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billiscool
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19 Mar 2014, 12:26 am

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xlSh6wBXePM

even atheist are against feminist.He has more anti feminist video.



kazma
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19 Mar 2014, 2:07 am

in all honesty most of these so called equal rights are played on a lot by people in society which goes against the whole point of equality i really dislike all the double standards that are seen as normal



Hopper
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19 Mar 2014, 7:02 am

billiscool wrote:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xlSh6wBXePM

even atheist are against feminist.He has more anti feminist video.


Why wouldn't an atheist be against feminism? All atheism is, is a disbelief in God. It doesn't suggest any other political leaning, nor (clearly) confer a particular intelligence or wisdom or clarity of thought. Though an atheist (and feminist) myself, my mind is boggled by this recent shouty atheistic 'rational' nonsense. It is philosophically pre-pubescent.



TheGoggles
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19 Mar 2014, 8:46 am

Hopper wrote:
It is philosophically pre-pubescent.


Bingo. AA is a tremendous loser and pretty much the patron saint of neckbearded fedora-wearers.



ArrantPariah
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19 Mar 2014, 1:35 pm

Hopper wrote:
All atheism is, is a disbelief in God. It doesn't suggest any other political leaning.


It does suggest that you aren't a Republican. Atheists aren't allowed to join the Republican party.



GGPViper
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19 Mar 2014, 1:55 pm

Hopper wrote:
All atheism is, is a disbelief in God. It doesn't suggest any other political leaning.

Well, several prominent individuals in the so-called atheist "movement" (since when is not collecting stamps a hobby?) seem to be involved in some sort of dispute around sex and gender.

Michael Shermer and PZ Myers (They are apparently "big shots" in the not-collecting stamps club, although I never heard about them before arriving on WP) have clashed over the issue of rape.

On a more fundamental level, the world's most famous atheist - Professor Richard Dawkins - has nothing but extreme contempt for feminism, as demonstrated in his comments on the "rape manual" otherwise known as Philosophiæ Naturalis Principia Mathematica:
http://www.physics.nyu.edu/sokal/dawkins.html

Another way to look at it: Natural Scientists are more likely to be atheists than the general population. Feminists are more likely to be atheists than the general population.

Yet the two tend to be opposing forces in this great battle:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Science_wars

Conflict, it would seem, is inevitable...



Hopper
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19 Mar 2014, 3:13 pm

GGPViper wrote:
Hopper wrote:
All atheism is, is a disbelief in God. It doesn't suggest any other political leaning.

Well, several prominent individuals in the so-called atheist "movement" (since when is not collecting stamps a hobby?) seem to be involved in some sort of dispute around sex and gender.

Michael Shermer and PZ Myers (They are apparently "big shots" in the not-collecting stamps club, although I never heard about them before arriving on WP) have clashed over the issue of rape.

On a more fundamental level, the world's most famous atheist - Professor Richard Dawkins - has nothing but extreme contempt for feminism, as demonstrated in his comments on the "rape manual" otherwise known as Philosophiæ Naturalis Principia Mathematica:
http://www.physics.nyu.edu/sokal/dawkins.html

Another way to look at it: Natural Scientists are more likely to be atheists than the general population. Feminists are more likely to be atheists than the general population.

Yet the two tend to be opposing forces in this great battle:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Science_wars

Conflict, it would seem, is inevitable...


But what is the conflict here? I'm sorry if it should be obvious, but it isn't to me. I mean, I can see conflict, but I'm not sure what the disagreement is.

My understanding (well, guess): The Scientists have done their sciencing, and are saying 'this is the way the world is, including men and women, and we've done the science to prove it, so there'. And The Feminists are responding with some notion of how, what, scientific enquiry is inherently sexist? Present understandings of scientific enquiry are, etc?

Is that anything like it?



GGPViper
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19 Mar 2014, 3:23 pm

Hopper wrote:
But what is the conflict here? I'm sorry if it should be obvious, but it isn't to me. I mean, I can see conflict, but I'm not sure what the disagreement is.

My understanding (well, guess): The Scientists have done their sciencing, and are saying 'this is the way the world is, including men and women, and we've done the science to prove it, so there'. And The Feminists are responding with some notion of how, what, scientific enquiry is inherently sexist? Present understandings of scientific enquiry are, etc?

Is that anything like it?

In the scientific establishment Feminism is basically considered to be pseudoscience (or, in layman's terms = BS).

Short story: Since the atheist "community" attracts both feminists and real scientists, conflict will ensue...



Hopper
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19 Mar 2014, 6:04 pm

GGPViper wrote:
In the scientific establishment Feminism is basically considered to be pseudoscience (or, in layman's terms = BS).

Short story: Since the atheist "community" attracts both feminists and real scientists, conflict will ensue...


But what do they conflict over? Do feminists consider Feminism scientific, and wish for recognition of such? Do the scientific establishment not pay any heed to any idea even remotely feminist, as they consider Feminism a pseudoscience? Are they in conflict over explanations and understandings of the world?

I consider myself a feminist, subsumed as it is into my socialism. I've never thought that Feminism needed to be considered 'scientific'.



Jono
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19 Mar 2014, 6:23 pm

GGPViper wrote:
Yet the two tend to be opposing forces in this great battle:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Science_wars

Conflict, it would seem, is inevitable...


That isn't science verses feminism, it's science verses post-modernism which has little to do with feminism. Feminism is simply a sociological movement to promote equality between the genders.



kazma
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19 Mar 2014, 7:30 pm

What I don't get is in reality most women don't want equality they want all the modern rights but at the same time want to be treated like a traditional woman



LKL
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19 Mar 2014, 9:21 pm

GGPViper wrote:
Hopper wrote:
But what is the conflict here? I'm sorry if it should be obvious, but it isn't to me. I mean, I can see conflict, but I'm not sure what the disagreement is.

My understanding (well, guess): The Scientists have done their sciencing, and are saying 'this is the way the world is, including men and women, and we've done the science to prove it, so there'. And The Feminists are responding with some notion of how, what, scientific enquiry is inherently sexist? Present understandings of scientific enquiry are, etc?

Is that anything like it?

In the scientific establishment Feminism is basically considered to be pseudoscience (or, in layman's terms = BS).

Short story: Since the atheist "community" attracts both feminists and real scientists, conflict will ensue...

Feminism isn't pseudoscience, since it never claimed to be science at all. It's a branch of the humanities.

edit: that's speaking as both a biologist and a feminist.



Last edited by LKL on 19 Mar 2014, 9:23 pm, edited 1 time in total.

LKL
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19 Mar 2014, 9:22 pm

kazma wrote:
What I don't get is in reality most women don't want equality they want all the modern rights but at the same time want to be treated like a traditional woman

{citation needed}



billiscool
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19 Mar 2014, 11:26 pm

kazma wrote:
What I don't get is in reality most women don't want equality they want all the modern rights but at the same time want to be treated like a traditional woman


yep,that's feminism for you.



LKL
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20 Mar 2014, 1:06 am

actually, that's straw feminism.



kazma
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20 Mar 2014, 2:22 am

LKL im not saying that as a put down on feminism your idea of feminism more likely is true equality