30 Sep 2015, 10:21 am
eric76 wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
eric76 wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
There are plenty of Baptists and Catholics out there to spread the manure. And I'm sorry to say, my own Lutheran Church Missouri Synod (which can aptly be called a "conservative mainline church) has jumped on the homophobic bandwagon - something that pisses me off to no end.
There's always ELCA.
The problem with that is, my home congregation has done so much for my family and me, I don't see myself bailing on people who might as well be my family. That, and the ELCA's leaders seems so intent on ecumenical unity that they apparently are willing to achieve this through compromising away Lutheran theology, and I like my Lutheran theology. Besides, Missouri Synod Lutherans in my home region of the Pacific Northwest are not nearly as conservative as they are in the Midwest, where the church leadership tends to be centered.
My mother always wanted to change to Missouri Synod.
Several years ago, there was an enormous vote at our local church to decide whether to stay in the ELCA or join the ALC. It was amazing that we had about 150 people vote when a typical Sunday now is about 20 to 30 people.
I've noticed that a number of locals now go to a different Lutheran church in a nearby town that is Missouri Synod. I've often wondered if that was because the ELCA won the vote.
I'm sure that that is the case. My church was an ELCA congregation, and when they got into politics, we were the first church to leave ( we joined the AALC). If the vote would have gone differently, I certainly would have gone back to the LCMS, even though I don't much care for the national leadership. This would have entailed a 120 mile round trip, so it would have been a pain. However, seeing as how I know people in that congregation through Via De Christo, I could be comfortable there.
However, I would once again be in the position of having to explain to those Germans that you can be French and still be a Lutheran.
30 Sep 2015, 10:29 am
30 Sep 2015, 10:30 am
30 Sep 2015, 10:34 am
Kraichgauer
Veteran
Joined: 12 Apr 2010
Gender: Male
Posts: 47,796
Location: Spokane area, Washington state.
30 Sep 2015, 1:56 pm
glebel wrote:
eric76 wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
eric76 wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
There are plenty of Baptists and Catholics out there to spread the manure. And I'm sorry to say, my own Lutheran Church Missouri Synod (which can aptly be called a "conservative mainline church) has jumped on the homophobic bandwagon - something that pisses me off to no end.
There's always ELCA.
The problem with that is, my home congregation has done so much for my family and me, I don't see myself bailing on people who might as well be my family. That, and the ELCA's leaders seems so intent on ecumenical unity that they apparently are willing to achieve this through compromising away Lutheran theology, and I like my Lutheran theology. Besides, Missouri Synod Lutherans in my home region of the Pacific Northwest are not nearly as conservative as they are in the Midwest, where the church leadership tends to be centered.
My mother always wanted to change to Missouri Synod.
Several years ago, there was an enormous vote at our local church to decide whether to stay in the ELCA or join the ALC. It was amazing that we had about 150 people vote when a typical Sunday now is about 20 to 30 people.
I've noticed that a number of locals now go to a different Lutheran church in a nearby town that is Missouri Synod. I've often wondered if that was because the ELCA won the vote.
I'm sure that that is the case. My church was an ELCA congregation, and when they got into politics, we were the first church to leave ( we joined the AALC). If the vote would have gone differently, I certainly would have gone back to the LCMS, even though I don't much care for the national leadership. This would have entailed a 120 mile round trip, so it would have been a pain. However, seeing as how I know people in that congregation through Via De Christo, I could be comfortable there.
However, I would once again be in the position of having to explain to those Germans that you can be French and still be a Lutheran.
May I ask, where in France did your people come from? I ask, because I had some people very far back in my line who came from Alsace, a German speaking area, but part of France, no less. Same applies to Lorraine. Or were they French speaking Lutherans?
30 Sep 2015, 2:03 pm
Kraichgauer
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Joined: 12 Apr 2010
Gender: Male
Posts: 47,796
Location: Spokane area, Washington state.
30 Sep 2015, 2:23 pm
30 Sep 2015, 2:55 pm
30 Sep 2015, 8:58 pm
01 Oct 2015, 9:27 am
02 Oct 2015, 11:42 am
02 Oct 2015, 11:55 am
Kraichgauer wrote:
glebel wrote:
eric76 wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
eric76 wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
There are plenty of Baptists and Catholics out there to spread the manure. And I'm sorry to say, my own Lutheran Church Missouri Synod (which can aptly be called a "conservative mainline church) has jumped on the homophobic bandwagon - something that pisses me off to no end.
There's always ELCA.
The problem with that is, my home congregation has done so much for my family and me, I don't see myself bailing on people who might as well be my family. That, and the ELCA's leaders seems so intent on ecumenical unity that they apparently are willing to achieve this through compromising away Lutheran theology, and I like my Lutheran theology. Besides, Missouri Synod Lutherans in my home region of the Pacific Northwest are not nearly as conservative as they are in the Midwest, where the church leadership tends to be centered.
My mother always wanted to change to Missouri Synod.
Several years ago, there was an enormous vote at our local church to decide whether to stay in the ELCA or join the ALC. It was amazing that we had about 150 people vote when a typical Sunday now is about 20 to 30 people.
I've noticed that a number of locals now go to a different Lutheran church in a nearby town that is Missouri Synod. I've often wondered if that was because the ELCA won the vote.
