02 Feb 2014, 9:10 pm
03 Feb 2014, 12:35 am
Did you read all of that n the Bible, or did you figure it all out yourself?
Slavery, the subjugation of women, and conquest by genocide were three of the Biblical principles that America was founded upon.
That neither the prophets, the apostles, nor Jesus spoke out against any of these things plainly indicates that these were not objectionable to those who wrote (and re-wrote) the Bible.
That these very same practices were common among even "God's Chosen People" makes it obvious that not only were there no objections to these practices, but that they had God's own approval.
It's all right there in the Bible; so don't lie to me and tell me that it isn't.
Christianity is the religion of slave-owners, wife-beaters, and those who commit mass murder to possess the land.
"God, Guns, and Guts" indeed! So much for yet another "religion of peace". 
03 Feb 2014, 1:11 am
03 Feb 2014, 1:23 am
DentArthurDent
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Age: 59
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03 Feb 2014, 5:09 am
Fnord wrote:
Did you read all of that n the Bible, or did you figure it all out yourself?
Slavery, the subjugation of women, and conquest by genocide were three of the Biblical principles that America was founded upon.
That neither the prophets, the apostles, nor Jesus spoke out against any of these things plainly indicates that these were not objectionable to those who wrote (and re-wrote) the Bible.
Slavery, the subjugation of women, and conquest by genocide were three of the Biblical principles that America was founded upon.
That neither the prophets, the apostles, nor Jesus spoke out against any of these things plainly indicates that these were not objectionable to those who wrote (and re-wrote) the Bible.
Hmm not only did they not speak out against slavery they endorsed it.
Paul - Bondservants, be obedient to those who are your masters according to the flesh, with fear and trembling, in sincerity of heart, as to Christ; Ephesians 6:5
Jesus - And that servant who knew his master's will but did not get ready or act according to his will, will receive a severe beating. 48 But the one who did not know, and did what deserved a
beating, will receive a light beating. Everyone to whom much was given, of him much will be required, and from him to whom they entrusted much, they will demand the more
Luke 12:47-48
Paul - "Tell slaves to be submissive to their masters and to give satisfaction in every respect; they are not to talk back, not to pilfer, but to show complete and perfect fidelity, so that in
everything they may be an ornament to the doctrine of God our Savior." Titus 2:9-10
nd they sung as it were a new song before the throne, and before the four beasts, and the elders: and no man could learn that song but the hundred and forty and four thousand, which were redeemed from the earth. These are they which were not defiled with women; for they are virgins.
Peter - Servants, be submissive to your masters with all respect, not only to those who are good and gentle, but also to those who are unreasonable. 1 Peter 2:18
As to the prophets the OT is full of the justification of slavery and the damnation of 50% of the human race
As for the attitude toward women the NT is replete with misogynistic diatribe.
Peter - and they sung as it were a new song before the throne, and before the four beasts, and the elders: and no man could learn that song but the hundred and forty and four thousand,
which were redeemed from the earth.These are they which were not defiled with women; for they are virgins. Revelation 14:1-4 - kind of says it all really
Fnord wrote:
Moviefan2k4 wrote:
"God, Guns, and Guts made America; let's keep all three"
indeed! So much for yet another "religion of peace". Yep I have ignored this for fear of being accused of a personal attack, but this sig line does not seem to represent the ideal of christianity as portrayed by christians, but then again, when you read the new testament, maybe it does.
03 Feb 2014, 5:41 am
Fnord wrote:
Did you read all of that n the Bible, or did you figure it all out yourself?
A combination of both; I don't see the two as mutually exclusive.Quote:
Slavery, the subjugation of women, and conquest by genocide were three of the Biblical principles that America was founded upon.
Actually, Jesus respected women more than anyone else did in His earthly life, including the super-religious Pharisees. There are two different forms of "slavery" in Scripture, so you'd have to clarify which one you're referencing here. Thirdly, its true that many have used the name of God to try and hide their horrible rampages...but that doesn't mean Jesus approved of or endorsed it. Also, the Crusades were nothing compared to all the bloodbaths the Muslims did across a 1400-year timespan in Asia and Europe; I saw this video yesterday which was pretty interesting.[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t_Qpy0mXg8Y[/youtube]
Quote:
That neither the prophets, the apostles, nor Jesus spoke out against any of these things plainly indicates that these were not objectionable to those who wrote (and re-wrote) the Bible.
