Does the USA need international oversight over elections?

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goldfish21
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22 Jun 2020, 3:56 pm

With vote suppression cranked up to full force in red states, does the USA need some sort of international oversight over its elections to ensure citizens are allowed to vote?

Seems that way to me. Reports are that white folk in republican areas can walk in and vote while black and/or Democrat areas have broken voting machines or so few polling stations that I think it’s one county in Kentucky had ONE voting location for over 600,000 registered voters in some primary election that just happened.

If this is any indication of the level of vote suppression cheating to expect in November, you’d think any Americans from either side of the aisle that care about democracy At All would be all for inviting some neutral agency to oversee the upcoming federal election. United Nations, elections officials from the EU, hell, Doctors Without Borders LoL - literally anyone from outside tasked with ensuring all Americans are able to safely vote.. because it doesn’t seem like the USA has its s**t together well enough to deliver a clean election.


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22 Jun 2020, 4:15 pm

goldfish21 wrote:
With vote suppression cranked up to full force in red states, does the USA need some sort of international oversight over its elections to ensure citizens are allowed to vote?

Seems that way to me. Reports are that white folk in republican areas can walk in and vote while black and/or Democrat areas have broken voting machines or so few polling stations that I think it’s one county in Kentucky had ONE voting location for over 600,000 registered voters in some primary election that just happened.

If this is any indication of the level of vote suppression cheating to expect in November, you’d think any Americans from either side of the aisle that care about democracy At All would be all for inviting some neutral agency to oversee the upcoming federal election. United Nations, elections officials from the EU, hell, Doctors Without Borders LoL - literally anyone from outside tasked with ensuring all Americans are able to safely vote.. because it doesn’t seem like the USA has its s**t together well enough to deliver a clean election.
Hmm... interesting question.  I'm sure that the governments of North Korea, the People's Republic of China, and Russia would all be interested in "overseeing" our elections.


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22 Jun 2020, 6:01 pm

Fnord wrote:
goldfish21 wrote:
With vote suppression cranked up to full force in red states, does the USA need some sort of international oversight over its elections to ensure citizens are allowed to vote?

Seems that way to me. Reports are that white folk in republican areas can walk in and vote while black and/or Democrat areas have broken voting machines or so few polling stations that I think it’s one county in Kentucky had ONE voting location for over 600,000 registered voters in some primary election that just happened.

If this is any indication of the level of vote suppression cheating to expect in November, you’d think any Americans from either side of the aisle that care about democracy At All would be all for inviting some neutral agency to oversee the upcoming federal election. United Nations, elections officials from the EU, hell, Doctors Without Borders LoL - literally anyone from outside tasked with ensuring all Americans are able to safely vote.. because it doesn’t seem like the USA has its s**t together well enough to deliver a clean election.
Hmm... interesting question.  I'm sure that the governments of North Korea, the People's Republic of China, and Russia would all be interested in "overseeing" our elections.


As would the liberal democracy club America is a part of.


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naturalplastic
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22 Jun 2020, 7:50 pm

Good question.

We need some UN agency to step in and police our coming election against both Russian, and domestic meddling.



Brictoria
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22 Jun 2020, 8:08 pm

I'd suggest a better option would be to implement something like we have in Australia:

We have an impartial "electoral commission" at the federal level which is responsible for tracking all eligible voters (and their address) across the country, managing electoral boundaries, running the election (staffing polling places, confirming identity of voters who attend the location, and counting the votes (under supervision of representatives of each party), with counting taking places at voting centres following close of polls).

Of course, we also use paper ballots (so for our senate, you can (optionally) end up having to number over 100 people in order of preference) rather than electronic machines (It's much harder for a piece of paper to malfunction than for a machine to).

This removes a large degree of partisan whining (from all sides), and can help to ensure electoral rolls are free from duplicate or non-existant voters (I seem to recall hearing about a recent issue where there were more registered voters in California (Democrat held) than there were eligible citizens, along with an "automated" system which has added duplicate entries (potentially allowing the same person to vote multiple times)).


