Is the American sense of justice and morality dead?

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GnosticBishop
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28 Oct 2015, 5:59 pm

Is the American sense of justice and morality dead?

Are those qualities dead everywhere?

http://www.c-span.org/video/?328079-1/s ... university

Vigilantism is driven by a sense of justice and morality. That sense is feared by our oligarch and plutocrat owners. That vigilantism, I think, is what used to keep the politician in line and our oligarch owners more generous towards their underlings/us.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q2gO4DK ... r_embedded

Justice and the American Dream were driven by a sense of justice and morality. That sense of justice and morality has been replaced, at the top of the demographic pyramid, and our new owners, by the new sense that the acquisition of wealth is now the moral and just ideal. The oligarchs’ new God is now money.

The rich, in their gated communities, think themselves secure and think that their huge wealth will protect them and isolate them from justice. They do not fear vigilantes as they seem to think that the heart and desire for justice is no longer in the average American heart.

Are they correct?

Are we all willing to continue in such a system where the rich, while driving by the poor, not only do not care for them or their plight, but also take what little the poor have as they drive on by?

I call that theft with the collusion and help of their political elected slaves, eh, politicians I mean.

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DL



Meistersinger
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28 Oct 2015, 6:56 pm

Yes. It's been dead since 1963, when JFK was assinated and LBJ was sworn in. The counterculture of that era are now the leaders of today, and look at the mess they put us in.

Ronald Reagan put the nail in the coffin. The mantra of the current leadership in both parties is Gilbert Gekko's "Greed is Good" mantra.

To quote Walt Kelly's Pogo, "We have met the enemy, and he is us."



GnosticBishop
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28 Oct 2015, 7:46 pm

Meistersinger wrote:
Yes. It's been dead since 1963, when JFK was assinated and LBJ was sworn in. The counterculture of that era are now the leaders of today, and look at the mess they put us in.

Ronald Reagan put the nail in the coffin. The mantra of the current leadership in both parties is Gilbert Gekko's "Greed is Good" mantra.

To quote Walt Kelly's Pogo, "We have met the enemy, and he is us."


You have good eyes buddy.

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blauSamstag
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28 Oct 2015, 8:02 pm

nah. it just loses every argument with what passes for a conservative these days.

these days a cop can beat up a high school girl for being sassy and people will say she deserved it.



motorcyclemama
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28 Oct 2015, 8:06 pm

I am from
Australia and I don't really know what the American sense of Justice and Morality is. Is it better dead or alive?



GnosticBishop
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28 Oct 2015, 8:07 pm

blauSamstag wrote:
nah. it just loses every argument with what passes for a conservative these days.

these days a cop can beat up a high school girl for being sassy and people will say she deserved it.


Wrong issue. Focus.

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GnosticBishop
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28 Oct 2015, 8:12 pm

motorcyclemama wrote:
I am from
Australia and I don't really know what the American sense of Justice and Morality is. Is it better dead or alive?


In the theme of the O.P., it looks something like this.

You might need to watch the movie to get it.



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DL



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28 Oct 2015, 9:25 pm

"Is the American sense of justice and morality dead?"

I think that perhaps it is very much alive at the extremes of any given attribute. I also believe that the populous is manipulated into thinking they must choose one extreme or the other because they are under attack. So, take any topic and you have two senses of justice and morality, and by design they are mutually exclusive. Now, let's say you were a modern capitalist and you wanted to ensure the growth of your wealth. This would be a *wonderful* way to keep the masses too busy to pay much attention to what you and your buddies are actually doing. Interesting thing is, with most of these conflicts both sides think they are being attacked. You can tell that it's been manufactured if only one side has their American life, liberty and pursuit actually reduced (ie one side has been granted a right or legal exemption the other has not). Yet the side that has not actually been harmed has been convinced that theirs is being threatened and so use their privilege to oppress the other. At that point it becomes a sustainable manipulation, more or less frozen at some rough, dynamic balance. Oh, and on both sides there are politicians, religious leaders and non-profit CEO's that are making money hand over fist off "their" side without providing anything real.


