Total votes : 8

Roman
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07 Nov 2006, 5:26 pm

First of all, I am not on his side at all, as a Christian I oppose homosexuality and I think it is good that he was exposed. But, appart from actual issues at hand, there is a part for me where I want both sides to play hardest. I personally would of liked it much better if he kept insisting that he doesn't know the guy UNTILL he would be forced to admit it by compelling evidence, such as voicemail or whatever. What is even more ridiculous is that he admitted the charges on Thursday and then he was still denying it Friday morning. That is something I have no idea how to make logical sense of at all. Okay, I can try to defend admission of charges by saying that if there is a good chance that they will come out anyways, it would be "slightly" better if at least a person admitted it himself. But if this is trully what he was thinking, then WHY was he AGAIN denying it Friday morning? So based on his denials on Friday morning, he was obviuosly still hopping to hide things. If such be the case then WHY did he admit it on Thursday?

I also have no idea why did he take a leave from his office. I would cite his own words that he wanted "overseer process to proceed with integrity". In other words, he is worried that if he were in the office, he would of been able to interfere with it, and he wants to prevent himself from interfearing. This sounds like multiple personality to me. Okay, lets try to find some other reason why he did it. May be he was thinking that even if someone is NOT guilty of a particular accusation, it is still "good manner" to resign anyway just for the sake of unity in congregation or whatever, so he wanted to display good manner and thus hope that it would help him to win. NOPE, that doesn't work either. Everyone in as high position as he is get THOUSANDS political motivated accusations, especially before voting. So do they all resign every single time they are accused of something by one person? No. So, all he should have done was to say "I don't knwo that guy, and I won't spent my time worrying about the bs" and then stay in his office and continue the work. And, while in the office, he would easilly prevent the truth from being known since he said himself that he would be "compromising integrity of overseer process".

And even if he did admit to seeing the escort, there could have been a number of excuses he could have made:

1)Since he maintains that he didn't have sex and only had massage, why on earth did he admit that massage was sexually motivated? He could have simply said he was getting massage for health reasons. And why male escort? Well he would do a better job since, being gay, he was attracted to Huggard, so this would "inspire" him.

2)Being a STRAIGHT man he was keeping the escort from having sex with gays, which was part of his mission. After all, escort himself doesn't need sex, he needs money. His problem is that no one would willingly give him money without sex. So, if someone comes alone and says "look I am going to pay you for NOT having sex with anyone else", that would be a great way of keeping the escort from immortality. Furthermore it would serve Christian mission "take what you have and give it to the poor". Escort is probably poor and needs money, right? And then of course while he is there he doesn't have much to do, so why not get a massage, just for health reasons.



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07 Nov 2006, 5:53 pm

He knew he would get caught eventually and basically admitted it (although not to the entirety of the charges made) once he realized that would be less time-consuming and less damaging to his reputation, which would already be mostly damaged.

As for the conjecture that he paid the man for sex to prevent him from having sex with anyone else and paid him for the meth to prevent someone else from using the meth, surely Haggard would have said already that that was his motive.



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07 Nov 2006, 5:59 pm

I am certain he had sex with this escort and that there was indeed daming evidence against him that he did not want made public in the face of his denials. I'm sorry, but you don't see the same escort for a year+ just for a massage or for the purchase of drugs you "throw away." What I found galling was that he half admitted it but then made up (IMO) the story of "just a massage" and throwing away the drugs.

This was a gay man who didn't want to lose his immense power or blow his cover of a perfect family man.



Roman
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07 Nov 2006, 6:11 pm

xon wrote:
He knew he would get caught eventually and basically admitted it (although not to the entirety of the charges made) once he realized that would be less time-consuming and less damaging to his reputation, which would already be mostly damaged.


Even if he got caught eventually, it would fo been psychologically better because he would of been able to say to himself "at least I try my best". But right now he is sitting and thinking "what if I lied ... then I would of had a chance to cover it".

xon wrote:
As for the conjecture that he paid the man for sex to prevent him from having sex with anyone else and paid him for the meth to prevent someone else from using the meth, surely Haggard would have said already that that was his motive.


I never said this was the case. I said why didn't he make up a lie that it was a case? I mean, if he did, it would of given him a chance to cover his ass and stay in the office.