Jesus spoke out against all kinds of sin, but His main purpose was securing eternal redemption with God for all who wanted it and were willing to trust Him.Quote:
That these very same practices were common among even "God's Chosen People" makes it obvious that not only were there no objections to these practices, but that they had God's own approval.
I've said it many times, so you might want to listen: the abuse of a principle does not warrant its disuse.Quote:
It's all right there in the Bible; so don't lie to me and tell me that it isn't.
Examples?Quote:
Christianity is the religion of slave-owners, wife-beaters, and those who commit mass murder to possess the land.
That is a gross mischaracterization, and way too broad for any kind of intelligent debate. If you want to discuss actual issues instead of hurling insults, you know where to PM me.Quote:
"God, Guns, and Guts" indeed! So much for yet another "religion of peace".
My signature is a reference to the Founders' faith in Jesus, their adherence to the Second Amendment, and the courage of all who stand for what the United States should be. Your attack on it is a perversion of my intent, and I suspect that's a deliberate tactic on your part.
03 Feb 2014, 10:20 am
You guys didn't watch the videos that I had posted, did you? 
I'll see if I can briefly summarize the arguments against Jesus having been a real person who grew up in Galilee and was crucified in Jerusalem.
The earliest parts of the New Testament were letters attributed to Paul (and possibly others). Nowhere does Paul make any reference to a Jesus who appeared on Earth in human form: his Jesus is strictly a spiritual being.
The Gospel prophecies concerning the destruction of Jerusalem and the coming of the Son of Man referred to Titus. "Remember, all of these things will happen before the people now living have died." So, the authors set the crucifixion of Jesus to occur exactly 40 years before the destruction of Jerusalem. The 3-year ministry of Jesus paralleled the 3-year war between the Romans and the Jews. The march of Jesus from Galilee to Jerusalem followed the same path as the Roman march from Galilee to Jerusalem.
The tone of the gospels is anti-Jewish and pro-Roman. "Pay your taxes, turn the other cheek, and, if a Roman soldier orders you to carry his pack one mile, then carry it two miles" would be consistent with the goal of making the Christians obedient and untroublesome to the Roman "patriarchy."
A lot of the material in the Gospels is simply repeats of material from the Old Testament, or things taken from other religions of the time.
03 Feb 2014, 10:35 am
03 Feb 2014, 10:55 am
03 Feb 2014, 11:03 am
03 Feb 2014, 11:25 am
03 Feb 2014, 11:38 am
ArrantPariah wrote:
You guys didn't watch the videos that I had posted, did you?
I'll see if I can briefly summarize the arguments against Jesus having been a real person who grew up in Galilee and was crucified in Jerusalem.
The earliest parts of the New Testament were letters attributed to Paul (and possibly others). Nowhere does Paul make any reference to a Jesus who appeared on Earth in human form: his Jesus is strictly a spiritual being.
The Gospel prophecies concerning the destruction of Jerusalem and the coming of the Son of Man referred to Titus. "Remember, all of these things will happen before the people now living have died." So, the authors set the crucifixion of Jesus to occur exactly 40 years before the destruction of Jerusalem. The 3-year ministry of Jesus paralleled the 3-year war between the Romans and the Jews. The march of Jesus from Galilee to Jerusalem followed the same path as the Roman march from Galilee to Jerusalem.
The tone of the gospels is anti-Jewish and pro-Roman. "Pay your taxes, turn the other cheek, and, if a Roman soldier orders you to carry his pack one mile, then carry it two miles" would be consistent with the goal of making the Christians obedient and untroublesome to the Roman "patriarchy."
A lot of the material in the Gospels is simply repeats of material from the Old Testament, or things taken from other religions of the time.
Oh, and the crucifixion story itself was just taken from Josephus' history. During the war, Josephus saw three of his friends being crucified, and asked Titus to let them down. Two of them died, and one survived. This was the basis of the New Testament crucifixion story.
I'll see if I can briefly summarize the arguments against Jesus having been a real person who grew up in Galilee and was crucified in Jerusalem.
The earliest parts of the New Testament were letters attributed to Paul (and possibly others). Nowhere does Paul make any reference to a Jesus who appeared on Earth in human form: his Jesus is strictly a spiritual being.
