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thinkinginpictures
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28 Mar 2019, 9:38 am

Cultural Relativists claim that all ideologies and opinions are equally good/bad.

They totally ignore the fact that some ideologies have un-scientific claims which has been not only not proven by science, but directly disproven/debunked by science.

For cultural relativists, Flat Earth Society is equally right in their opinion about the flat earth, as round-earthers.

For cultural relativists, shariah law - the amputation of limbs and stoning to death for atheists is as good as Swedish law of justice.

How can anyone ever take Cultural Relativists seriously?



kraftiekortie
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28 Mar 2019, 9:42 am

There is something to be said for being flexible as far as cultural traditions/ethics/characteristics are concerned----a sort of "modified cultural relativism" is what I advocate--but not absolute "cultural relativism."

Absolute "cultural relativism" is absurd, in my view.

There are certain things which are morally repugnant---and should be for all cultures.

There are other things, though, that some cultures might find absurd---but that other cultures might find to be all right. And that "thing" might not be, from an objective standpoint, "morally repugnant."



Fnord
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28 Mar 2019, 10:57 am

A slightly different take on the definition...

Cultural relativism is the idea that a person's beliefs, values, and practices should be understood based on that person's own culture, rather than be judged against the criteria of another.

This would imply that a culture of genocidal mass-murderers should not be judged by anyone from a different culture, especially the victims' culture. How can a culture that lost 6 million of its citizens to industrialized executions ever hope to be justified in judging their attackers as guilty of any crime?


... but a similar conclusion: Cultural Relativism is stupid.



kdm1984
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28 Mar 2019, 1:28 pm

kraftiekortie wrote:
There is something to be said for being flexible as far as cultural traditions/ethics/characteristics are concerned----a sort of "modified cultural relativism" is what I advocate--but not absolute "cultural relativism."

Absolute "cultural relativism" is absurd, in my view.

There are certain things which are morally repugnant---and should be for all cultures.

There are other things, though, that some cultures might find absurd---but that other cultures might find to be all right. And that "thing" might not be, from an objective standpoint, "morally repugnant."


Totally agree. You often offer sensible input to this community. :)


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Pepe
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28 Mar 2019, 5:09 pm

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Cultural relativism is the idea that a person's beliefs, values, and practices should be understood based on that person's own culture, rather than be judged against the criteria of another.

It was established as axiomatic in anthropological research by Franz Boas in the first few decades of the 20th century and later popularized by his students. Boas first articulated the idea in 1887: "civilization is not something absolute, but ... is relative, and ... our ideas and conceptions are true only so far as our civilization goes".[1] However, Boas did not coin the term.

The first use of the term recorded in the Oxford English Dictionary was by philosopher and social theorist Alain Locke in 1924 to describe Robert Lowie's "extreme cultural relativism", found in the latter's 1917 book Culture and Ethnology.[2] The term became common among anthropologists after Boas' death in 1942, to express their synthesis of a number of ideas Boas had developed. Boas believed that the sweep of cultures, to be found in connection with any sub species, is so vast and pervasive that there cannot be a relationship between culture and race.[3] Cultural relativism involves specific epistemological and methodological claims. Whether or not these claims necessitate a specific ethical stance is a matter of debate. This principle should not be confused with moral relativism. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cultural_relativism



Pepe
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28 Mar 2019, 5:22 pm

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Some people worry that the concept of culture can also be abused and misinterpreted. If one culture behaves one way, does that mean all cultures can behave that way as well? For example, many countries and international organizations oppose the act of whaling (the fishing of whales) for environmental reasons. These environmental organizations say that there are not many whales left and such fishing practices should be stopped. However, other countries argue that whaling is a cultural practice that has been around for thousands of years. Because it may be part of a country’s oceanic culture, this country may say that such a cultural practice should not be opposed based on cultural differences, say, by an inland country that does not understand. Who gets to define what a moral cultural behavior is? Is whaling immoral? Two different cultures may have very different answers, as we saw in the above example. Another more extreme instance would be female genital cutting in some parts of the world. Locally, it is argued that the practice has cultural roots, but such a practice has raised concerns among many international human rights organizations. https://www.khanacademy.org/test-prep/m ... sm-article



Pepe
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28 Mar 2019, 5:28 pm

kraftiekortie wrote:
There is something to be said for being flexible as far as cultural traditions/ethics/characteristics are concerned----a sort of "modified cultural relativism" is what I advocate--but not absolute "cultural relativism."