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07 Nov 2006, 6:38 pm

I could care less what hole he chooses to insert Tab A into. Not my business.
Matter of fact, really, none of it's my business. I'm not a part of his congregation and I was in no way affected by his actions.
That said, I think he's a utter ret*d. Yet another religious leader being exposed for what he really is, a lying hypocritical douchebag and a spiritual successor to Falwell, Baker, Swaggart, et al.
I don't buy the 'i bought it just to throw it away' excuse, sorry. Reminds me of Clintons' "I smoked it but I didn't inhale" in which case he was either a poseur trying to look cool who lacked the courage of his convictions, or he did inhale and is a liar.
I refuse to criticise someone for using drugs, since I choose to do so as well. I WILL criticise and mock unmercifully those who use drugs while a)denying it vigorously, and b)telling others that they will presumably go to hell for doing so.
I think he could have done a lot to salvage some shreds of credibility had he just admitted to it from the start and not made up denial after denial. It only served to make him look like a moron. Well, even more of a moron.
This, in my mind, is an object lesson in why repression is bad, and even more so why religious repression is bad.



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07 Nov 2006, 7:42 pm

While I personally delight in this revelation and his admittance of it he played it all the wrong way. At first I thought it was a set up and I think he should have played up that angle to try to play it down and frankly till he opened his mouth don't think it would have been hard among his constituents maybe in the public at at large but not with them but as it stands his career is over. His saying he didn't use the drugs is as bad as Clinton's I didn't inhale I don't buy it at all


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07 Nov 2006, 7:54 pm

i'm sorry but this is what christians get for acting better than everyone else. the bigger they are the harder they fall


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07 Nov 2006, 8:00 pm

Roman wrote:
2)Being a STRAIGHT man he was keeping the escort from having sex with gays, which was part of his mission. After all, escort himself doesn't need sex, he needs money. His problem is that no one would willingly give him money without sex. So, if someone comes alone and says "look I am going to pay you for NOT having sex with anyone else", that would be a great way of keeping the escort from immortality. Furthermore it would serve Christian mission "take what you have and give it to the poor". Escort is probably poor and needs money, right? And then of course while he is there he doesn't have much to do, so why not get a massage, just for health reasons.
okay this is the dumbest thing i've ever heard in my life. he f****d him, end of story. he wasnt paying him to save him from immorality, give me a break. my whole problem with this guy is he rubbed elbows with politicians, and prolly got a few laws passed in his favor when he was really leading a double life.


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Last edited by richardbenson on 07 Nov 2006, 8:02 pm, edited 1 time in total.

diseased
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07 Nov 2006, 8:01 pm

S'not limited just to Christians, dude.
Tho, granted, I can't recall the last time I heard of a mullah doin' meth with a male hooker.
Or a lama.
Or a brahmin.
Not saying it couldn't happen tho.



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07 Nov 2006, 8:04 pm

oh i know its not limited to just christans, it goes for everyone.


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07 Nov 2006, 8:05 pm

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as a Christian I oppose homosexuality and I think it is good that he was exposed.

I stopped reading there. It's disgusting how people like you use religion to justify bigotry. As an Aspie, you should know better than to judge others based on circumstances beyond their control.



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07 Nov 2006, 8:07 pm

When I found out about Pastor Ted's little indescretion, I laughed. Out loud. And I am enjoying his crash-and-burn. He has been exposed as a hypocrite whose "sin" makes those of Jimmy Swaggart (female prostitutes) and Jimmy Bakker (female secretary) look positively wholesome by comparison. :D


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07 Nov 2006, 8:16 pm

hahaha i found it to be pretty funny. i'm sure theres alot more just like him in the church, they just havent been discoverd yet


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Roman
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07 Nov 2006, 9:38 pm

richardbenson wrote:
Roman wrote:
2)Being a STRAIGHT man he was keeping the escort from having sex with gays, which was part of his mission. After all, escort himself doesn't need sex, he needs money. His problem is that no one would willingly give him money without sex. So, if someone comes alone and says "look I am going to pay you for NOT having sex with anyone else", that would be a great way of keeping the escort from immortality. Furthermore it would serve Christian mission "take what you have and give it to the poor". Escort is probably poor and needs money, right? And then of course while he is there he doesn't have much to do, so why not get a massage, just for health reasons.
okay this is the dumbest thing i've ever heard in my life. he f**k him, end of story. he wasnt paying him to save him from immorality, give me a break. my whole problem with this guy is he rubbed elbows with politicians, and prolly got a few laws passed in his favor when he was really leading a double life.


