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JohnPowell
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22 Feb 2017, 5:46 pm

People who say they're 'anti-racist' really must be honest with themselves. Just look at this

https://i.redd.it/pfq096lpp8hy.jpg


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kraftiekortie
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22 Feb 2017, 6:37 pm

I am anti-racist.

I don't believe in the notion that "minorities" cannot be racists. Of course they can be racists, too. Some of them virulently so.

If I saw a group of kids hanging out at 2 in the morning, wearing "hip hop" types clothes (whether they are black, white, or whatever), I might have second thoughts about passing them on the same side of the street. I might try to avoid them.

However, I could be wrong in trying to avoid them. They could actually be nice kids who happen to wear "hip hop" clothes and who like to hang out on the streets at 2 in the morning. I used to hang out in the streets at 2 in the morning sometimes when I was a teenager, though I'm too hold to have worn "hip hop" type clothes then. And I was a pretty nice kid---even when I was hanging out in a group.

My point, really, is that everybody has racist thoughts, or classist thoughts, or just prejudicial thoughts in general---but we, as humans, are capable of thinking things through so that we can transcend all the prejudice when it is unjustified.



Last edited by kraftiekortie on 22 Feb 2017, 6:40 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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22 Feb 2017, 6:40 pm

I tend to avoid people dressed like me in general.



Mikah
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22 Feb 2017, 10:57 pm

Nice little infographic. The headline near the bottom is a particularly amusing read.

http://thoughtcatalog.com/emily-goldste ... te-people/

It's so virulent my first thought was that it must be parody, but it's difficult to tell, given all the other garbage that emanates from that side of the tracks.


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Sweetleaf
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22 Feb 2017, 11:31 pm

JohnPowell wrote:
People who say they're 'anti-racist' really must be honest with themselves. Just look at this

https://i.redd.it/pfq096lpp8hy.jpg


I'd consider myself anti-racist, but I also don't want to be associated with extremists that consider themselves to be such...like these a**holes who apparently got a concert of one of the bands I like shut down in some other state, by accussing the band of being racists and then making threats when they didn't want to drop that band.

The band was Marduk, and sure they may be very dark, grim and even satanic....but they aren't nazis lol.


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Sweetleaf
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22 Feb 2017, 11:31 pm

JohnPowell wrote:
People who say they're 'anti-racist' really must be honest with themselves. Just look at this

https://i.redd.it/pfq096lpp8hy.jpg


I'd consider myself anti-racist, but I also don't want to be associated with extremists that consider themselves to be such...like these a**holes who apparently got a concert of one of the bands I like shut down in some other state, by accussing the band of being racists and then making threats when the venue or whatever didn't want to drop that band. The police made them cancel because of security concerns due to the threats...perhaps I can dig up that article.

The band was Marduk, and sure they may be very dark, grim and even satanic ....but they aren't nazis lol.


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The_Walrus
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23 Feb 2017, 8:22 am

Have we reached peak irony-blindness?

First up, quite a few of those headlines are difficult to construe as racist even in the form they are. Black supremacy is toxic! Black pride is a pretty dodgy concept if you ignore the historical context! Black privilege, if it were real, would be a bad thing! And how the f**k is thinking "thank f**k my son looks black" racist, or realising that's not good that you have to think like that?

Most importantly, several of the headlines there are doing the same thing that the genius who compiled this was doing. For example, "reasons white people riot" was criticising people for complaining when black people riot but ignoring it when white people do. "Let's hope the Boston bomber is white" is taking shots at the racial narratives surrounding terrorism. "Are black men waging the real war on cops?" is pointing out that while black people get almost all the criticism for being anti-cop, targeted cop killings seem to largely pass without reference to race when they're done by a white person.

It's hard to tell from the headline alone, but the "white trash" headline seems to be attacking the disenfranchisement of poor white people.

And a lot of them simply aren't cases where you can strip the context. It's like if you switched "poor" and "rich", things like "increase taxes on the rich" or "the rich can look after themselves" would suddenly seem rather mean-spirited. It doesn't mean the original statement was mean-spirited. As an extreme example, "white genocide" is an idea spread by racist white people to justify their racism. That's why jokes about white genocide are funny while jokes about black genocide would usually be poorly thought out; to my knowledge, there's no prominent equivalent movement complaining about a non-existent black genocide.

Some of these are simple matters of fact, like the results of research.

"Angry black men" certainly seems racist, as do a few of the others. In the specific case of "angry black men", I think it's important to remember that most people who say things like "Angry White Men" are distinguishing between angry white men ("there are no parking spaces! incidentally I am a white man") and "Angry White Men (TM)" ("too immigrants taking my jobs and black people shooting my kids!"). I can't say whether that's the sense they're using it, but it's not great PR either way.

So yeah in this case I think the people posting this as proof of how "anti-racist" they are should take a good hard look at themselves. Are you concerned about equality, or have you decided that we must have equality right now regardless of any evidence?



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23 Feb 2017, 5:40 pm

So... the point is not to be anti-racist? :? :P


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JohnPowell
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24 Feb 2017, 5:52 pm

The_Walrus wrote:
Have we reached peak irony-blindness?

