31 Mar 2014, 5:59 pm
Raptor wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
Raptor wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
Funny how a thread about how the allegations of voter fraud is only a smoke screen to disenfranchise "undesirable voters" has been turned (by those who may be defenders of this practice) to a defense of gun rights. I think to deflect from the merits of the OP.
On page 7 of this thread I explained it to you specifically and thought I'd made it abundantly clear that I was applying sonofghandi's flawed logic on gun control to this topic. I guess I need to use bigger fonts, shorter words, and pictures.
Okay, so you made your point on page 7 - - why pursue it any further?
Apparently I didnt make the point strongly enough to you. Later on the same page (page 7) you got in the game with this little nugget to further perpetate things:
Kraichgauer wrote:
But is the right to make a gun go bang bang of the same weighty category as legally exercising the right to vote, or to expect equal treatment in public? I could go my whole life without firing a gun and be perfectly happy, but take away my right to vote or participate in government, or treat me like a second class citizen, and suddenly my position in society has diminished considerably, both literally, and in the eyes of my fellow citizens.
Of course, your boy sonofghandi decided to continue to be disingenuous (big surprise
)and that kept the fire going a little longer.And now you ask again why this thread went where it did?
Kraichgauer wrote:
The only use I see guns having as making them go bang bang
/\ That's being disingenuous right there.
Quote:
while I think voting rights are of more importance when it comes to making your voice and will known to the government.
There's actually more to civil rights than civil rights for your two favorite and grossly dwelt on demographics alone.
I don't think I or any other gun rights advocates here have ever dismissed or implied to dismiss all but 2nd Amendment rights.
Quote:
I don't recall ever saying you have to believe what I believe, or that your concerns over gun rights should be disregarded in the public square.
Not said it directly but surely lorded your more valued rights over others.
Quote:
It just seems to me that "undesirable voters" are purposely being disenfranchised for racist reasons, and that's very much of concern to me.
And again, that same argument could be truthfully pegged to gun control. It's the fact that your kind refuse to see the connection that I'm hammering on this and it' will surely come up again.
Last edited by Raptor on 31 Mar 2014, 6:15 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Kraichgauer
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Posts: 47,798
Location: Spokane area, Washington state.
31 Mar 2014, 6:07 pm
^^^
My kind. Hm. 
31 Mar 2014, 6:39 pm
Kraichgauer
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Joined: 12 Apr 2010
Gender: Male
Posts: 47,798
Location: Spokane area, Washington state.
31 Mar 2014, 7:42 pm
31 Mar 2014, 7:50 pm
Kraichgauer wrote:
^^^
My kind. Hm.
My kind. Hm.
Yes, that would be the kind that howls about how people of other political affiliations wear blinders while wearing blinders themselves.
31 Mar 2014, 7:55 pm
31 Mar 2014, 8:24 pm
Kraichgauer
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Joined: 12 Apr 2010
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Posts: 47,798
Location: Spokane area, Washington state.
31 Mar 2014, 10:16 pm
Kraichgauer
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Joined: 12 Apr 2010
Gender: Male
Posts: 47,798
Location: Spokane area, Washington state.
31 Mar 2014, 10:22 pm
Raptor wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
Dox47 wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
You don't think it's significant that those voters being disenfranchised for their political affiliation tend to be of a specific race?
Race in this case is incidental to class, as none of the laws in question contain anything racially specific. Or do you really think the GOP is so intrinsically racist that it's trying to disenfranchise black people simply for being black, as opposed to trying to lower the Democratic turnout across the board?
I won't deny that politics is a major motivation, but to say that there isn't an underlying racial component here is a mistake, especially since much of the voter disenfranchisement has occurred where Jim Crow was once the law. And, no, not all Republicans are racist, but there are obviously enough who are, as these laws had been enacted.
And from your post, you seem to concede the GOP's shenanigans in voter suppression, in regards to keeping Democrats away from the polls.
You've got no proof of it, though, and can't rationalize it past "well, it's in the south so it must be bad".
No proof? Plenty of evidence had been presented in past posts by myself and others. Now, I'm afraid I'm going to be a little too preoccupied to reiterate said evidence - besides that there has been a history of past discrimination from the long ago to the not so long ago - as I'll be watching WWE wrestling.
31 Mar 2014, 10:30 pm
Kraichgauer wrote:
Raptor wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
Dox47 wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
You don't think it's significant that those voters being disenfranchised for their political affiliation tend to be of a specific race?
Race in this case is incidental to class, as none of the laws in question contain anything racially specific. Or do you really think the GOP is so intrinsically racist that it's trying to disenfranchise black people simply for being black, as opposed to trying to lower the Democratic turnout across the board?
I won't deny that politics is a major motivation, but to say that there isn't an underlying racial component here is a mistake, especially since much of the voter disenfranchisement has occurred where Jim Crow was once the law. And, no, not all Republicans are racist, but there are obviously enough who are, as these laws had been enacted.
And from your post, you seem to concede the GOP's shenanigans in voter suppression, in regards to keeping Democrats away from the polls.
You've got no proof of it, though, and can't rationalize it past "well, it's in the south so it must be bad".
No proof? Plenty of evidence had been presented in past posts by myself and others. Now, I'm afraid I'm going to be a little too preoccupied to reiterate said evidence - besides that there has been a history of past discrimination from the long ago to the not so long ago - as I'll be watching WWE wrestling.
Proof of RACISM like I bolded for you. Left wing allegation of racism via voter ID laws is not proof or even evidence.