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The_Walrus
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23 Jun 2020, 6:26 am

Brictoria wrote:
I'd suggest a better option would be to implement something like we have in Australia:

We have an impartial "electoral commission" at the federal level which is responsible for tracking all eligible voters (and their address) across the country, managing electoral boundaries, running the election (staffing polling places, confirming identity of voters who attend the location, and counting the votes (under supervision of representatives of each party), with counting taking places at voting centres following close of polls).

Of course, we also use paper ballots (so for our senate, you can (optionally) end up having to number over 100 people in order of preference) rather than electronic machines (It's much harder for a piece of paper to malfunction than for a machine to).

This removes a large degree of partisan whining (from all sides), and can help to ensure electoral rolls are free from duplicate or non-existant voters (I seem to recall hearing about a recent issue where there were more registered voters in California (Democrat held) than there were eligible citizens, along with an "automated" system which has added duplicate entries (potentially allowing the same person to vote multiple times)).

I think this is very sensible and could solve all sorts of issues with the US electoral system, from the huge amount of money in politics to partisan gerrymandering.

I think there’s still a place for international oversight and think it would be a good idea for all countries. Obviously the oversight should come from politically independent organisation.



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23 Jun 2020, 8:30 am

There is no precident for other countries overseeing another countries elections.Even when America has formed democracies through war or world policing(example Bushes liberation of Iraq in 03)once they actually vote America has never gotten involved.

It would add un due influence of a foreign nations which would unduly interfere with American interest.It's never happened with any other nation.America and western European nations did much to end eastern block communism,but once those countries were free,they were respected to handle there own elections themselves.


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24 Jun 2020, 1:23 am

naturalplastic wrote:
Good question.

We need some UN agency to step in and police our coming election against both Russian, and domestic meddling.

You mean the un, China and Russia have veto status and high control over?
And who puts Iran as chair of human rights violations Committee . I’m sure North Korea well rule over the elections.


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sly279
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24 Jun 2020, 1:43 am

Brictoria wrote:
I'd suggest a better option would be to implement something like we have in Australia:

We have an impartial "electoral commission" at the federal level which is responsible for tracking all eligible voters (and their address) across the country, managing electoral boundaries, running the election (staffing polling places, confirming identity of voters who attend the location, and counting the votes (under supervision of representatives of each party), with counting taking places at voting centres following close of polls).

Of course, we also use paper ballots (so for our senate, you can (optionally) end up having to number over 100 people in order of preference) rather than electronic machines (It's much harder for a piece of paper to malfunction than for a machine to).

This removes a large degree of partisan whining (from all sides), and can help to ensure electoral rolls are free from duplicate or non-existant voters (I seem to recall hearing about a recent issue where there were more registered voters in California (Democrat held) than there were eligible citizens, along with an "automated" system which has added duplicate entries (potentially allowing the same person to vote multiple times)).


Impartial is a pipe dream. Look at our Supreme Court. It’s suppose to be impartial but we have 4 liberal democrats and 4 conservative Republicans who vote party line.
Any such federal commission would be appointed by which ever side was in power at the time. All our federal Agencies are also bias to one party or another when they suppose to be impartial. Same with All our court judges. If I defended myself in my city I’d be let go free, if I did it in Portland I’d be thrown in prison, why? Portland has anti gun democrat appointed judges and my area has centrist or conservative judges. The da are all party politicians too. Justice isn’t blind anymore it’s political. Personally I’d have any judge who identifies with any party disqualified. But that is the problem isn’t it? Who is impartial? No one. Lest not in the USA. Yiud be hard pressed to find a impartial unbiased person.
So would democrats accept a election commission appointed by either trump or the Republican controlled senate? Doubt it, likewise republicans wouldn’t accept one appointed by Obama or senate controlled by democrats.
Our congress is a rich person country club, it needs term limits, but that’ll never happen
I dont know if there’s even any way we the people could get term limits added.

