Does killing abusive partner or parent is still crime

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pawelk1986
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01 Nov 2018, 7:41 am

https://answers.yahoo.com/question/inde ... 820AAxBhZY

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Do you think that prosecution charges for the murder of an aggressive father, spouse or child (the psycho one like Macaulay Kuklin in movie the Good boy) is not exaggeration.

I'm Polish, I really like good movies and crime series, like CSI.

Recently, I read a very sad article about the fact that one of our Polish 14-year-old boy killed his father, who constantly beat him with his belt, in every country there are such motherfuckers.

Well, minors under 16 years of age are judged with us for intentional crimes, or in which someone lost their health or life, although the prosecutor may request a trial before a common court as an adult if the situation so requires.

Well, this moron prosecutor wants this boy to judge an adult about the murder of murder with the reservation that it was a crime in the afflicted by punishment for 3 years (although in this case, the boy himself was a victim, it could be 12 months) to 8 years imprisonment .

In my opinion, it is a scandal that if someone kills such a monster, and is judged like for the murder of a man!

The same goes for wife killing abusive partner.

I have good life and had very good family, but my best friend had abusive Alcoholic father, he said that he loved and hate him, and plotted lot times how to kill him :P
Update: I once talked to one priest who is also my confessor, for what our church (Catholic Church) is so much against the death penalty, and the priest told me that for the same reason we are against abortion.
Our great Polish compatriot, Karol Wojtyla, in the west more known as John Paul II, when he was freed from the Soviet influence, lobbied as the Pope of the Church, and privately as a Polish citizen to abolish the death penalty in Poland.
Update 2: We had the death penalty before World War II, we had the Polish People's Republic (commie), but now it is gone. I once talked to a priest that countries recognized as more developed than us, such as Japan or the United States, have in their statues the death penalty to get rid of such bastards!

Priests told my "Nie sądź a nie będziesz sądzony" - Do not judge, and you will not be judged :D
Update 3: PS this boy that I read about in local news killed his dad using a knife when he was about to administer another series of spanking.



Fnord
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01 Nov 2018, 8:12 am

Murder is murder, whether the victim "needed killing" or not.



pawelk1986
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01 Nov 2018, 10:05 am

Fnord wrote:
Murder is murder, whether the victim "needed killing" or not.


Perhaps, but if someone is abusive toward they loved ones or kids?



lostonearth35
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01 Nov 2018, 10:30 am

I agree also that murder is murder, no matter what they did to you or someone else.

Naturally, that rule goes right out the window in times of war. :roll:



Kiprobalhato
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01 Nov 2018, 10:52 am

^what they said


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Arganger
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01 Nov 2018, 10:56 am

It is self defense as far as I am concerned. If you can handle it without killing the abuser that is best, but most people going though that do not know any other ways to handle it or are far to scared. If someone is killing someone causing them constant physical harm, and causing them to live in fear, possibly with unhelpful authorities, it is reasonable.


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Fnord
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01 Nov 2018, 12:48 pm

pawelk1986 wrote:
Fnord wrote:
Murder is murder, whether the victim "needed killing" or not.
Perhaps, but if someone is abusive toward they loved ones or kids?
It's still murder.

Who are you planning to kill?



VegetableMan
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01 Nov 2018, 1:35 pm

Arganger wrote:
It is self defense as far as I am concerned. If you can handle it without killing the abuser that is best, but most people going though that do not know any other ways to handle it or are far to scared. If someone is killing someone causing them constant physical harm, and causing them to live in fear, possibly with unhelpful authorities, it is reasonable.



In self defense at the moment of attack, I would agree. But I hope you're not advocating pre-meditated murder. That would not be reasonable, nor would it have a positive legal outcome for the abused.


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01 Nov 2018, 1:53 pm

worrying thread.


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01 Nov 2018, 2:03 pm

VegetableMan wrote:
Arganger wrote:
It is self defense as far as I am concerned. If you can handle it without killing the abuser that is best, but most people going though that do not know any other ways to handle it or are far to scared. If someone is killing someone causing them constant physical harm, and causing them to live in fear, possibly with unhelpful authorities, it is reasonable.
In self defense at the moment of attack, I would agree. But I hope you're not advocating pre-meditated murder. That would not be reasonable, nor would it have a positive legal outcome for the abused.
Agreed.

[opinion=mine]

It's self-defense to strike down your attacker during an actual attack - you would likely receive any conviction from Second-Degree Murder to Manslaughter. You might even be acquitted.

