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LKL
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29 Sep 2013, 3:12 pm

It's important, but it's not really an outlier in terms of presidential behavior or US meddling in other countries.



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29 Sep 2013, 7:28 pm

It's about as relevant to today's events as Watergate or the Kennedy Assassinations.



FrankiDelano
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29 Sep 2013, 9:01 pm

It's important we learn about these events so we're not doomed to repeat them.



Cilantro
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29 Sep 2013, 9:07 pm

FrankiDelano wrote:
It's important we learn about these events so we're not doomed to repeat them.


Is the average citizen going to be crucial in major political events? Only as far as understanding the effects of their vote and participating. Excuse us for having jobs, educations, families and more that's more pressing. If it's not history we're nagged about not knowing enough about for our own good, it's nutrition, technology, production, environment, etc. Lose-lose.



appletheclown
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29 Sep 2013, 9:13 pm

Cilantro wrote:
FrankiDelano wrote:
It's important we learn about these events so we're not doomed to repeat them.


Is the average citizen going to be crucial in major political events? Only as far as understanding the effects of their vote and participating. Excuse us for having jobs, educations, families and more that's more pressing. If it's not history we're nagged about not knowing enough about for our own good, it's nutrition, technology, etc. Lose-lose.

Defensive. We supported Osama when Russia invaded Afganistan. We supported Lybian Rebels, now the Muslim Brotherhood controls it (kind of like the taliban). We support Syria and overthrow another leader who at least keeps Al-qaeda out, it happens over and over and over. Frank has a point, a very good one.


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Cilantro
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29 Sep 2013, 9:22 pm

appletheclown wrote:
Cilantro wrote:
FrankiDelano wrote:
It's important we learn about these events so we're not doomed to repeat them.


Is the average citizen going to be crucial in major political events? Only as far as understanding the effects of their vote and participating. Excuse us for having jobs, educations, families and more that's more pressing. If it's not history we're nagged about not knowing enough about for our own good, it's nutrition, technology, etc. Lose-lose.

Defensive. We supported Osama when Russia invaded Afganistan. We supported Lybian Rebels, now the Muslim Brotherhood controls it (kind of like the taliban). We support Syria and overthrow another leader who at least keeps Al-qaeda out, it happens over and over and over. Frank has a point, a very good one.


Between general life upkeep, time to sleep, and countless more personal concerns, what does Frank want the average American to do and what is Frank doing about it?

I'm not discounting its value, but we're addressing a hundred other problems in our own homes and backyards. Some people choose to be concerned with healthcare, some choose to be concerned with the environment, some choose to work to end domestic violence and child abuse, and some are keen on keeping up with the finer points of what their country is up to elsewhere, but nobody can effectively understand and deal with all these and more. Nobody has time to research and address everything they're "supposed" to know, lest the generation be flawed or ignorant.

If someone wants it to be known they should work to make the lesson clear and accessible to people who may already be quite burdened, not sigh about how we're doomed to repeat the mistake because we didn't seek out that knowledge.



sonofghandi
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02 Oct 2013, 10:51 am

Fnord wrote:
It's about as relevant to today's events as Watergate or the Kennedy Assassinations.


So very little actual relevance?


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02 Oct 2013, 12:36 pm

FrankiDelano wrote:
It's important we learn about these events so we're not doomed to repeat them.


We are doomed to repeat them!



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02 Oct 2013, 12:43 pm

It's very important to understand the patterns of recent history. If you know some pattern of recent history, you can look at the present and ask yourself "how likely is it that the pattern has just now decided to stop"? The odds are not very good. There is every likelihood that the pattern is still going on.

For example, take the Iraq War. Imagine if, just before the Iraq War, the US citizens collectively asked themselves, "what percentage of recent US wars were started by the US government lying to its citizens"? The percentage is very high. So, chances are, the Iraq War was going to be another one. And it was, but people realised it too late.



Mindsigh
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02 Oct 2013, 2:41 pm

Declension wrote:
It's very important to understand the patterns of recent history. If you know some pattern of recent history, you can look at the present and ask yourself "how likely is it that the pattern has just now decided to stop"? The odds are not very good. There is every likelihood that the pattern is still going on.

For example, take the Iraq War. Imagine if, just before the Iraq War, the US citizens collectively asked themselves, "what percentage of recent US wars were started by the US government lying to its citizens"? The percentage is very high. So, chances are, the Iraq War was going to be another one. And it was, but people realised it too late.


Waaay too late. I still can't believe that jingoistic redneck got a 2nd term. :cat:


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