I'm sure that that is the case. My church was an ELCA congregation, and when they got into politics, we were the first church to leave ( we joined the AALC). If the vote would have gone differently, I certainly would have gone back to the LCMS, even though I don't much care for the national leadership. This would have entailed a 120 mile round trip, so it would have been a pain. However, seeing as how I know people in that congregation through Via De Christo, I could be comfortable there.
However, I would once again be in the position of having to explain to those Germans that you can be French and still be a Lutheran.
May I ask, where in France did your people come from? I ask, because I had some people very far back in my line who came from Alsace, a German speaking area, but part of France, no less. Same applies to Lorraine. Or were they French speaking Lutherans?
Lutheranism never seemed to get a footing in France. I am a first generation Lutheran. I chose the Lutheran theology over all the rest because we actually read the Bible without interpreting it ( much).
My people were Huguenots from Alsace, Wallonia, Picardy, Normandy, Brittany, and Poitou.
My ancestors from Alsace, and most likely your ancestors from Alsace-Lorraine were members of the Reformed Church. Many Huguenots left the area and emigrated to the Rhineland when the French took it from the Holy Roman Empire during the Thirty Years War. Then, when the Imperial forces later took the Rhineland and Catholicized it, they fled to other German states, or, like my ancestors, they went to the Netherlands. I could easily see your ancestors moving to a Lutheran state and being forced to be Lutherans. Cuis regio, eius religio was the rule of thumb back in those days. Sounds like you might have an interesting story in your family history.
On a side note, I don't know if my Alsatian ancestors spoke German, but their first and last names were always French; one of ancestresses was born in Pfalz in the Rhineland and was named Marie Brulee.
Kraichgauer
Veteran
Joined: 12 Apr 2010
Gender: Male
Posts: 47,796
Location: Spokane area, Washington state.
02 Oct 2015, 2:58 pm
glebel wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
glebel wrote:
eric76 wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
eric76 wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
There are plenty of Baptists and Catholics out there to spread the manure. And I'm sorry to say, my own Lutheran Church Missouri Synod (which can aptly be called a "conservative mainline church) has jumped on the homophobic bandwagon - something that pisses me off to no end.
There's always ELCA.
The problem with that is, my home congregation has done so much for my family and me, I don't see myself bailing on people who might as well be my family. That, and the ELCA's leaders seems so intent on ecumenical unity that they apparently are willing to achieve this through compromising away Lutheran theology, and I like my Lutheran theology. Besides, Missouri Synod Lutherans in my home region of the Pacific Northwest are not nearly as conservative as they are in the Midwest, where the church leadership tends to be centered.
My mother always wanted to change to Missouri Synod.
Several years ago, there was an enormous vote at our local church to decide whether to stay in the ELCA or join the ALC. It was amazing that we had about 150 people vote when a typical Sunday now is about 20 to 30 people.
I've noticed that a number of locals now go to a different Lutheran church in a nearby town that is Missouri Synod. I've often wondered if that was because the ELCA won the vote.
I'm sure that that is the case. My church was an ELCA congregation, and when they got into politics, we were the first church to leave ( we joined the AALC). If the vote would have gone differently, I certainly would have gone back to the LCMS, even though I don't much care for the national leadership. This would have entailed a 120 mile round trip, so it would have been a pain. However, seeing as how I know people in that congregation through Via De Christo, I could be comfortable there.
However, I would once again be in the position of having to explain to those Germans that you can be French and still be a Lutheran.
May I ask, where in France did your people come from? I ask, because I had some people very far back in my line who came from Alsace, a German speaking area, but part of France, no less. Same applies to Lorraine. Or were they French speaking Lutherans?
Lutheranism never seemed to get a footing in France. I am a first generation Lutheran. I chose the Lutheran theology over all the rest because we actually read the Bible without interpreting it ( much).
My people were Huguenots from Alsace, Wallonia, Picardy, Normandy, Brittany, and Poitou.
My ancestors from Alsace, and most likely your ancestors from Alsace-Lorraine were members of the Reformed Church. Many Huguenots left the area and emigrated to the Rhineland when the French took it from the Holy Roman Empire during the Thirty Years War. Then, when the Imperial forces later took the Rhineland and Catholicized it, they fled to other German states, or, like my ancestors, they went to the Netherlands. I could easily see your ancestors moving to a Lutheran state and being forced to be Lutherans. Cuis regio, eius religio was the rule of thumb back in those days. Sounds like you might have an interesting story in your family history.
On a side note, I don't know if my Alsatian ancestors spoke German, but their first and last names were always French; one of ancestresses was born in Pfalz in the Rhineland and was named Marie Brulee.
My dad's family were Lutherans from the very start of the Reformation. An ancestor in fact had corresponded with Luther. I don't know the name or original religion of the ancestor from Alsace prior to when she had married into the family, save that some members of the family had referred to her as "that French woman."
While Alsace is part of France today, it has a primarily German speaking population, of either Protestant or Catholic theology. As my dad's people had taken part in the immigration from the Rhine-Nekar region of Germany (specifically the Kraichgau, which is today part of Baden-Wurttemberg) to the Black Sea area of Russia, it isn't a far leap to assume that this Alsatian ancestor had come from northern Alsace, from where many Russian Germans in the Black Sea region had also been originally from. What set the northern Alsatians apart from their southern neighbors was that while the latter spoke the Alemmanic dialect, those in the north spoke a high Franconian dialect, very similar to what was spoken by other German settlers in southern Russia, including those from the Kraichgau.
Fogman
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