But if you attack and kill someone who has attacked you in the past, or who threatened to attack you in the future, and who is not currently attacking you in the present, then you are likely to be convicted of First-Degree Murder, likely with Special Circumstances, and likely resulting in Capital Punishment.

[/opinion]

And by "you", I mean the collective "you" -- nothing personal.



pawelk1986
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01 Nov 2018, 4:49 pm

lostonearth35 wrote:
I agree also that murder is murder, no matter what they did to you or someone else.

Naturally, that rule goes right out the window in times of war. :roll:


That so true about war :D



pawelk1986
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01 Nov 2018, 4:58 pm

Fnord wrote:
pawelk1986 wrote:
Fnord wrote:
Murder is murder, whether the victim "needed killing" or not.
Perhaps, but if someone is abusive toward they loved ones or kids?
It's still murder.

Who are you planning to kill?


do not plan to kill anyone, I've grown out of it :mrgreen:

But my buddy said that he planned to kill his dad an alcoholic who beat him, but when he grew up, he started to beat him, then somehow they get along when his dad stopped drinking vodka :mrgreen:

A few years ago, his father died for natural reasons, my friend said that he even missed the freak, as he called his late dad



pawelk1986
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01 Nov 2018, 5:03 pm

Fnord wrote:
VegetableMan wrote:
Arganger wrote:
It is self defense as far as I am concerned. If you can handle it without killing the abuser that is best, but most people going though that do not know any other ways to handle it or are far to scared. If someone is killing someone causing them constant physical harm, and causing them to live in fear, possibly with unhelpful authorities, it is reasonable.
In self defense at the moment of attack, I would agree. But I hope you're not advocating pre-meditated murder. That would not be reasonable, nor would it have a positive legal outcome for the abused.
Agreed.

[opinion=mine]

It's self-defense to strike down your attacker during an actual attack - you would likely receive any conviction from Second-Degree Murder to Manslaughter. You might even be acquitted.

But if you attack and kill someone who has attacked you in the past, or who threatened to attack you in the future, and who is not currently attacking you in the present, then you are likely to be convicted of First-Degree Murder, likely with Special Circumstances, and likely resulting in Capital Punishment.

[/opinion]

And by "you", I mean the collective "you" -- nothing personal.



Unfortunately, not in Poland, because we do not have the death penalty!

I personally do not plan to kill anyone: D

It pissed me off, only that they want to put this boy in prison, in my opinion those who hurt children physically or sexually should be hanged!



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03 Nov 2018, 6:26 pm

I don't think a person should be prosecuted for killing an abuser. If you feared for you life and you had no way of leaving, kill them. But the problem of passing such law would make people play the abuse victim card more to try and get away with murder. There have been women out there that have gotten away with killing their abuser but that is all based on luck IMO. All it takes is having a judge that understands domestic abuse and battered woman syndrome. They decide the woman had suffered enough, she isn't a threat to society, she is unlikely to kill again, she had children in the the home and they were being abused too. Then there has been a woman that went to prison for failing to protect her kids from abuse and she was an abused person herself from the father. The judge said she would let her off the hook if she had put a gun to his head. You just can't win. Kill your abuser, you go to prison, don't kill your abuser, you still go to prison if there were kids involved. Yes you can go to prison still for killing your abuser even if you had kids. It's a gamble.


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pawelk1986
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04 Nov 2018, 11:05 am

League_Girl wrote:
I don't think a person should be prosecuted for killing an abuser. If you feared for you life and you had no way of leaving, kill them. But the problem of passing such law would make people play the abuse victim card more to try and get away with murder. There have been women out there that have gotten away with killing their abuser but that is all based on luck IMO. All it takes is having a judge that understands domestic abuse and battered woman syndrome. They decide the woman had suffered enough, she isn't a threat to society, she is unlikely to kill again, she had children in the the home and they were being abused too. Then there has been a woman that went to prison for failing to protect her kids from abuse and she was an abused person herself from the father. The judge said she would let her off the hook if she had put a gun to his head. You just can't win. Kill your abuser, you go to prison, don't kill your abuser, you still go to prison if there were kids involved. Yes you can go to prison still for killing your abuser even if you had kids. It's a gamble.



But what if this child killed an aggressive parent

or the perpetrator of domestic violence is not a man but a woman because such situations also unfortunately happen.