Should we change the way we talk about Trump?

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Hi all. This is another thread directed at my fellow liberal lefties. I just want to share some stuff that I have been thinking.

I've realised that most people who know about the existence of Donald Trump can be divided into these three categories.

1. people who know that Donald Trump is a racist
2. people who will always believe that Donald Trump isn't a racist, no matter how much evidence we give
3. people who know that Trump is a racist and love him for it

Again, I'm not saying that Trump isn't a racist. He clearly is. I'm just saying that most people have already taken a firm stance on this issue. The point of an argument is to either learn from people or teach them. Thus, it is pointless to argue with someone who already has firm, fixed beliefs. You'll just get angry. They'll just laugh. It's all pointless.

I have a similar attitude towards Trump's sexism and his fascist-like tendencies. Trump is obviously a misogynist, but everyone has already taken a firm stance on this issue. Thus, arguing about this is pointless. Trump does use rhetoric that is reminiscent of Benito Mussolini ... but everyone has already taken a firm stance on this issue.

That's why I'm going to stop commenting on every racist thing that Trump says from now on. The debate has already been settled. The losers refuse to accept defeat. Instead, I'm going to focus on Trump's policies. After all, policies are more important than rhetoric.

The Trumpers have made it very clear that they don't care about the language that Trump uses. Therefore, it's time for us to focus on Trump's policies. The world already has to many political debates that focus on style rather than substance.

Yeah, maybe try to point out the positive things Trump does.

Maybe give the the racist, sexist, misogynistic, zenophobic, homophobic, islamphobic, science-denying, KKK-supporting, hateful, wrong-at-everything, "basket of deplorables" criticisms a rest?

What positive things?



Well ... we still need to address Trump's science denial, since this puts human lives in danger.

Right now Trump is negotiating NAFTA. He has even threatened to end it.

This is arguably the biggest US economic labor cause in my lifetime.

Bernie Sanders supports this.

If you are pro-Sanders, then this is an incredible development, as likely no mainstream politician would ever do what Trump is doing.

Bernie Sanders Tells Trump to Keep His Promise on Nafta
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles ... ur-promise

I'd like to see more liberals and Democrats attack the corruption within the DNC for giving us such a horrible candidate as Hillary, which led to a Trump presidency.

Last edited by VegetableMan on 21 Jan 2018, 4:35 pm, edited 1 time in total.

A+

While I deeply regret the Balkanization of this country, I have neither the patience nor the communication skills necessary to carry on a rational conversation with cult members who truly believe that Obama was a Communist Muslim Kenyan secretly infiltrating Islamic Brotherhood jihadis cleverly disguised as Honduran refugee children in hoodies into the country in a nefarious plot to inflict health care on everyone and steal Christmas. It's literally like trying to have a rational conversation with a florid psychotic. I actually have more intelligent conversations with my dog; at least we can both agree upon what constitutes the basic reality of a "ball".

It really is pointless arguing with the minority of voters who voted Fascist in the last election (and they are a minority; 25.5%; Hillary Clinton won the popular vote by 2.9 million votes). The reason we have the Ku Klux Klan's chosen candidate in the White House is the 46.9% of the eligible electorate who simply couldn't be bothered to perform the most basic of civic responsibilities; to go out and goddamn vote.

All that ever matters are the policies! The economic welfare of the United States is not dependent on wether or not the president is a decent person. The whole thing about people arguing back and forth about Trump’s comments and rhetoric are pointless. All that matters are the policies and how he runs the country not how he talks on social media or how he talks to the press. Go ahead and make comments about how at my age, I have no clue what I’m talking about and blah blah blah. I have always been against the senseless arguments and will not be reposting to this thread so insult away.

Perhaps they don't believe in anything. They could just be trolling you. From what I've observed, most Trump supporters are nihilistic punks with no moral code or concrete belief system. All of their brainpower is devoted to saying the right thing to get the funniest response. To them, it's all a joke, even when innocent people are murdered.



