What exactly is the Christian afterlife / heaven?
I'm curious as to what Christians believe is their final fate. I gather that different branches of Christianity have entirely different beliefs regarding what they think the afterlife or heaven is.
Note: This thread isn't intended to ridicule Christian beliefs; I'm just curious as to what Christians themselves believe the afterlife / heaven is.
Someone mentioned in another thread that some Christians believe that they will be without gender in heaven. This sounds quite bizarre to me. Aside from not having sex in heaven does this mean that their heavenly bodies will not have breasts or genital organs? What about the distinguishing facial features that mark the biological difference between men and women? Will people no longer look the same in the afterlife?
All I've heard about the Christian heaven is the stereotype of sitting on a cloud and playing a harp all day singing hymns and praising God. I'm sure no Christians believe this to be true?
Does heaven look like Earth with buildings, trees, grass and animals? What about cars, roads, trains etc? Do people still work raising crops and manufacturing things?
If there are animals will carnivores and omnivores still kill and eat other smaller animals? Will birds still catch, kill and eat worms? Will cats still catch, kill and eat birds? Will dogs still chase cats? I've heard some Christians say the lion will lay down with the lamb and both will be vegetarians.
Do people eat and go to the toilet in heaven?
Do people still remain with their family members, do they live together in heavenly houses? What happens with people who remarry after the death of a spouse and have more children - which spouse do they live with in heaven?
How do they pass their time? An eternity of anything sounds insanely boring to me.
So, what exactly is the Christian afterlife / heaven?
_________________
I've left WP indefinitely.
Last edited by TallyMan on 12 Dec 2012, 8:25 am, edited 1 time in total.
Okay, no simple questions today...
One of the best books on this subject is Randy Alcorn's "Heaven". Considering Alcorn is mainly known as a financial expert in Christian circles, I was surprised at how good this book was when it came out a few years ago.
The web site SermonAudio.com has a series of talks by Maurice Roberts on heaven, which were later put into book form. I'm too lazy to go through the site and find links, but they're not hard to find. Edward Donnelly has some, too, which were also put into book form. Both are excellent looks at what Reformed Protestants believe.
The Roman Catholic Catechism has their beliefs spelled out. It's online and not hard to find. The tiny book "Justified By Faith Alone" by RC Sproul has an excellent summary on the difference between Roman Catholic and Protestant Christianity. Sproul is Reformed, but covers both perspectives concisely. (You could find everything he says in the RC Catechism, but it would take a long time.)
When I say Protestant, I mean historic Protestant beliefs. If you want some of the most lunatic insane crazy stuff you've ever heard, try the Pentecostal and Word of Faith movement. Almost everyone has been to heaven for a visit, and they all write books and give talks about it, and they say some gonzo nutty stuff.
I don't know. I've never been there.
The answer to every specific question you asked though, is "No." Every example includes physical elements. There are no physical elements in the spiritual realm.
What it is exactly, is beyond human understanding.
There is plenty I know it is not, but as for what it really is like, I don't know.
Physical elements are used to describe it to humans, who are physical beings, in symbolic and illustrative ways, because our minds are physical entities, and are not equipped to "envision" the non physical accurately in any way but physical representations.
The only thing I can say positively, is that in heaven and the spiritual realm, doubt of its existence does not exist.
_________________
I'm not likely to be around much longer. As before when I first signed up here years ago, I'm finding that after a long hiatus, and after only a few days back on here, I'm spending way too much time here again already. So I'm requesting my account be locked, banned or whatever. It's just time. Until then, well, I dunno...
Would you envisage that people would retain their individuality albeit in another "spirit" form i.e. would the individual retain their personality and memories of their earthly life?
_________________
I've left WP indefinitely.
Would you envisage that people would retain their individuality albeit in another "spirit" form i.e. would the individual retain their personality and memories of their earthly life?
Yes. But I did miss that you asked about family and marriage, and was just working on an answer to that too. That's a pretty important thing, but among certain churches, there is some controversy over this.
_________________
I'm not likely to be around much longer. As before when I first signed up here years ago, I'm finding that after a long hiatus, and after only a few days back on here, I'm spending way too much time here again already. So I'm requesting my account be locked, banned or whatever. It's just time. Until then, well, I dunno...
