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KT67
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26 Dec 2020, 4:20 am

My dad thinks it's disrespectful to Jesus to call it Xmas.

Last year I disagreed. After all, Christ isn't here just for English speakers. And X is short for Xristos. So it does include Christ.

This year I kind of agree though. Just because it's in Greek doesn't make it disrespectful to be going around saying 'hey, happy JC day!' instead of 'Merry Christmas'. Makes Jesus sound like a 'best bud' with a nickname.


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naturalplastic
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26 Dec 2020, 6:33 am

What IS an "X", but a type of cross?

So you're retaining the religious symbol in the abbreviation. So what's the problem?



Last edited by naturalplastic on 26 Dec 2020, 8:14 am, edited 1 time in total.

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26 Dec 2020, 7:32 am

I recall someone here on WP referring to Christians as Xtians once. Offense was apparently intended.

On the other hand, a brewery in Denmark makes an "X-Mas" beer every year. To my knowledge, no excommunications, inquisitions or crusades have been initiated to avenge such a blasphemous display of heretical sacrilege.



KT67
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26 Dec 2020, 8:32 am

naturalplastic wrote:
What IS an "X", but a type of cross?

So you're retaining the religious symbol in the abbreviation. So what's the problem?


Xristos = Christos. Christos = Christ.

So X = C or JC.

If it wasn't partly in Greek, if we were going round saying 'hey it's JC Day Today' it would sound a bit flippant.


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26 Dec 2020, 9:35 am

X standing for Xristos in this case is interesting. Have never seen that pointed out before. Xmas in that case would be short for Xristosmas. And when I searched "Χριστούγεννα" (Xristosmas in Greek) it came up as Christmas. The use of "X" (chi) for Christ goes back quite a ways. As seen the the Chi Rho symbol.



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26 Dec 2020, 7:51 pm

KT67 wrote:
My dad thinks it's disrespectful to Jesus to call it Xmas.

Last year I disagreed. After all, Christ isn't here just for English speakers. And X is short for Xristos. So it does include Christ.

This year I kind of agree though. Just because it's in Greek doesn't make it disrespectful to be going around saying 'hey, happy JC day!' instead of 'Merry Christmas'. Makes Jesus sound like a 'best bud' with a nickname.


I find this a nonsense:
Quote:
There is a common misconception that the word Xmas stems from a secular attempt to remove the religious tradition from Christmas[3] by taking the "Christ" out of "Christmas", but its use dates back to the 16th century.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Xmas

The word "gay", as an example, has been transformed into something indicating sexual preference orientation*.
As an atheist, the "X" refers to a "wild card" symbol and is definitely a secular expression, for me.
It is also more inclusive.
I guess I am a bit of a political progressive here. 8)


*Apparently, the term "sexual preference" is politically incorrect, these days. Get a life.
Semantic pedantry. :roll:



KT67
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26 Dec 2020, 7:53 pm

Yeah but when atheists say 'Merry Christmas' that is meant in a secular way too.

I find the idea of 'Happy Holidays' either made up or maybe American? I have never heard it irl.

People say 'Season's Greetings' quite naturally and it's just as inclusive as 'Happy Holidays'.


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KT67
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26 Dec 2020, 8:03 pm

Pepe wrote:
KT67 wrote:
My dad thinks it's disrespectful to Jesus to call it Xmas.

Last year I disagreed. After all, Christ isn't here just for English speakers. And X is short for Xristos. So it does include Christ.

This year I kind of agree though. Just because it's in Greek doesn't make it disrespectful to be going around saying 'hey, happy JC day!' instead of 'Merry Christmas'. Makes Jesus sound like a 'best bud' with a nickname.


I find this a nonsense:
Quote:
There is a common misconception that the word Xmas stems from a secular attempt to remove the religious tradition from Christmas[3] by taking the "Christ" out of "Christmas", but its use dates back to the 16th century.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Xmas

The word "gay", as an example, has been transformed into something indicating sexual preference orientation*.
As an atheist, the "X" refers to a "wild card" symbol and is definitely a secular expression, for me.
It is also more inclusive.
I guess I am a bit of a political progressive here. 8)


*Apparently, the term "sexual preference" is politically incorrect, these days. Get a life.
Semantic pedantry. :roll:


I call mine sexual preference but that's what it is. Sexual orientation is bi but I'm not into any guys irl so... sexual preference is for women.

Kind of like how nobody has a sexual orientation for blondes. They could hit it off in theory for a brunette even if they have a type/preference.

Straight/gay people genuinely can't get attracted to a certain gender. It's different.


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Pepe
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26 Dec 2020, 8:07 pm

KT67 wrote:
Yeah but when atheists say 'Merry Christmas' that is meant in a secular way too.

I find the idea of 'Happy Holidays' either made up or maybe American? I have never heard it irl.

People say 'Season's Greetings' quite naturally and it's just as inclusive as 'Happy Holidays'.