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Kraichgauer
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29 Oct 2015, 1:35 am

James Elroy, in his novel American Tabloid, had written about America and it's sense of morality (paraphrased probably, as I'm going by memory): "America was never innocent. We popped our cherry when we came over on the Mayflower."


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Raptor
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29 Oct 2015, 2:18 am

Depends on how one one defines morality and justice. If we go with a classic definition, I don't think America's sense of justice and morality is dead, just confused at times.


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ZenDen
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29 Oct 2015, 12:02 pm

Morality and Justice in the United States of America is DEAD? DEAD?

You must be wrong....here, I'll ask this Native American over here if that's true. HaHa^2.

Rich, powerful and greedy people have always been part of the human condition.

They've always owned/controlled politicians and created laws for their own benefit.

The dream of hope, charity and freedom for all was written for and by rich people.

Please don't let yourself be fooled.



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29 Oct 2015, 12:24 pm

blauSamstag wrote:
nah. it just loses every argument with what passes for a conservative these days.

these days a cop can beat up a high school girl for being sassy and people will say she deserved it.


I think that cop did get fired though I think criminal charges should be applied as well, but good point.


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GnosticBishop
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29 Oct 2015, 6:00 pm

Edenthiel wrote:
"Is the American sense of justice and morality dead?"

I think that perhaps it is very much alive at the extremes of any given attribute. I also believe that the populous is manipulated into thinking they must choose one extreme or the other because they are under attack. So, take any topic and you have two senses of justice and morality, and by design they are mutually exclusive. Now, let's say you were a modern capitalist and you wanted to ensure the growth of your wealth. This would be a *wonderful* way to keep the masses too busy to pay much attention to what you and your buddies are actually doing. Interesting thing is, with most of these conflicts both sides think they are being attacked. You can tell that it's been manufactured if only one side has their American life, liberty and pursuit actually reduced (ie one side has been granted a right or legal exemption the other has not). Yet the side that has not actually been harmed has been convinced that theirs is being threatened and so use their privilege to oppress the other. At that point it becomes a sustainable manipulation, more or less frozen at some rough, dynamic balance. Oh, and on both sides there are politicians, religious leaders and non-profit CEO's that are making money hand over fist off "their" side without providing anything real.


Thanks for this.

This is the immorality and injustice Mr. Sanders was alluding to.

http://www.upworthy.com/9-out-of-10-ame ... ing-fact-2

Do you agree that the present situation is immoral?

If so, what should be done?

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DL



GnosticBishop
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29 Oct 2015, 6:04 pm

Kraichgauer wrote:
James Elroy, in his novel American Tabloid, had written about America and it's sense of morality (paraphrased probably, as I'm going by memory): "America was never innocent. We popped our cherry when we came over on the Mayflower."


Be it Canada, the U.S. or South America, all who found them had little in the way of morals or justice in mind.

That aside, we have progressed and move forward.

I take it you still think the U.S. has a ways to go.

What do you think it will take for Americans to form a moral outlook?

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GnosticBishop
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29 Oct 2015, 6:07 pm

Raptor wrote:
Depends on how one one defines morality and justice. If we go with a classic definition, I don't think America's sense of justice and morality is dead, just confused at times.


Do you think Sanders is on the right track to end that confusion?

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GnosticBishop
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29 Oct 2015, 6:09 pm

ZenDen wrote:
Morality and Justice in the United States of America is DEAD? DEAD?

You must be wrong....here, I'll ask this Native American over here if that's true. HaHa^2.

Rich, powerful and greedy people have always been part of the human condition.

They've always owned/controlled politicians and created laws for their own benefit.

The dream of hope, charity and freedom for all was written for and by rich people.

Please don't let yourself be fooled.


So if the Americans are aware of all this, and allow it, that would indicate that their sense of morality and justice is dead. Right?

Regards
DL