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androbot01
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10 Feb 2016, 6:42 pm

I know they are, because so many people have them. And because any hint at limiting them, like abortion, is met with much conflict. But why is that? Is it some sort of God complex? That people need to feel that they have created something from themselves. If so that seems a bit selfish, considering all the suffering that is involved in being alive.

I also can't help but think what a much more pleasant world it would be if we weren't so bottom heavy with children. Western society worships youth like it's a cult.

Maybe it's some sort of false hope. But personally I think we should be more concerned for the Earth as a whole, not just our own vain procreation.

It use to be that people had to have children to look after them. But that is not the case anymore. Most seniors end up shelved in an old folks home with a daily visit from family, if they're lucky.

It's not life that seems to be valued, but specifically young life. Why are children more valuable than the rest of us?



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10 Feb 2016, 6:49 pm

Well they are rather necessary to keep the species alive they do turn into adults...but yeah I do not see anything wrong with people not having children if they don't want, and don't think they should be pressured to for 'moral' reasons. I know if the condom failed with me and my boyfriend we'd be getting the morning after pill and I've heard some on the Christian right say even that's 'immoral' and should be banned and that's not even an abortion. I say its my body, so my choice if I want to grow another being inside me or not.


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androbot01
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10 Feb 2016, 6:51 pm

Sweetleaf wrote:
Well they are rather necessary to keep the species alive ...

I don't mean nobody should have children, just that it shouldn't be so common.



Sweetleaf
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10 Feb 2016, 6:56 pm

androbot01 wrote:
Sweetleaf wrote:
Well they are rather necessary to keep the species alive ...

I don't mean nobody should have children, just that it shouldn't be so common.

Yeah I see nothing wrong with that, but it is more heavily encouraged to reproduce than not it seems. But its certainly not like there is a shortage of people on the planet...if anything a lot of places are too crowded.


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androbot01
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10 Feb 2016, 7:01 pm

Sweetleaf wrote:
androbot01 wrote:
Sweetleaf wrote:
Well they are rather necessary to keep the species alive ...

I don't mean nobody should have children, just that it shouldn't be so common.

Yeah I see nothing wrong with that, but it is more heavily encouraged to reproduce than not it seems. But its certainly not like there is a shortage of people on the planet...if anything a lot of places are too crowded.

I know.
Some people seem to have them even though they have no real interest in them. The school system is mostly just a warehouse these days. I wonder how many people really consider the option of not having children.



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10 Feb 2016, 7:10 pm

androbot01 wrote:
Sweetleaf wrote:
androbot01 wrote:
Sweetleaf wrote:
Well they are rather necessary to keep the species alive ...

I don't mean nobody should have children, just that it shouldn't be so common.

Yeah I see nothing wrong with that, but it is more heavily encouraged to reproduce than not it seems. But its certainly not like there is a shortage of people on the planet...if anything a lot of places are too crowded.

I know.
Some people seem to have them even though they have no real interest in them. The school system is mostly just a warehouse these days. I wonder how many people really consider the option of not having children.

Well, I and my girlfriend do not want kids ever. We see them as more trouble than fun. As I can't communicate with children at all, I would find having a child more of an annoyance. No one can push me to change my views - well, my girlfriend could, but I'm glad she isn't trying to. I'm not against children, though. I just don't like the idea of taking care of one until he/she grows up. I don't understand why society pushes people to think only in one way about the issue. It's not like humanity is dying out or anything. :?



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10 Feb 2016, 8:00 pm

androbot01 wrote:
Sweetleaf wrote:
androbot01 wrote:
Sweetleaf wrote:
Well they are rather necessary to keep the species alive ...

I don't mean nobody should have children, just that it shouldn't be so common.

Yeah I see nothing wrong with that, but it is more heavily encouraged to reproduce than not it seems. But its certainly not like there is a shortage of people on the planet...if anything a lot of places are too crowded.

I know.
Some people seem to have them even though they have no real interest in them. The school system is mostly just a warehouse these days. I wonder how many people really consider the option of not having children.