Kraichgauer
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Joined: 12 Apr 2010
Gender: Male
Posts: 47,798
Location: Spokane area, Washington state.
31 Mar 2014, 10:49 pm
Raptor wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
Raptor wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
Dox47 wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
You don't think it's significant that those voters being disenfranchised for their political affiliation tend to be of a specific race?
Race in this case is incidental to class, as none of the laws in question contain anything racially specific. Or do you really think the GOP is so intrinsically racist that it's trying to disenfranchise black people simply for being black, as opposed to trying to lower the Democratic turnout across the board?
I won't deny that politics is a major motivation, but to say that there isn't an underlying racial component here is a mistake, especially since much of the voter disenfranchisement has occurred where Jim Crow was once the law. And, no, not all Republicans are racist, but there are obviously enough who are, as these laws had been enacted.
And from your post, you seem to concede the GOP's shenanigans in voter suppression, in regards to keeping Democrats away from the polls.
You've got no proof of it, though, and can't rationalize it past "well, it's in the south so it must be bad".
No proof? Plenty of evidence had been presented in past posts by myself and others. Now, I'm afraid I'm going to be a little too preoccupied to reiterate said evidence - besides that there has been a history of past discrimination from the long ago to the not so long ago - as I'll be watching WWE wrestling.
Proof of RACISM like I bolded for you. Left wing allegation of racism via voter ID laws is not proof or even evidence.
The cost for proper ID, which is a burden on poorer voters, amounts to a poll tax.
The closing of polling places in predominantly black districts is suspicious.
The closing of state licensing offices in black districts where proper ID's could be bought is suspicious.
Gun licenses are acceptable, but not college ID's, screaming how certain voters are unwanted, but others are.
Individual cases of how an elderly black voters who had been voting for years had been denied their rights (one lady was denied on grounds she couldn't present her marriage license, while another was a WWII veteran) that can't be ignored.
I could go on and on, but the Divas (the girls) are wrestling.
sonofghandi
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01 Apr 2014, 8:21 am
sonofghandi
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Joined: 17 Apr 2007
Age: 45
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Posts: 3,540
Location: Cleveland, OH (and not the nice part)
01 Apr 2014, 8:30 am
01 Apr 2014, 9:18 am
Raptor wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
Raptor wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
Dox47 wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
You don't think it's significant that those voters being disenfranchised for their political affiliation tend to be of a specific race?
Race in this case is incidental to class, as none of the laws in question contain anything racially specific. Or do you really think the GOP is so intrinsically racist that it's trying to disenfranchise black people simply for being black, as opposed to trying to lower the Democratic turnout across the board?
I won't deny that politics is a major motivation, but to say that there isn't an underlying racial component here is a mistake, especially since much of the voter disenfranchisement has occurred where Jim Crow was once the law. And, no, not all Republicans are racist, but there are obviously enough who are, as these laws had been enacted.
And from your post, you seem to concede the GOP's shenanigans in voter suppression, in regards to keeping Democrats away from the polls.
You've got no proof of it, though, and can't rationalize it past "well, it's in the south so it must be bad".
No proof? Plenty of evidence had been presented in past posts by myself and others. Now, I'm afraid I'm going to be a little too preoccupied to reiterate said evidence - besides that there has been a history of past discrimination from the long ago to the not so long ago - as I'll be watching WWE wrestling.
Proof of RACISM like I bolded for you. Left wing allegation of racism via voter ID laws is not proof or even evidence.
Kraichgauer wrote:
The cost for proper ID, which is a burden on poorer voters, amounts to a poll tax.
And us white folk don't have to purchase them? If everyone has to buy them it's hardly racism. Don't be surprised if anything you task the government with (including licencing) is expensive due to all the bureaucratic BS governments are notorious for.Quote:
The closing of polling places in predominantly black districts is suspicious.
Just closed for no reason and this was widespread enough to see an actual trend?They weren't condemned or closed as the result of vandalism?
Let the record show that you brought the term "black district" into this. Having established that, let's point out that those districts tend to be rather run down so closing any building due to vandalism (very common in said districts) or one or more other actual legit reason would not be uncommon and hardly unfair. I say this since I live about three miles from such a district and I know some of the things that go on there.
Quote:
The closing of state licensing offices in black districts where proper ID's could be bought is suspicious.
See above.Quote:
Gun licenses are acceptable, but not college ID's, screaming how certain voters are unwanted, but others are.
What's a gun license?Or are you trying to say carry permit which is a different animal? If so, then the carry permit is a more in-depth state issued licence while a college ID is school issued and has little use off campus.
Quote:
Individual cases of how an elderly black voters who had been voting for years had been denied their rights (one lady was denied on grounds she couldn't present her marriage license, while another was a WWII veteran) that can't be ignored.
How many and how frequent?Are you saying this never happens to white people?
Quote:
I could go on and on, but the Divas (the girls) are wrestling.
Nice to see where your priorities are.
Funny how you can slam NASCAR like you did here http://www.wrongplanet.net/postt225502.html but admit to watching WWE or whatever.
01 Apr 2014, 9:32 am
01 Apr 2014, 10:11 am
appletheclown wrote:
Black people don't shout racist all the time like politicians claim they do Raptor. In fact, the friends at tech school whom I play dodgeball with tease each other, black or white, by shouting that out. It isn't such a drama. I was friends before I knew it. You guys gotta lighten up.
And where did that awful Raptor say that black people shout about racism all the time?
It's your boy Kraichgauer that keeps doting on racism.
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