I was impressed by the 1971 Night Gallery episode "Hell's Bells" (season 2, episode 29) where a hippie dies and ends up in a waiting room with a record player with a tall stack of easy listening music. Then he meets an old man who loves to chat but only talks about boring stuff, and a couple who start showing thousands of slides from their vacation trip. The hippie wants to get out of the waiting room and into Hell. The devil tells him that for him this room IS hell (it's never what you expect), but the exact same room exists in Heaven where it is some people's idea of a pleasant afterlife.
_________________
"When you ride over sharps, you get flats!"--The Bicycling Guitarist, May 13, 2008
I missed one series of questions. Marriage is a human arrangement. Spiritual beings are asexual, or to be more specific, are not male or female, but possess spiritual traits of both sexes. Even god does. Despite the fact that the bible refers to him as "he." "He" is referred to several times over in the bible as possessing traits of both male and female physical beings. He is referred to as "Father," and is also referred to as a mother hen by Jesus.
Genesis 1: 27 clearly indicates that both man and woman were created in his image.
"So God created mankind in his own image,
in the image of God he created them;
male and female he created them."
The make up of the human body reflects this. Both sexes possess the chemistries of both sexes, only the amounts of each and how they function are different. Marriage is described as two becoming "one flesh." Since both sexes were created in his image, he possesses equal traits of both sexes, but in a spiritual sense, not a chemical one. Two humans of opposite sexes becoming one is a reflection of his completeness. This is not necessary in heaven, since spiritual beings possess equal traits of both already.
The simplest way to explain that the marriage arrangement doesn't exist in heaven is to point out the story related at the beginning of Genesis chapter 6, where "The sons of god' came to earth to marry and have sexual relations with humans. Were marriage, sex, and family arrangements existent in heaven, this would not have been necessary. One would think that spiritual experiences of this kind would be far more powerful as spirits than as human beings. Obviously, since they chose to come here, there was something in that arrangement they could not experience in heaven.
The question that remains however, is whether humans who go to heaven would retain their sexuality and marital arrangements after arriving. The answer can be found in Matthew 22:30: "At the resurrection people will neither marry nor be given in marriage; they will be like the angels in heaven."
_________________
I'm not likely to be around much longer. As before when I first signed up here years ago, I'm finding that after a long hiatus, and after only a few days back on here, I'm spending way too much time here again already. So I'm requesting my account be locked, banned or whatever. It's just time. Until then, well, I dunno...
Aspiewordsmith
Veteran
Joined: 2 Nov 2008
Age: 59
Gender: Male
Posts: 572
Location: United Kingdom, England, Berkshire, Reading
Personally, I don't even try to imagine what it is "like." It's impossible anyway, and no imaginary vision of what it is will ever give me an idea of the reality.
_________________
I'm not likely to be around much longer. As before when I first signed up here years ago, I'm finding that after a long hiatus, and after only a few days back on here, I'm spending way too much time here again already. So I'm requesting my account be locked, banned or whatever. It's just time. Until then, well, I dunno...
My interpretation of "heaven" is a world or realm where there is no sickness, disease or death.
"Heaven" by definition, is Utopian. I would imagine "Heaven" to be a place where I would meet my grandparents.
Best Regards,
Jake
_________________
In The Morning to all Hams on the air, ships at sea, boots on the grounds, drones in the sky and all the Human Resources charged up and ready to go just the way the Government wants you to be..
There is no real description of heaven in the bible, other than it being joyful and free of torment. "There will be no husbands and wives... heaven is simply beyond your comprehension." No, I can't say where that was... new testament in a conversation with Jesus asking who will be husband to the woman who's been widowed 3-4 times.
I also like the fact that death is referred to as "sleep" many, many times - and that our loved ones who've died before us are not tortured by watching we who remain here be tortured by evil (human and otherwise.) Rather, they simply remain in a blissful sleep until the second-coming where ALL are resurrected at the same time. (That's also more fair... why should some people get eternity PLUS 1y for dying a year earlier?)
I won't go much further... I hope the ridiculers will at least temper their comments a little instead of spitting insults like children.