Almost half of the US didn't vote in the last election because there was barely any difference between the two candidates. The American people are becoming cynical nihilists who see politics as a carnival freak show. They see no real hope or change in sight.

If Sanders had won the primaries, the voter turnout would have been much greater.

Last edited by DarthMetaKnight on 21 Jan 2018, 5:31 pm, edited 1 time in total.

I agree with you 100%!

I'm not going to insult you. You have taken the high road, and so I shall take the high road as well.

My view is that Trump doesn't have any real political beliefs (or integrity). His only cause is Trump. My view is that he doesn't believe the things he says either, he says them because he is for sale (to the NRA and others). The only cause that Trump has ever shown consistency in is Trump self-interest.

The real issue, to my mind anyway, is the people who wilfully ignore the his opportunistic political history, and it is often transparently true of party hoppers that their self interest is the only factor in their political choices.

Trump is a reality television personality, with all that represents, in more ways than one. The rise of reality tv co-incident with the rise of Trump to POTUS is no coincidence.

The change needed in the way that we talk about Trump is to see things in their overall perspective, and his lack of integrity as a constant, not what he says this day or that day. Even Trump doesn't believe what he says. He is performing in his biggest reality tv and twitter show yet, consistently fed the attention he so craves. If there was a Nobel Prize for narcissistic behaviour, he would be the outright winner. And that would be funny, if it weren't for the damage he has done and is still doing.

He may be 6 feet one inch in height, be he is a tiny man in integrity, and I think Americans deep down know that, they aren't that stupid. But tribalism has taken hold in a way that relegates truth as irrelevant in its support of the Trump Show. Let's call it what it is - The Trump Show. It's a caricature of a presidency, but it keeps the people entertained.

It seems to me that this is a critical time for the USA. America First is going to be America alone, if the current circus continues, and it was always a myth that America can prosper without allies, without trade, without international bases, without oil from Canada and other countries and so on. Isolationist countries like Albania as it was and North Korea as it is are not models any Western democracy would sanely wish to emulate. But there is a madness in the USA at the moment, that is driven by mindless slogans, tribalism, and polarity. But most of all driven and fed by Trump at the helm spreading division, hatred, spite and lies.

I wish my grandson was not playing basketball in the USA now, even though that was his childhood dream and he has achieved it. I worry about his safety every day, on all levels.

Here's the main problem with political discourse in general: Too many people see it as a team sport. Too few people remember that politicians have the ability to decide who lives and who dies.

Of course, our billionaire overlords want us to see politics as a team sport ... so that we are afraid to criticize our own "team". This dumbs people down and lowers the overall quality of political discourse.

In most team sports, human lives aren't on the line ... unless it's football.

Don't be so harsh on the non-voters. Many working class people are unable to get out of work on a weekday while the middle-class right can take paid leave on election day. I'm not expecting this to change because certain people like it this way as it makes it easier for them to get elected.

Maybe the reason my country is more left leaning is because our elections are always held on a Sunday to ensure it doesn't conflict with most people's work.

Yes, I used to compare him to an orangutan, but I've since found out that orangutans are intelligent creatures. I'm not sure which animal I should use that sounds good in a sentence and is actually not very intelligent, so I just use the term Oompa Loompa. They seem pretty intelligent but they're fictional so whatever. They're also orange, so they fit from a visual standpoint. So yes, the way I talk about Trump has changed.

thanks for this, Darth, all the constant new threads on every little dumb thing he says (allegedly or otherwise) have been getting legitimately maddening and almost make me miss the "gunz r bad" threads we used to have, especially since they all seem to morph into the same ugly back and forth soon thereafter...

i would still try to emphasize existing threads and maybe not open a new one every day. not that you've been doing this exactly, but still.

a bit less sensationalism goes a long way to making this site's atmosphere more agreeable.



i think the most meaningful and long lasting change we'll ever see, won't come from washington legislature or any end result of politics as we execute it currently.

how can they be up to the task of fixing our problems when the incentives corrupting them are so powerful and pervasive?