I say "Season's Greetings" also, but it feels a little forced.
I say "Merry Christmas" also, but I sometimes say "Xmas" to make a point. 8)



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26 Dec 2020, 8:19 pm

KT67 wrote:
Pepe wrote:
KT67 wrote:
My dad thinks it's disrespectful to Jesus to call it Xmas.

Last year I disagreed. After all, Christ isn't here just for English speakers. And X is short for Xristos. So it does include Christ.

This year I kind of agree though. Just because it's in Greek doesn't make it disrespectful to be going around saying 'hey, happy JC day!' instead of 'Merry Christmas'. Makes Jesus sound like a 'best bud' with a nickname.


I find this a nonsense:
Quote:
There is a common misconception that the word Xmas stems from a secular attempt to remove the religious tradition from Christmas[3] by taking the "Christ" out of "Christmas", but its use dates back to the 16th century.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Xmas

The word "gay", as an example, has been transformed into something indicating sexual preference orientation*.
As an atheist, the "X" refers to a "wild card" symbol and is definitely a secular expression, for me.
It is also more inclusive.
I guess I am a bit of a political progressive here. 8)


*Apparently, the term "sexual preference" is politically incorrect, these days. Get a life.
Semantic pedantry. :roll:


I call mine sexual preference but that's what it is. Sexual orientation is bi but I'm not into any guys irl so... sexual preference is for women.

Kind of like how nobody has a sexual orientation for blondes. They could hit it off in theory for a brunette even if they have a type/preference.

Straight/gay people genuinely can't get attracted to a certain gender. It's different.


"One man's meat is another man's poison."
I have a preference for "meat".

I am straight.
I have a preference for women.
If I end up in jail, my preference may change, if there is no other option, but I doubt it. :mrgreen:

I can go on like this for months. 8)

Yes, I get the "choice" aspect.
I resent the political correctness.

Some people have nothing better to do that force other people to behave they way they want people to behave.
I hate power plays.
I hate political correctness which is intended to service someone else's need to put their heel on someone else's throat.

What happened to tolerance?
What happened to assessing someone's intent/attitude? 8)



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26 Dec 2020, 10:02 pm

I like calling it Christmas instead of Xmas. Besides, the X reminds me of the Swastika and I just don't like it.


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26 Dec 2020, 10:14 pm

KT67 wrote:
I find the idea of 'Happy Holidays' either made up or maybe American? I have never heard it irl.

Hmm, looking at Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy over on the bookshelf, I wonder if anyone in that universe ever wishes people "Hoopy Holidays".

And you know me, I like to go find references.
Here is one from a secular gramma blog and one from a Christian, I think conservative, ministry.

Let's see if the Greek letters will reproduce here after being obtained via Google translate, Χριστός

https://www.grammarly.com/blog/why-do-w ... s-as-xmas/
Quote:
In the Greek alphabet, X is the symbol for the letter ‘chi.’ Chi (or X) is the first letter in the Greek word for Christ. In the early days of the Christian church, Christians used the letter X as a secret symbol to indicate their membership in the church to others.

If you know the Greek meaning of X, Xmas and Christmas essentially mean the same thing: Christ + mas = Christmas.


https://www.ligonier.org/blog/why-is-x- ... christmas/
Quote:
First of all, you have to understand that it is not the letter X that is put into Christmas. We see the English letter X there, but actually what it involves is the first letter of the Greek name for Christ. Christos is the New Testament Greek for Christ. The first letter of the Greek word Christos is transliterated into our alphabet as an X. That X has come through church history to be a shorthand symbol for the name of Christ.

We don’t see people protesting the use of the Greek letter theta, which is an O with a line across the middle. We use that as a shorthand abbreviation for God because it is the first letter of the word Theos, the Greek word for God.


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26 Dec 2020, 10:21 pm

And let's add a reference to the Greek alphabet via someone at MIT,
https://web.mit.edu/jmorzins/www/greek-alphabet.html

Quote:
This table gives the Greek letters, their names, equivalent English letters, and tips for pronouncing those letters which are pronounced differently from the equivalent English letters.


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27 Dec 2020, 4:59 am

Maybe your dad watches too much porn.



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27 Dec 2020, 7:13 am

You can't measure respect

Anyone could correctly claim that anything is disrespectful, just because they don't like it, thus elevating their emotions and opinion, to a fact

:evil: slippery slope :roll:



KT67
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27 Dec 2020, 10:07 am

The_Face_of_Boo wrote:
Maybe your dad watches too much porn.


Nah he doesn't know porn exists (or it's sinful to him...) so he gets really over excited when ladies' volleyball comes on TV once every 4 years & texts me to ask if I'm watching it & it's his 'favourite sport' :roll:

He's converted into close to a fundie. He won't say swear words or watch horror movies & moans at people who swear online and says 'I don't know how you could' like I'm messed up just for liking horror movies.

All the films he watches are old or Disney.


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