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AngelRho
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16 Dec 2021, 6:08 am

cyberdad wrote:
NoMoreRegrets94 wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
NoMoreRegrets94 wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
NoMoreRegrets94 wrote:
CRT is commuism so DeSantis did the right thing


I wish I could move to Florida, at least I wouldn't need to deal with Ice all the time.

Ps. 60th parallel inhabitant.


Uh... no. Communism is an economic system, which CRT is not. As I recall, civil rights, labor rights, women's rights, LGBTQ rights, interracial marriage, and many other progressive movements were labeled communistic by the right simply because they didn't approve of them.

CRT is commuism and movements to encourage gayness and interracial sex are also often communist too.


I seriously think you need to get back on your meds.

What meds, we are on autism forum you know. I have autism and zero mental illnesses.


You know the difference between communism and freedom to choose?

CRT is a variant of collectivism, as is communism, slavery, etc. It’s all Hegel and Marx. To summarize: All the things we want are controlled by the hegemony, of which we are victims. CRT essentially holds that communism failed because of that hegemony. The central idea is that a minority is owed something due to intersectional oppression. If a white man says it of a woman, it’s sexist. If a black man says something sexist, it’s still sexist, but we must empathize with him on account of being part of an oppressed group. If he’s a GAY black man, it’s funny. If (s)he is a non-binary, transgendered lesbian, then it’s the gospel truth—sort of. CRT adds intersectional layers of oppression to classic Marxism and establishes a slough of new victim classes Marx never would have dreamed of. The main thrust of any collectivist system is to concentrate power into the hands of these minority victim classes. Whether you call it Marxism, socialist, communist, or whatever, it’s all based on collectivist tenets.



cyberdad
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16 Dec 2021, 6:46 am

AngelRho wrote:
The main thrust of any collectivist system is to concentrate power into the hands of these minority victim classes. Whether you call it Marxism, socialist, communist, or whatever, it’s all based on collectivist tenets.


Honestly do you believe that? Collectivist cultures emphasize the needs and goals of the group as a whole over the needs and desires of each individual. In such cultures, relationships with other members of the group and the interconnectedness between people play a central role in each person's identity.

One of the ironies of conservatives is they claim minorities don't want to assimilate. But then they also complain they don't want to be pressured to accommodate them either :roll:



neilinmich
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16 Dec 2021, 11:24 am

AngelRho wrote:
CRT is a variant of collectivism, as is communism, slavery, etc. It’s all Hegel and Marx.


My response is not a fact, only an opinion. I think your brain has been hacked. Your words sounds crazy to me. Are you a Q-Anon follower?
Someone has been lying to you big time. You shouldn't believe them. You're not even getting definitions right, much less reasoning and logic. You should expect a lot of pushback from other people too.

I won't try to argue with you about it because I've learned that never ends well with brain hacked people. Plus I'm not good at making arguments.



Kraichgauer
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16 Dec 2021, 1:59 pm

AngelRho wrote:
cyberdad wrote:
NoMoreRegrets94 wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
NoMoreRegrets94 wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
NoMoreRegrets94 wrote:
CRT is commuism so DeSantis did the right thing


I wish I could move to Florida, at least I wouldn't need to deal with Ice all the time.

Ps. 60th parallel inhabitant.


Uh... no. Communism is an economic system, which CRT is not. As I recall, civil rights, labor rights, women's rights, LGBTQ rights, interracial marriage, and many other progressive movements were labeled communistic by the right simply because they didn't approve of them.

CRT is commuism and movements to encourage gayness and interracial sex are also often communist too.


I seriously think you need to get back on your meds.

What meds, we are on autism forum you know. I have autism and zero mental illnesses.


You know the difference between communism and freedom to choose?

CRT is a variant of collectivism, as is communism, slavery, etc. It’s all Hegel and Marx. To summarize: All the things we want are controlled by the hegemony, of which we are victims. CRT essentially holds that communism failed because of that hegemony. The central idea is that a minority is owed something due to intersectional oppression. If a white man says it of a woman, it’s sexist. If a black man says something sexist, it’s still sexist, but we must empathize with him on account of being part of an oppressed group. If he’s a GAY black man, it’s funny. If (s)he is a non-binary, transgendered lesbian, then it’s the gospel truth—sort of. CRT adds intersectional layers of oppression to classic Marxism and establishes a slough of new victim classes Marx never would have dreamed of. The main thrust of any collectivist system is to concentrate power into the hands of these minority victim classes. Whether you call it Marxism, socialist, communist, or whatever, it’s all based on collectivist tenets.


Again, communism is an economic system but it's been used to slam ideas and movements conservatives think less than kindly of.
But when is collectivism entirely bad? Christianity - legitimate Christianity - has a lot to do with collectivism, in that the faith of the lone believer risks burning out without the collective worship of fellow believers.


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AngelRho
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16 Dec 2021, 4:45 pm

Kraichgauer wrote:
AngelRho wrote:
cyberdad wrote:
NoMoreRegrets94 wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
NoMoreRegrets94 wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
NoMoreRegrets94 wrote:
CRT is commuism so DeSantis did the right thing


I wish I could move to Florida, at least I wouldn't need to deal with Ice all the time.

Ps. 60th parallel inhabitant.


Uh... no. Communism is an economic system, which CRT is not. As I recall, civil rights, labor rights, women's rights, LGBTQ rights, interracial marriage, and many other progressive movements were labeled communistic by the right simply because they didn't approve of them.

CRT is commuism and movements to encourage gayness and interracial sex are also often communist too.