First up, quite a few of those headlines are difficult to construe as racist even in the form they are. Black supremacy is toxic! Black pride is a pretty dodgy concept if you ignore the historical context! Black privilege, if it were real, would be a bad thing! And how the f**k is thinking "thank f**k my son looks black" racist, or realising that's not good that you have to think like that?

Most importantly, several of the headlines there are doing the same thing that the genius who compiled this was doing. For example, "reasons white people riot" was criticising people for complaining when black people riot but ignoring it when white people do. "Let's hope the Boston bomber is white" is taking shots at the racial narratives surrounding terrorism. "Are black men waging the real war on cops?" is pointing out that while black people get almost all the criticism for being anti-cop, targeted cop killings seem to largely pass without reference to race when they're done by a white person.

It's hard to tell from the headline alone, but the "white trash" headline seems to be attacking the disenfranchisement of poor white people.

And a lot of them simply aren't cases where you can strip the context. It's like if you switched "poor" and "rich", things like "increase taxes on the rich" or "the rich can look after themselves" would suddenly seem rather mean-spirited. It doesn't mean the original statement was mean-spirited. As an extreme example, "white genocide" is an idea spread by racist white people to justify their racism. That's why jokes about white genocide are funny while jokes about black genocide would usually be poorly thought out; to my knowledge, there's no prominent equivalent movement complaining about a non-existent black genocide.

Some of these are simple matters of fact, like the results of research.

"Angry black men" certainly seems racist, as do a few of the others. In the specific case of "angry black men", I think it's important to remember that most people who say things like "Angry White Men" are distinguishing between angry white men ("there are no parking spaces! incidentally I am a white man") and "Angry White Men (TM)" ("too immigrants taking my jobs and black people shooting my kids!"). I can't say whether that's the sense they're using it, but it's not great PR either way.

So yeah in this case I think the people posting this as proof of how "anti-racist" they are should take a good hard look at themselves. Are you concerned about equality, or have you decided that we must have equality right now regardless of any evidence?


You've totally missed the point. It's a simple one, that if the colors were reversed, the paper would be shut down and the publishers would be arrested pretty much. There's been just as many white slaves throughout history, so why couldn't there be "white pride"?

Also you're missing the point that when it comes to white people saying stuff about non whites, it doesn't matter if it has an ounce of truth in it, it'll just be deemed as racist and there will be a storm against that paper or person etc. I'd imagine the person who compiled it is just making a point about the massive double standards.

You say "black trash" or "Jew trash" and you're in serious trouble. "White trash" is acceptable apparently.

The person admits that 'diversity' is about getting rid of white people, and says that's a good thing. Notice that wholly non white countries aren't forced to "embrace" 'diversity'. That's because the black population is rising.

No, most of the media were pushing the "angry white men" farce about blaming results on that.

'Equality' doesn't mean anything. It's just a propaganda slogan.


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JohnPowell
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24 Feb 2017, 5:53 pm

Kraichgauer wrote:
So... the point is not to be anti-racist? :? :P


The point is to be consistent and practice what you preach.


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jrjones9933
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24 Feb 2017, 6:00 pm

No, the point is to promote classic racist ideas while saying it's anti-racism. It would be fun to have a Whiteness Appreciation Society, but a White Power Club is just ridiculous. Black Power is about Black People having Equal Power, same with Grrl Power, etc. White Men are delusional if they think that their group doesn't have most of the power. If they aren't getting their share of the power within that group, guess what? Same is true of all other groups. Promoting more inequality won't solve that.

Powerful white men trying to get less powerful white men to blame someone else would be hilarious if it didn't work.


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24 Feb 2017, 6:15 pm

Anybody can be a bigot, but these days, it seems like people only use the term "bigotry" when white Christians are the culprits.


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kraftiekortie
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24 Feb 2017, 6:22 pm

Even so, ANYBODY can be a bigot.

I will say that till the grave.



JohnPowell
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24 Feb 2017, 6:29 pm

jrjones9933 wrote:
No, the point is to promote classic racist ideas while saying it's anti-racism. It would be fun to have a Whiteness Appreciation Society, but a White Power Club is just ridiculous. Black Power is about Black People having Equal Power, same with Grrl Power, etc. White Men are delusional if they think that their group doesn't have most of the power. If they aren't getting their share of the power within that group, guess what? Same is true of all other groups. Promoting more inequality won't solve that.

Powerful white men trying to get less powerful white men to blame someone else would be hilarious if it didn't work.


Power in what, just in the US? Have you tried reading other articles that aren't posted by Salon?


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jrjones9933
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24 Feb 2017, 6:36 pm

This thread explains a lot, JP. Thanks for the clarification.

As regards the weird accusations, I don't respond to them. It's pointless.

Kraftie, I agree. I like using the term bigot for individuals, and reserving all isms for social constructs.


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JohnPowell
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24 Feb 2017, 6:38 pm

'isms' are just used to stifle debate and enforce new laws.


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