What's a 'moderate'?

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I keep hearing this word. It basically means a politician that stands for the interests of the corporate machine/s. Whether it's a new 'moderate' leader for UKIP or one of the many against Jeremy Corbyn. Apparently Corbyn is a extremist, far-left radical for being against the possibility of people being nuked and war in general, but those in favor are the 'moderates'. We have 'moderates' like Yvette Cooper who has helped wars continue or spiral out of control in Libya, Iraq and Syria. She also voted against an investigation into the Iraq war. Tristram Hunt attacked the "Stop The War Coalition". Liz Kendall Supports a "two-state solution" for Israel/Palestine, but is against a Palestinian state.... Chuka Umunna thinks it's "STUPID" for British firms to want employ British workers. He is against the spread of betting shops in his constituency but took a £20,000 gift from a gambling executive. He's a radical supporter of multiculturalism and has also helped wars spiral out of control in the Middle East.

We then had the 'moderate rebels' in Syria who were charging around decapitating people and eating people's organs.

People who are against these kind of narratives can also be labelled as "extremists". Unless the 'moderate rebels' were living in Europe, they would then be 'extremists'. These labels are so vague and stupid it's embarrassing.

Hard to see how you can pin any Middle Eastern wars on Cooper or Umunna. Cooper was John Prescott's assistant in 2003, has never worked in the Foreign Office or MoD while in government, and was out of power for the Arab Spring. Umunna has never been in government.

A moderate is a politician who does not take extreme stances. They're generally pragmatists rather than idealists and can appeal to large portions of society. However, they're also often susceptible to political winds. Look at Hillary Clinton and gay marriage, for example.

Moderates should not be confused with centrists, although there is a lot of overlap. Centrism can be ideological and radical, aiming to balance equality and prosperity by compromising between two extremes. Being "moderate" overlaps with being centrist, but you can't really be a radical moderate or an ideological moderate. Moderates are just people who are less extreme than, erm, extremist.

Being against war in any circumstances is definitely an extreme position. Sometimes war is necessary to stop evil. War stopped the Nazis. War would stop ISIS. Being against war against such organisations in any circumstances is extremist, no doubt about that.

As the political spectrum isn't a ratio scale (and thus has no natural zero), the term "moderate" is always defined in relation to another political position... The same thing applies to the "centrist" political label...

Depending on the political, religious, national and regional context, a policy position which is considered "moderate" under some circumstances may be considered "extreme" in other circumstances, and vice versa.

The concept of "faux" moderate political positions was even famously mocked in by Jonathan Swift in 1729 in A Modest Proposal:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/A_Modest_Proposal

Richard Nixon would be seen as being a "moderate" a Republican in 2016. He certainly wasn't seen as being moderate in 1968.

What Nixon actually did was way to the left of all the Republicans and nearly all Democrates today.

Detente with the Soviet Union and China
Cease Fire after the 1973 Arab Israeli War
Created Affirmitave Action (racial quotas)
Created EPA
Wage and Price Freeze

It was not out of good heart but pure political calculation but it was what it was.

Because of their voting records. Perhaps read both of their voting records. It also shows they will continue the same kind of wars we have been seeing. 'Moderate' and 'extreme/ism' don't mean anything! It is sheer propaganda. Just because positions are labelled 'moderate' or 'extreme' by the corporate media and corrupt politicians, it doesn't make it so. Yes, they are saying whatever they can to get into positions of power and don't mean a word they say. Clinton lies so much it comes naturally to her and seems to actually believe her own lies.

That all just means nothing as far as I'm concerned. Especially when you can find stances by alleged 'centrists' and 'moderates' that are psychotic, hypocritical and reckless.

Not everything can be pinned back to WWII. The year after the end, Churchill was foaming at the mouth about attacking the Soviets. The war machine needs conflict to thrive and keep sick people rich. We sided with Stalin (who was just as evil) during the war. So it wasn't because we don't like evil people. It's all the same, like how the West is allegedly fighting evil now because it loves democracy etc. There are ulterior motives i'm afraid. The US supported ISIS basically so they could try and get rid of Assad and to have an excuse to get troops etc into Syria.

True, things have changed in that respect. There's different problems today.

Moderate and Extreme are relative terms. It has been pointed out by another poster that there is no definite scale to measure a position against.

Yep."Moderate" just means the midpoint between the extremes. If the whole road makes a hairpin turn then so does the middle of the road.

As I said. "Extreme" means nothing either.

...Basically , his " law-and-order " stance in the '68 election (Which Trump people have said was a model for their approach in Cleveland ! !! !! !! !!) made him seem more conservative - Plus , his association with McCarthyism/Red-baiting in the 50s , for which many more lefty people perpetually HATEHATEHATED him !
Of course , " 60s idealist " hero (and murdered , so a martyr...) Bobby Kennedy was Tailgunner Joe and Roy Cohn's favorite " Democrat Party " person in the Fifties , too . Don't get me started on the Kennedys ! .....................

Last edited by ASS-P on 11 Oct 2016, 8:04 pm, edited 1 time in total.

A moderate is whatever I am. An extremist is whatever you are.

A moderate is that rare person who acknowledges that no slope goes uphill or downhill both ways.

It's a nonsense term designed to exclude people from rational debate and in turn democratic power by preemptively depicting everyone else as a painted-face lunatic. Moderate (sounds reasonable) is whatever I am, my opponents are extremist (sounds Hitler-y). People do seem to be waking up lately to the understanding that "moderate" or "the centre-right/centre-left" in modern Western countries is actually so absurdly, masochistically Left wing that it makes your buttocks clench.

Centre-right is left-wing? Where is the logic in that, Mikah?

And how else could religious fundamentalists be categorized, especially violent ones?

Violence is generally what is extreme, so unless one advocates it one isn't extremist...

The Centre-right party in our fair land, among many other things, was the party that pushed through the gay marriage law, without asking. Need I say more?



It's probably a reasonable term in that instance, but as you know the term extremist has been applied to Nigel Farage for advocating a reduction in immigration and to Jeremy Corbyn for being an old school socialist. They hardly fall into the category of violent religious fundamentalists.