The Gospel prophecies concerning the destruction of Jerusalem and the coming of the Son of Man referred to Titus. "Remember, all of these things will happen before the people now living have died." So, the authors set the crucifixion of Jesus to occur exactly 40 years before the destruction of Jerusalem. The 3-year ministry of Jesus paralleled the 3-year war between the Romans and the Jews. The march of Jesus from Galilee to Jerusalem followed the same path as the Roman march from Galilee to Jerusalem.
The tone of the gospels is anti-Jewish and pro-Roman. "Pay your taxes, turn the other cheek, and, if a Roman soldier orders you to carry his pack one mile, then carry it two miles" would be consistent with the goal of making the Christians obedient and untroublesome to the Roman "patriarchy."
A lot of the material in the Gospels is simply repeats of material from the Old Testament, or things taken from other religions of the time.
Oh, and the crucifixion story itself was just taken from Josephus' history. During the war, Josephus saw three of his friends being crucified, and asked Titus to let them down. Two of them died, and one survived. This was the basis of the New Testament crucifixion story.
This all makes sense. Unfortunately, faith can be a powerfully delusional state of mind which is often used to justify itself -- "I believe it, therefor it is true".
Then it's a very small step to using faith to justify violence, slavery, racism, sexism, and the dumbing-down of public education.
03 Feb 2014, 11:52 am
03 Feb 2014, 12:21 pm
ArrantPariah wrote:
^ I hadn't heard that one before. One problem with the song: most of the pictures are of Amanita muscaria, which doesn't grow in stables.
Anyway,
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Amanita_muscaria
I wouldn't expect anyone who wasn't an ethnomycologist to get overly excited about this theory, either.
This is where I found the video (which was probably meant to be a joke anyway). I'm sure the text isn't: http://www.atlanteanconspiracy.com/2008/09/jesus-christ-magic-mushroom-part-1.html
Anyway,
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Amanita_muscaria
Quote:
Philologist, archeologist, and Dead Sea Scrolls scholar John Marco Allegro postulated that early Christian theology was derived from a fertility cult revolving around the entheogenic consumption of A. muscaria in his 1970 book The Sacred Mushroom and the Cross, but his theory has found little support by scholars outside the field of ethnomycology. The book was roundly discredited by academics and theologians, including Sir Godfrey Driver, Emeritus Professor of Semitic Philology at Oxford University, and Henry Chadwick, the Dean of Christ Church, Oxford. Christian author John C. King wrote a detailed rebuttal of Allegro's theory in the 1970 book A Christian View of the Mushroom Myth; he notes that neither fly agarics nor their host trees are found in the Middle East, even though cedars and pines are found there, and highlights the tenuous nature of the links between biblical and Sumerian names coined by Allegro. He concludes that if the theory was true, the use of the mushroom must have been "the best kept secret in the world" as it was so well concealed for two thousand years.
I wouldn't expect anyone who wasn't an ethnomycologist to get overly excited about this theory, either.
Notice who is discrediting Allegro in your quote!
03 Feb 2014, 12:56 pm
Kenjuudo wrote:
This is where I found the video (which was probably meant to be a joke anyway). I'm sure the text isn't: http://www.atlanteanconspiracy.com/2008/09/jesus-christ-magic-mushroom-part-1.html
Interesting, but one problem: the author talks about finding mushrooms in the desert. You aren't going to find any mushrooms in a desert. But, the Bible is just made-up stories anyway. So, okay, why not? Let's imagine some mushrooms in the desert.
Kenjuudo wrote:
Notice who is discrediting Allegro in your quote!
Okay. Not a serious rebuttal.
03 Feb 2014, 1:05 pm
ArrantPariah wrote:
Kenjuudo wrote:
This is where I found the video (which was probably meant to be a joke anyway). I'm sure the text isn't: http://www.atlanteanconspiracy.com/2008/09/jesus-christ-magic-mushroom-part-1.html
Interesting, but one problem: the author talks about finding mushrooms in the desert. You aren't going to find any mushrooms in a desert. But, the Bible is just made-up stories anyway. So, okay, why not? Let's imagine some mushrooms in the desert.
Kenjuudo wrote:
Notice who is discrediting Allegro in your quote!
Okay. Not a serious rebuttal.
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TevqcITfWEc[/youtube]