My wife and I are adamantly anti-children. I feel it's irresponsible to have them for most people. But for many people, it's just what you do as you get older.



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10 Feb 2016, 8:00 pm

In some cultures, children are valued for their potential to support their parent in old age. In other cultures, they're valued for the money they can earn for the family through child labor, prostitution, slavery, begging, and organ "donations".


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10 Feb 2016, 8:02 pm

Because they're the future, the only true end goal of life before you die.



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10 Feb 2016, 8:17 pm

Children are valued because....they are your children! They grew up in the mother's uterus.

Because, at times, they are innocent. And you can raise them to be decent adults.

I think there are times when children can mature people. You, as a parent, have a total responsibility for a human life.

I've never had children--and I regret it somewhat. I wish I could have helped bring my own child into the world, and I wish I could have raised him/her to be an upstanding adult.



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10 Feb 2016, 8:20 pm

Our culture does not value children, look at how we treat them. Immediately millions of their peers have been murdered before they ever have a chance to born and have their body parts sold to the highest bidder, we send to them glorified daycares/internment camps that we call schools that prepare them for institutionalization, we saddle them with 6 figures of debt for degrees that won't get them jobs, we send children to war to fight the children of other countries but don't even let them play outside here anymore. The only kids I see outside are Mexicans, Americans are so paranoid that they essentially keep their children prisoners in their own home with the GMO pack processed poison prison food. It is the boomers and old folks that have hollowed out this country, they simply aren't dying fast enough and racked up huge entitlements that the youth of today aren't even allowed to dream about have but are going to be counted on to support, it is these boomers that support that most repressive corrupt politicians and policies in this country too.

The exact problem with our culture is that we don't value children or human life at all, self absorbed in our own worlds with our own problems. Why do you think middle aged white people have seen such a decrease in their quality of life, why are there all these middle aged lost souls? It's because the American family has been destroyed; getting a job, settling down, getting married, owning house, having 2.5 kids, retirement, you are lucky if you get any of those things now. The American Dream is DEAD!



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10 Feb 2016, 8:31 pm

^ ^ ^
Depressing as hell but true...


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10 Feb 2016, 9:12 pm

I think procreation is valued. I think it's valued because it gives some sense of meaning to all this.

I don't think children are valued (though some confuse sentimental projection with valuing), as I don't think people are. They also provide a handy excuse to do terrible, stupid things - 'we've got to do X, because of the children'.


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10 Feb 2016, 9:19 pm

I donno why anyone would want a bunch of brats running around. I personally think a childless world would be a wonderful place.


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10 Feb 2016, 10:18 pm

This is one of my unpopular views too. There is dense overpopulation, and no one has done anything to stop us breeding like rabbits. Just because people "want a baby." The health of the planet and its societies is second to this selfish desire.
More unpopular opinions on breeding are based on my petty perceptions of everyday behaviour of people with children - trying to have a meal, talk or have a nice cup of coffee at a restaurant or cafe, and people who sit there oblivious while their kids run around, scream, hit things, annoy people, etc. Same thing on trains. Being barged into by women with prams who expect everyone to accommodate them, "baby on board" stickers on every second car as if they're special.
When I was sick they told me that I wouldn't be able to have any physical part in having children. They seemed genuinely surprised when I didn't care. Maybe it's just me, but when I was a child, the world seemed about adults. Now, everything seems either targeted at children or people with children, as if they are the only thing that matters.

Quote:
Because they're the future, the only true end goal of life before you die

What does this mean? That the only fulfilling thing in life you can ever do is have kids ???


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10 Feb 2016, 10:37 pm

C2V wrote:
Quote:
Because they're the future, the only true end goal of life before you die

What does this mean? That the only fulfilling thing in life you can ever do is have kids ???


From a human standpoint no, there are plenty of worthwhile things to do with ones life. From an objective biological standpoint...yes. Obviously it's a combination of both, passing on the fire, doesn't have to be your own biological children, but the survival of ones subjective culture.