On Ashkenazi Mitochondrial DNA

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Hi all. I found this article that may be inconvenient for some people.

http://www.sciencemag.org/news/2013/10/did-modern-jews-originate-italy

TL;DR: Ashkenazi Jews traditionally believe that they can trace their ancestry back to the Ancient Israelites via the maternal line. However, recent analysis of Ashkenazi Jews suggests that their mitochondrial DNA is European. This implies that many Ashkenazi Jews are actually descendants of European women who converted to Judaism.

This challenges claims of Israelite ancestry which are used to justify Zionism, though this also challenges many anti-Semitic beliefs. For example, many anti-Semites insist that Jews are "naturally insular and ethnocentric" ... even though they were willing to accept converts during medieval times.

It's almost as though we're all just human or something. Who would have guessed?

Have long been aware of the earlier studies mentioned of nuclear DNA that confirmed that Diaspora Jews had an origin in the Levant and were in fact close cousins of the Arabs, (ironically especially the Palestinian Arabs). So I don't know what to make of this. The Khazar theory though does seem to be put to rest.

The Diaspora began peacefully even before the destruction of the Temple in 70 AD with Jewish merchants leaving Judea to other points in the Hellensitic and later Roman worlds. Alexandria and Rome had Jewish residents before Christ. Jews from Judea may have taken gentile Italian wives in that period. So the origins of modern Diaspora Jews could be some complex combination of Italian and actual Middle eastern sources.

That's actually old news, as I've known about that for a few years now.
It is true that Judaism traces their line through the mother, but if any of them see their Jewishness as racial, then perhaps they've been looking at the wrong parents.

Fascinating....
With the assumption of its accuracy...




Assuming its validity, this would be objective historic revisionism as it should be, using modern techniques/methodology.
It should be embraced rather than cater to doctrine and the desires of what some people wish it to be...
"The truth may be inconvenient but it is never politically incorrect..."

It's not very hard to see why so many women converted to Judaism back then. The Talmud is surprisingly pro-feminist compared to the Bible.

For example, the Talmud states that women will get a greater reward in the afterlife than men.

Additionally, many medieval peasant women may have married Jewish merchants just to get out of poverty and avoid the threat of starvation.

Then there was the simple fact that in the ancient and Medieval periods, women were at best second class citizens, which meant the religion of their husbands was automatically theirs.

I think the last consideration may have more validity...
I have a rather superficial understanding of Jewish culture, but I have been told that there is significant religious segregation of women, which suggests a significant patriarchal emphasis...in this life at least...
Please correct me if I am wrong...

Never forget: Wealth is an aphrodisiac...

You'll still find that sexual segregation among ultra Orthodox, fundamentalist Jews today as their mindset is still based in the ancient Middle East. Though not so much among the more moderate and liberal forms of Judaism, and doubtlessly not at all among secular Jews.

Ashkenazi jews are predominantly caucasian to the extent that claiming they are not "white" is like putting a drop of wine in Lake Superior and calling all of the water in it wine.

However, among Ashkenazi jews are some male individuals with the Kohanim Y haplogroup, which is also shared with the black Lemba jews of Africa, indicating the two groups have ancestry that does trace to the ancient Israelites.

However this is irrelevant as far as judaism is concerned because judaism, while not an evangelical religion, is a religion that welcomes converts and converts who keep the covenant are equal beneficiaries of that covenant in the eyes of jews.

Concerning the concept of jewishness by descent, rabbinical jews are matrilineal and karaite jews are patrilineal.

In any instance, neo nazis/white supremacists are incorrect in their assertion that Ashkenazi jews are not white, and in their assertion that Ashkenazi jews are not valid spiritual descendants of the Israelites by the standards of their own religion.

Well, for the Jews strict about matrilinearity, Moses's wife would make as much of a problem as this research.
But I don't personally know anyone with this attitude.
Fact, I don't know any ultra-orthodox Jews. The ones I discussed such issues with were either secular, moderate conservatist, or reform. None of them was really strict about matrilinearity.

Non secular rabbincal jews, particularly orthodox rabbinical jews, when confronted with instances of non jewish women in their history, will proclaim conversion, and conversion in their mind is the modern conversion process, which is not detailed or referenced in the torah.

OR when really confronted with the issue, will suddenly take the stance that if it was more than x generations back (sometimes 4, sonetimes 6 or 7) and details are lacking but the family has been jewish as long as anyone knows, jewishness was conveyed at some point.

Basically backwards justifications and some acrobatics to get around the evidence for patrilineal descent.

More secure rabbinical jews will agree that Israelites were patrilineal and acknowledge that this may have been the case up until some time after the destruction of the second temple and diaspora and may theorize non divine reasons for the change but will be of the philosophy that " but this is what we do now so this is what we will do".

There has actually been a lot of contention between reform jews and other rabbinical jews over the issue of descent as reform jews often recognize patrilineal jews as jews and think other rabbinical branches should as well. But for some reason other rabbinical branches have really dug in their heels and have doubled down on this issue. They seem to really take it as a threat to their identity.

However despite this, Israel recognizes Karaite jews as jews...maybe because there are 30,000 of them there and they have the oldest synogogue in Israel.