Absolute "cultural relativism" is absurd, in my view.

There are certain things which are morally repugnant---and should be for all cultures.

There are other things, though, that some cultures might find absurd---but that other cultures might find to be all right. And that "thing" might not be, from an objective standpoint, "morally repugnant."


Some people have a problem with the concept of appeasing the gods through human sacrifice...
What's with that? 8O
Go figure... :roll:



Pepe
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28 Mar 2019, 5:43 pm

Fnord wrote:
A slightly different take on the definition...

Cultural relativism is the idea that a person's beliefs, values, and practices should be understood based on that person's own culture, rather than be judged against the criteria of another.

This would imply that a culture of genocidal mass-murderers should not be judged by anyone from a different culture, especially the victims' culture. How can a culture that lost 6 million of its citizens to industrialized executions ever hope to be justified in judging their attackers as guilty of any crime?


... but a similar conclusion: Cultural Relativism is stupid.


No offence, but you are a really stupid person...
Then again, take offence... :mrgreen:

To suggest that Germany had a *culture* of mass-murder is, well, once again stupid... :roll:
I think you are mixing contexts...
Well, actually I know you are mixing context, you seriously offensive little man...
There are laws against hate speech and I think this qualifies... :mrgreen:

Quote:
hate speech
noun
abusive or threatening speech or writing that expresses prejudice against a particular group, especially on the basis of race, religion, or sexual orientation.
"we don't tolerate any form of hate speech" https://www.google.com/search?q=hate+sp ... e&ie=UTF-8


I am tempted to report your post but:
1. It is not my style...
2. I don't think you considered the implications of what you said... :wink:

You are forgiven...
Just... :mrgreen:



kraftiekortie
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28 Mar 2019, 5:48 pm

I talked about a "modified" cultural relativism.

I believe human sacrifice is barbaric----and should not be a part of any world culture.

And I believe the vast majority of cultures feel the same way.



Pepe
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28 Mar 2019, 5:52 pm

kraftiekortie wrote:
I talked about a "modified" cultural relativism.

I believe human sacrifice is barbaric----and should not be a part of any world culture.

And I believe the vast majority of cultures feel the same way.


Settle, my friend...
I was being ironic...
I was supporting your argument...
People aren't used to people being supportive... :wink:



kraftiekortie
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28 Mar 2019, 6:05 pm

I always like the support.....



Pepe
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28 Mar 2019, 6:23 pm

kraftiekortie wrote:
I always like the support.....


:albino:



Antrax
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28 Mar 2019, 8:27 pm

Pepe wrote:
There are laws against hate speech and I think this qualifies... :mrgreen:


Not in the USA. Actually our most important law protects hate speech as free speech.

This is in my opinion as it should be. While hate speech is hurtful and repugnant, there are varying definitions of what qualifies as "hate speech." Protecting all speech has the benefit of not becoming a sliding scale in which minority opinions are slowly quashed by the majority as "hate speech."

The only speech that is not protected in the US is knowingly harmful, and demonstrably false. It is a pretty high bar in prosecution to reach both, or at least it used to be.


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Prometheus18
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28 Mar 2019, 8:33 pm

I think Kraftie and kdm are about right here, as usual.



Kraichgauer
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28 Mar 2019, 9:09 pm

No, not all cultures and ideas are equal. Fundamentalist culture, for instance, among Muslims in the Middle East, and among Christians in America are not equal or preferable to their more moderate coreligionists.


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techstepgenr8tion
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28 Mar 2019, 9:20 pm

People have a right to believe what they wish but their right to do what they wish stops where it harms or impinges on the liberty of others. Also, as far as authority goes, that has to be earned - therefore someone can have the right to believe something but they don't equally have the right to be taken seriously if it's something with no evidence.


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