Forget Slavery, Remember the Holocaust

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I saw a guy on CNN today arguing quite passionately that slavery is a horror that should be remembered like the Holocaust, not buried under the carpet. I kinda agree with him. I have heard people say that slavery is too far in the past to be considered today, but I'm not so sure. If my great-grandparents had been slaves to people that I live with now, I might feel resentment. Perhaps society should make more of a deal of apologizing for slavery, like people have memorials about the Holocaust.

Any thoughts on this?

Well, technically speaking, slavery may be responsible for more deaths than the Holocaust... if you widen the scale - both geographically and temporally.

... The Atlantic Slave Trade wasn't the only example of slavery in human history.

... Regardless, I doubt there is little to be gained from a pissing contest over death tolls...

The Great Leap Forward = Do Not Want
The Conquest by Genghis Khan = Do Not Want
The Conquests by Timur the Lame = Do Not Want
The Holocaust = Do Not Want
Slavery = Do Not Want
The Holodomor = Do Not Want
The Cambodian Genocide = Do Not Want
The Armenian Genocide = Do Not Want
The Rwandan Genocide = Do Not Want

... and so on...

And as for the act of apologizing for slavery/the Holocaust etc... I'm a staunch supporter of the decision made by the new United Nations in 2036, when they declared that no Earth citizen could be made to answer for the crimes of his race or forbears.

I don't think it makes sense for people to apologize for something they weren't involved with, any things like that should certainly be remembered and governments should do what they can to make up for harms collectively committed by the nation and see it do it they don't commit further crimes. But trying to make individual people who weren't even born when the holocaust or slavery occurred feel guilt about it is taking it too far in my opinion.

American society would not be what it is today had it not been for slavery. For better or for worse, it's part of the cultural legacy. I think it is something to be addressed. First Nations people's exploitation and abuse is at least acknowledged (although in Canada some of the conditions on the reserves are abominable still today.) But there is nothing offered to African Americans. Okay, there's Martin Luther King Jr. day. But I think there should be a recognition on a national level that the relationship between African and European Americans is troubled.

Also I had to look up Timur the Lame and found this interesting anecdote:

It was. In 1964. It's been further addressed in 1972 and continues to be addressed today. However, if you're looking to pin responsibility on someone, you're about 150 years too late.

No not responsibility. More of an acknowledgement of the benefit gained from the exploitation of African Americans. It would be impossible to offer financial compensation. But maybe a little appreciation and contrition. The European Americans living today have not kept slaves, but the society they live in was built on slave labour.

But its coming to a head anyway. I know I'm up here in Canada, but you guys are scaring me. There are some places that seem on the brink of civil war. Trump is talking about building a ridiculous wall (which I assume is metaphorical,) domestic and terrorist attacks. But I guess this is the way in other countries these days too, France and others. We've had terrorism up here too and I'm sure we'll see more. Interesting times for sure. Someone mentioned martial law in another thread and I think that will happen. Probably a lot like Israel.

We must never forget the legacy of the Transatlantic Slave Trade.

Nor must we forget the Holocaust.

I don't feel generations removed from both should have to bear the burden/blame for them, though.

And I'm a Jew who has dated many African-descended ladies.

Protests in Charlotte:
CNN: Charlotte police shooting: Protests turn ugly again

I'll have to read more on this.

The cops say that the guy refused to drop his weapon.

Some people (guess whose supporters) actually still defend and want slavery re-introduced... so perhaps no guilt-tripping for anyone else except the aforementioned reprobates, but certainly not deliberately forgetting lest history repeat itself because, as it happens, the civil war still rages in some people's minds centuries later somehow.

Chicago Tribune: Trump embraces 'stop-and-frisk' policing tactic

Our societies were also built on the back of thousands of years of bloodshed, rape, religious persecution and oppressive class systems. Just as you won't find those responsible anywhere today, you won't find any of the victims either. Our responsibility is to learn from the mistakes of our forebears and not repeat them. That's pretty much it.



Trump's wall is most assuredly real, though I'm not sure it qualifies as ridiculous. As for the rest, I think there's far too much doom-mongering and chicken-littling going on to make perfect sense of everything, but I'm fairly certain it'll all come out in the wash.

The Economist: Daily chart
The economics of Donald Trump’s wall

Very little good comes out of resentment or guilt alone. It is not a good starting point for positive change. It doesn't result in practical solutions.

I wrote a post while back about about the Indian Reservations in the US, and how quite a lot of them are abject failures, if anything the native Americans had much better prospect outside them than in. There are exceptions, which are for sound economic reasons, but overall I'm not a fan of them. Mainly becuase they are token, and provide very bad standard of living. The way of life, the culture and even the land is not the same as the past, so we must to pretend we can turn back the clock.

Having been born in South Africa, and my dad's job being to do with back an protest politics these reserve remind me a lot of the "Homelands" or Grand Apartheid. Not to be confused with Petit Apartheid, which were the townships.

What do you think that this token gifting will do exactly? If you think it will somehow bring about racial harmony I think you are sadly mistaken. it will only cause further resentment with people whose socio-economic situation is a lot worse than the middle class academics and student that are race baiting, as equally bad as those living in the "ghetto", but without the recognition.

Are you assuming that the black community have received nothing since the Lyndon B. Johnson government and the civil right movements? Sorry but the reality is the many policies designed to help haven't, and if anything had stagnated progress. This is despite these areas voting mostly Democrat.

Martin Luther King Jr. wanted people people to be judged by the content of the character. Mandela thought us that even if you are breaking rock on Robin island you must refuse at all costs to be a victim. They are the antithesis of the movement for BLM leaders. If you don't believe me read their website, it is just a slew of unreasonable demands and thinly veiled racism that will solve nothing. The principled civil right leader were against resentment and bitterness.

There are African Americans not falling for the race baiting, and virtue signaling. They don't want further division, and generally feel accepted among their peers. This race baiting ideology doesn't come from ordinary people living in these communities. It comes fro certain academic associated with Intersectionality and Marxism.

This I can agree on. This wall is stupid, anyone with half a brain would know it is not going to work. There are too many holes (pun intended) in the plan.

You would be better off spending the money on reducing corruption in the region, and supporting the grown of Central American economies. Also stopping the war on drugs.

I'm not sure what you mean by token gifting. Obviously setting up reserves for African Americans is a ridiculous idea. What about a national stat holiday like "Slavery Remembrance Day?"