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thinkinginpictures
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07 Aug 2018, 6:42 am

https://www.thelocal.de/20180806/why-ge ... vice-again

60 % of the germans are pro-conscription. The same applies for Denmark, Sweden, US, UK, everywhere in the entire world.

I believe the draft is evil. It is evil to force someone to do work under threat of imprisonment if they don't. And I don't care s**t about wether it is military or alternative civilian service. The mere idea of forced labor is evil.

Being told what NOT to do is fine. Thats how we prevent crime, but when it becomes a crime to be passive, and being told what TO DO (and if you refuse, you'd face imprisonment) is an entirely different thing. One might argue taxation works this way, but I see vast differences between taxation and conscription.

At worst, taxation is only about giving a portion of your money to the government, which cares not how you got them, and if you've earned no money, usually you don't pay taxes either. Conscription requires you to physically be at a physical location at a given time and given orders to follow and if you don't follow the exact physical orders and tasks, you face punishment. That's the difference!

What's your opinion?



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07 Aug 2018, 8:27 am

My opinion is that any able-bodied person of sound mind who refuses to serve his or her country is either a slacker or a traitor ... maybe both.


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BTDT
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07 Aug 2018, 8:43 am

It is very common for stronger societies to make slaves out of the societies that can't defend themselves. A draft is a way of preventing that.



Spooky_Mulder
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07 Aug 2018, 10:45 am

A draft is evil.

F “patriotism.” Especially in a country where I’m deemed less than a natural born citizen, despite living here the same amount of time, and still have to fight to be free.

F being able bodied and of sound mind. Going to war I may lose both and if it’s a war I don’t believe in and in a country where I still have to fight to be free - why the f would I ever f-ing do that?

It’s all about whether or not one believes in what they are fighting for. I would have enlisted immediately in World War 2.

But Vietnam and this current war? F that, no f-ing way.



Last edited by Spooky_Mulder on 07 Aug 2018, 11:50 am, edited 1 time in total.

Cash__
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07 Aug 2018, 11:04 am

I'd be willing to fight to defend my country. I am not willing to go fight useless wars spreading American imperialism across the world.

So I am against the draft but it has nothing to do about me being a slacker or traitor. If Amercia's foreign policy was different, i might not be as opposed to the draft.



thinkinginpictures
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07 Aug 2018, 11:24 am

BTDT wrote:
It is very common for stronger societies to make slaves out of the societies that can't defend themselves. A draft is a way of preventing that.


Yeah, in order to avoid slavery, let's have it already!



thinkinginpictures
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07 Aug 2018, 11:31 am

Fnord wrote:
My opinion is that any able-bodied person of sound mind who refuses to serve his or her country is either a slacker or a traitor ... maybe both.


If the definition of slacking and treason is to keep one's own legs, arms and/or life and generally wants personal/individual freedom as long as you don't harm others, then one should be proud of being a slacker and a traitor!

Being a slacker is a compliment!

I _HATE_ people who wants to deprive me of my liberty!
I my opinion, such people deserve no life!

If that includes hating and wish death to the entire population of planet Earth, then let it be so!



Last edited by thinkinginpictures on 07 Aug 2018, 11:35 am, edited 1 time in total.

DarthMetaKnight
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07 Aug 2018, 11:35 am

I'm only okay with the draft if women can be drafted as well.


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thinkinginpictures
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07 Aug 2018, 11:37 am

DarthMetaKnight wrote:
I'm only okay with the draft if women can be drafted as well.


You're making a fallacy!

An unethical institution does not become ethical by applying the same unethical institution to more people!

The draft is unethical. It only becomes more unethical to apply it to more people as well. It should be abolished altogether!



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07 Aug 2018, 12:16 pm

I don't believe in the draft.

In my time in the military, the last thing I would've wanted was to have to serve next to people who were forced to be there.


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Fnord
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07 Aug 2018, 12:21 pm

XFilesGeek wrote:
... In my time in the military, the last thing I would've wanted was to have to serve next to people who were forced to be there.
That is a very good point. Such people can sap morale and compromise operational readiness. I guess that's why such people are usually transferred to the front-line infantry...


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thinkinginpictures
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07 Aug 2018, 1:21 pm

Fnord wrote:
I guess that's why such people are usually transferred to the front-line infantry...


And that's evil!

Guess what? A country that does such terrible things as forcing innocent reluctant civilians into the army and place them in the front line, are NO BETTER than the evil enemy!



thinkinginpictures
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07 Aug 2018, 1:26 pm

I can't help but wonder why so many aspies are so eager to support the draft. Aspies/people on the autistic spectrum definetely would not benefit from the military!

WrongPlanet would've been the last place I would expect so much support for the draft...
But I was wrong.



Chronos
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08 Aug 2018, 1:18 am

thinkinginpictures wrote:
https://www.thelocal.de/20180806/why-germany-is-talking-about-compulsory-national-service-again

60 % of the germans are pro-conscription. The same applies for Denmark, Sweden, US, UK, everywhere in the entire world.

I believe the draft is evil. It is evil to force someone to do work under threat of imprisonment if they don't. And I don't care s**t about wether it is military or alternative civilian service. The mere idea of forced labor is evil.

Being told what NOT to do is fine. Thats how we prevent crime, but when it becomes a crime to be passive, and being told what TO DO (and if you refuse, you'd face imprisonment) is an entirely different thing. One might argue taxation works this way, but I see vast differences between taxation and conscription.

At worst, taxation is only about giving a portion of your money to the government, which cares not how you got them, and if you've earned no money, usually you don't pay taxes either. Conscription requires you to physically be at a physical location at a given time and given orders to follow and if you don't follow the exact physical orders and tasks, you face punishment. That's the difference!

What's your opinion?


I would prefer we don't have wars but given the nature of our species, I think they are inevitable and a country that does not conscript people to defend it is a country that would not last long in the face of an invading enemy.



Spooky_Mulder
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08 Aug 2018, 2:02 am

/\ Not a problem in the US. We’ve been colonizing plenty as an empire force without a draft.

With that said, we also basically do have a draft it just isn’t called one - it’s giving poor people no other choice.