Garymanding happens on both sides by the way. It’s done heavily in west coast and east coast states. I have no doubt republicans do it too, but seems since both sides do it and both complain about it id say whatever. Again nothing we can do. Well my state could vote to end it. Unlike many states we the people can pass our own laws and bypass our state congress. Washington can too. I dont know if California has ballout measures, but no ones tried to stop it, or put in term limits. It would seem neither side is too upset by the corruption:/

The USA use to do paper but then we had the chad incidental and recount due to it in Florida, since then most states moved to electronic. Or mail in. Paper still has corruption issues. Extra ballots found, millions of ballots lost until after the election, then sudden found oh darn, maybe next year. In my state a lot of republicans get their ballots refused saying their signature doesn’t match up. My ballot didn’t arrive for the primary until after it was too late to vote, hopefully it doesn’t happen in November, but thst any non democrat vote matters in blue states nor democrat votes in red states. I do wish to vote in local elections though. Also our Governor elections have been close last two times. Funny think is most our judge positions or committee positions run unopposed or no one even runs in so all it takes is one person writing themselves in to win.
I thought about it but like what if I one. I don’t want to be the 4th district park council memeber lol. Or in charge if water system lol. Apparently no one wants to do it. Which makes me wonder who does it now. 8O it must be an unpaid position right? Mean otherwise run, get paid, do nothing, and run unopposed. Whate if the people running unopposed are doing this 8O
Well mean society seems to keep going though. Though my state is both bankrupt but also at same time collecting millions more then they need. :roll: care to explain me that.
They collected so much more they are legally suppose to give it back. But same time claimed we ran a deficit, but clearly we didn’t. Rest assured they raise taxes again.and collect even more money then needed and so the loop continues.

To me the USA is , do you want to live under democrat corruption or republican corruption.


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sly279
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24 Jun 2020, 1:45 am

vermontsavant wrote:
There is no precident for other countries overseeing another countries elections.Even when America has formed democracies through war or world policing(example Bushes liberation of Iraq in 03)once they actually vote America has never gotten involved.

It would add un due influence of a foreign nations which would unduly interfere with American interest.It's never happened with any other nation.America and western European nations did much to end eastern block communism,but once those countries were free,they were respected to handle there own elections themselves.

Nato and un oversaw Iraq’s election, look how well that worked out.


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24 Jun 2020, 9:16 am

goldfish21 wrote:
Seems that way to me. Reports are that white folk in republican areas can walk in and vote while black and/or Democrat areas have broken voting machines or so few polling stations that I think it’s one county in Kentucky had ONE voting location for over 600,000 registered voters in some primary election that just happened.

If this is any indication of the level of vote suppression cheating to expect in November, you’d think any Americans from either side of the aisle that care about democracy At All would be all for inviting some neutral agency to oversee the upcoming federal election. United Nations, elections officials from the EU, hell, Doctors Without Borders LoL - literally anyone from outside tasked with ensuring all Americans are able to safely vote.. because it doesn’t seem like the USA has its s**t together well enough to deliver a clean election.


Hmm well if this is true then it would be good if some independent party, not necessarily non-American, was assingned to make sure that everyone has an equal chance to vote.



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24 Jun 2020, 10:55 am

vermontsavant wrote:
There is no precident for other countries overseeing another countries elections.Even when America has formed democracies through war or world policing(example Bushes liberation of Iraq in 03)once they actually vote America has never gotten involved.

It would add un due influence of a foreign nations which would unduly interfere with American interest.It's never happened with any other nation.America and western European nations did much to end eastern block communism,but once those countries were free,they were respected to handle there own elections themselves.

Election monitoring is very commonplace.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Election_monitoring



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25 Jun 2020, 6:56 pm

The way the climate is now I can see one side doing voter suppression and the other side doing voter fraud but no I don't want another country overseeing out election.


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goldfish21
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26 Jun 2020, 2:32 am

Brehus wrote:
The way the climate is now I can see one side doing voter suppression and the other side doing voter fraud but no I don't want another country overseeing out election.


Way better to just let other countries interfere (Russia, then trump asked Ukraine and China and who knows who else to interfere.) than to select one to help ensure a fair election, I guess.


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