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ooOoOoOAnaOoOoOoo
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18 Jul 2014, 2:04 am

And I have reached conclusions.

One is you can believe in God and science at the same time. People who read the Bible think this isn't possible but I have figured out how it is. The Bible is not God, it is simply people's experiences with God and their opinions about Him and their experiences they have shared with others. It isn't God therefore you cannot interpret it as such. You can read it and gain insight. In reality, the only experience you can have with God is between you and HIm, not you and the Bible! God isn't words!

As you have already guessed, this makes believing in God and science at the same time possible since the Bible isn't God, just human's writing on him. There is much more to this than meets the eye, much more than you are lead to believe by people who mistake the Bible for God. See what I am getting at here?



AspieOtaku
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18 Jul 2014, 2:32 am

I dont! When I die I become wormfood and compost.


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DentArthurDent
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18 Jul 2014, 5:19 am

ANA this is the most sensible post I have seen regarding God and the Bible on this forum for a long time.

It would appear you are aware that given our understanding of the natural world and the scholarship into the historicity of the bible that the two are simply not compatible and the bible is far from a reliable source of information for actual historical events. You state you believe in God and do not mention Jesus the Messiah, can I understand from this that you are not a Christian, which if so I can respect entirely, as the evidence that the NT in any way represents an accurate depiction of the life of Jesus is tenuous in the extreme.

I do not believe in Almighty God, Gods, The Satan or for that matter any form of the supernatural which naturally means I also do not believe in the existence of the souls of the dead as represented by ghosts. I do believe that there is something going on regarding 'ghosts' but I am of the conviction that in time we will discover what 'they' are and the phenomena will have an entirely naturalistic explanation.

Once again I do not share your godly conviction but I respect the way you have presented your belief


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b9
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18 Jul 2014, 6:39 am

i have never been interested in the musings or literature that people who are other than me formulate about reality.
i see the genesis of reality in a way that makes me certain that it is intelligently designed in a way that is beyond all manifest possibilities of intelligence.
the foundations of reality that i am aware of are so intricately interwoven with each other, that i must conclude that they evolved with reference to each other even though they have no discernible congruence.

i could wonder if my perception of reality is adequate to even analyse, but i know that what i see is seeable in the same way as anyone who is in my frame of mind. even if i am the only occupant of the method of my frame of mind, i still believe what i see.

and what i see is a perpetual miracle of satisfied expectation. things always happen the way i expect them to.
what indoctrinated me to the ability to predict how things (in certain situations) will eventuate ? how do i know what i think is valid?

the fact that i have not the capacity to "dream" up all the aspects of reality that i am aware of means that it must be all unfolding to an inevitable cosmic plan, and i am only aware of what i am aware of with respect to it.

did god give me eyes to see what is in reality?

how else could i really feel involved in my place in the world if it was not for god?

the reality in which i live, from the microcosmic to the macrocosmic, is a state of existence that i had no role in creating, as did no other person.

whatever.



ooOoOoOAnaOoOoOoo
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18 Jul 2014, 9:29 am

Thank you DentArthurDent and B9!

My hope with this thread is to get people communicating with spirit by going within. Don't let the Bible or any group cut you off from it! Spirit is a good thing and can help you in so many ways. Forget everything you have been led to believe and just trust spirit to guide you by going inward!

it's not about fairy tales just your personal experience and you don't have to share it with others, just gain from it. No need to be completely cut off from it.



Raptor
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18 Jul 2014, 9:51 am

Quote:
I do believe in God

Me, too! :D


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kraftiekortie
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18 Jul 2014, 10:25 am

I don't

But it doesn't mean religion isn't valid.



Sweetleaf
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18 Jul 2014, 1:08 pm

Congratulations :cheers:


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18 Jul 2014, 4:23 pm

Congratulations, you're a Lutheran. :D



DentArthurDent
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18 Jul 2014, 7:20 pm

ooOoOoOAnaOoOoOoo wrote:
My hope with this thread is to get people communicating with spirit by going within......

it's not about fairy tales just your personal experience and you don't have to share it with others, just gain from it. No need to be completely cut off from it.


So can "spirit" be purely naturalistic?


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tern
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19 Jul 2014, 8:38 am

You can see the results in solved situations after they were beyiond your own strength or ability to solve. When at the time of difficulty over what to do you released the will over decision to be directed by the good spirit, and the results you got could not showed a foreknowledge that was not inside your own mind so could not have come from within yourself.

I totally agree with, and had already experienced before I heard it, and Anglican minister's tip that the reflex to pray in time of crisis or fear shows that belief and awareness in God is really in there in most folks' character.

But I would add to his argument a counter, that a person instinctively praying only hopes for a lead to their actions to minimise the trauma they are going through, and to survive it only if possible. They are not expecting any scientifically impossible magic rescue to happen such as the Abrahamic faiths' god is supposed to be capable of. So the position that we instinctively know and that matches spiritual experience is in fact the aomnitheist position, a universal spirit with no magic powers, not the omnipotent God imagined self-servingly by the powerful religions that have often not helped us to connect with that spirit for ourselves.



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19 Jul 2014, 12:11 pm

AspieOtaku wrote:
I dont! When I die I become wormfood and compost.


Good for you. It doesn't make the point of the OP any less valid, though.


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19 Jul 2014, 12:45 pm

I don't believe in a white bearded grumpy old man in the sky,more like the energy that flows thru everything and I can't really explain it well.Whatever is the binder for it all,but it's not a deity but people try to put a face on it,each culture has their own.Shiva= Yahweh


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19 Jul 2014, 1:18 pm

Given how necessarily noetic god is any attempt to encode such a being is going to be missing a key component which as youve identified is personally generated experience. Any divine experience will also be filtered through all our cognitive biases.


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19 Jul 2014, 1:30 pm

ooOoOoOAnaOoOoOoo wrote:
Thank you DentArthurDent and B9!

My hope with this thread is to get people communicating with spirit by going within. Don't let the Bible or any group cut you off from it! Spirit is a good thing and can help you in so many ways. Forget everything you have been led to believe and just trust spirit to guide you by going inward!

it's not about fairy tales just your personal experience and you don't have to share it with others, just gain from it. No need to be completely cut off from it.


I am in agreement with you concerning God and science. I believe in the Christian God, including his triune nature, and the theology of Christ's death and resurrection for the sake of our flawed human natures. But I also believe the Bible is hardly a science book, and can't be taken as a literal chronology of the passage of time. Rather, it reflects the misconceptions, prejudices, and lack of knowledge of it's writers in the time it was written.


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