First of all, I am NOT talking about what is true. I am only talking of what kind of LIE he COULD have made that would of saved his face.

THis being said, lets look at his logic. Since he continues to deny he had sex with him, obviously he believes that he can get away with this particular lie. If such be the case, then the logical conclusion is that the truth about him having sex won't be an obstacle for the possible lines of deception I was describing in this post. In other words, I don't see a reason as to why he didn't pursue these lies.



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07 Nov 2006, 9:49 pm

Roman wrote:
richardbenson wrote:
Roman wrote:
2)Being a STRAIGHT man he was keeping the escort from having sex with gays, which was part of his mission. After all, escort himself doesn't need sex, he needs money. His problem is that no one would willingly give him money without sex. So, if someone comes alone and says "look I am going to pay you for NOT having sex with anyone else", that would be a great way of keeping the escort from immortality. Furthermore it would serve Christian mission "take what you have and give it to the poor". Escort is probably poor and needs money, right? And then of course while he is there he doesn't have much to do, so why not get a massage, just for health reasons.
okay this is the dumbest thing i've ever heard in my life. he f**k him, end of story. he wasnt paying him to save him from immorality, give me a break. my whole problem with this guy is he rubbed elbows with politicians, and prolly got a few laws passed in his favor when he was really leading a double life.
First of all, I am NOT talking about what is true. I am only talking of what kind of LIE he COULD have made that would of saved his face.
THis being said, lets look at his logic. Since he continues to deny he had sex with him, obviously he believes that he can get away with this particular lie. If such be the case, then the logical conclusion is that the truth about him having sex won't be an obstacle for the possible lines of deception I was describing in this post. In other words, I don't see a reason as to why he didn't pursue these lies.
thanks you christain, for proving my point. how do your ways lead you to heaven? at first he denied it, but then in a publicly read letter to his congregasion he confessed to everything. wow. amazing. the end. i really wished jesus would have written the new testement instead of men.


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Roman
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07 Nov 2006, 9:55 pm

richardbenson wrote:
Roman wrote:
richardbenson wrote:
Roman wrote:
2)Being a STRAIGHT man he was keeping the escort from having sex with gays, which was part of his mission. After all, escort himself doesn't need sex, he needs money. His problem is that no one would willingly give him money without sex. So, if someone comes alone and says "look I am going to pay you for NOT having sex with anyone else", that would be a great way of keeping the escort from immortality. Furthermore it would serve Christian mission "take what you have and give it to the poor". Escort is probably poor and needs money, right? And then of course while he is there he doesn't have much to do, so why not get a massage, just for health reasons.
okay this is the dumbest thing i've ever heard in my life. he f**k him, end of story. he wasnt paying him to save him from immorality, give me a break. my whole problem with this guy is he rubbed elbows with politicians, and prolly got a few laws passed in his favor when he was really leading a double life.

First of all, I am NOT talking about what is true. I am only talking of what kind of LIE he COULD have made that would of saved his face.
THis being said, lets look at his logic. Since he continues to deny he had sex with him, obviously he believes that he can get away with this particular lie. If such be the case, then the logical conclusion is that the truth about him having sex won't be an obstacle for the possible lines of deception I was describing in this post. In other words, I don't see a reason as to why he didn't pursue these lies.
thanks you christain, for proving my point. how do your ways lead you to heaven? at first he denied it, but then in a publicly read letter to his congregasion he confessed to everything. wow. amazing. the end. i really wished jesus would have written the new testement instead of men.


Okay lets get biblical. Jesus said in Matt 7:13 that FEW people are saved. Now look at how many Christians are there, far from few. So how can I answer this paradox? The case of Ted Haggard helped me out: the answer is that most Christians are hypocritical and don't mean it. So I am glad that Ted Haggard did what he did, I just found out an answer to the question that was bothering me for so long, it really strengthened my Christian faith.