I seriously think you need to get back on your meds.

What meds, we are on autism forum you know. I have autism and zero mental illnesses.


You know the difference between communism and freedom to choose?

CRT is a variant of collectivism, as is communism, slavery, etc. It’s all Hegel and Marx. To summarize: All the things we want are controlled by the hegemony, of which we are victims. CRT essentially holds that communism failed because of that hegemony. The central idea is that a minority is owed something due to intersectional oppression. If a white man says it of a woman, it’s sexist. If a black man says something sexist, it’s still sexist, but we must empathize with him on account of being part of an oppressed group. If he’s a GAY black man, it’s funny. If (s)he is a non-binary, transgendered lesbian, then it’s the gospel truth—sort of. CRT adds intersectional layers of oppression to classic Marxism and establishes a slough of new victim classes Marx never would have dreamed of. The main thrust of any collectivist system is to concentrate power into the hands of these minority victim classes. Whether you call it Marxism, socialist, communist, or whatever, it’s all based on collectivist tenets.


Again, communism is an economic system but it's been used to slam ideas and movements conservatives think less than kindly of.
But when is collectivism entirely bad? Christianity - legitimate Christianity - has a lot to do with collectivism, in that the faith of the lone believer risks burning out without the collective worship of fellow believers.

The economic aspect of communism is not it’s only flaw, and certainly not it’s only component. The promise of communism is equality for all, it’s focus on special victim classes. The reality of communist economics is that once you force everyone to be equal, you make them all equally poor. Those who actually do benefit from communism are those within a ruling class that shouldn’t even exist: Party elites with a penchant for greed. Oh, and FTR, I’m not pretending that Republicans aren’t part of the problem. America is running the same Soviet shell game. Under communism, a nation must remain in a state of perpetual revolution and/or war. Let’s say a majority of Democratic policymakers pass a law. Republicans automatically oppose it and gripe about how it causes so many problems. The instant power shifts in favor of Republicans, they gripe about how said law is now an entitlement they have no interest in reversing. As long as a problem exists, opposing parties have a power base. Once a problem is SOLVED, policymakers are no longer needed. Communism is no different. The distinction is that under a single-party system the government has no need to accept responsibility for its shortcomings, but can rather blame remnants of capitalist elements internally or external forces such as capitalist nations for all their woes. Collectivism depends on creating victims and common enemies. Even monarchies are guilty of this. Starving peasants? Invade your neighbor to settle a territorial dispute. Economy not going your way after a lengthy conflict and the deposition of a monarch? Blame the Jews, invade Poland. Nothing good comes from collectivism.

I don’t know what your definition of “legitimate” Christianity, but I’ve found attempts to define it as legit to be sketch. You are either saved through grace or you are not. The Book of Acts describes what seems to be a collectivist society centered on Christ’s teachings. That society failed spectacularly as Acts demonstrates.



aghogday
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16 Dec 2021, 5:53 pm



Conservative DOES NOT ALWAYS EQUAL REPUBLICAN;

Yet it's Worth Noting As Far As Conservative With RIGHT
WING Highlighted to the EXTREME That the EXTREME FACTiON

With Sheep Following Either Blindly or Timidly Afraid of Losing

Power And Status And Position Are DOING THEIR GODDAMDEST

TO CANCEL

VOTING RIGHTS,

VOTING COUNTS,

AND DEMOCRACY

AS NOW The FACTS BY

THE EVIDENCE CURRENTLY

PRESENTING CLEARLY 'DICTATES'

IN THE "JANUARY 6TH, COMission";

And Why Is it So important to HIGHLIGHT

THIS CANCELING OF DEMOCRACY TRY by one Party

in the United

States;

Our Ways of Life;

Our Right to Life, Liberty
And the PURSUIT OF INDIVIDUAL

Happiness THAT DOES NOT MEAN

WRAPPED AROUND THE FINGER OF CHURCH
HOLDING HANDS WITH STATE IN ONE particular

Iteration of Evangelistic Christianity That Is Surely

More Conservative And Old Testament Than More Liberal

in Progressive Testament Ways Per the 'Dude From Nazareth';

You Know 'the One', Who Has Empathy and Compassion And not

the 'CHANGELING' THAT TURNS INTO SOMETHING MORE EVIL THAN TRuMP

AND BURNS FOLKS (Transforming Sheep to Goats)

FOREVER IN TORTURE

MUCH MORE SEVERE

Than Just Firing Them in
One Life, if they Don't Bow
Down and Kiss the "Trump Pope's Ring"

And Remain on Bended Knee Proclaiming

"Trump Pope" is

Frigging King
of the Whole
Frigging Universe,
Even if 'He' Is Totally
Naked Wearing 'Trump
Pope Clothes' For All to
See in Real Evil Protecting

(Pretending to be the 'Old Testament Jesus')

Harm to Others Clear For All to See NoW; Yet God Yes

Devil And Deep Green to Blue 'See' They'll Never Find

(Paraphrasing 'The Police' And 'Sting' A Bit Here Now too)

me, Hehe; me and Eve Will Be Eating Apples in Our Own Garden

of Eden Loving Free...

Typically i'll
Be "Too Big to

See" and Eve is
Too Shy to be
Noticed too HAha...

In Other Words, Pass the Popcorn
Again Eve, Humans Overall, Are No Longer

Coordinated to Really Get Almost Anything Done
'These Days' Except "Status Quotes" Barely Afloat Still Now.



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Gravatar is one of the coolest things ever!! !

http://en.gravatar.com/katiemiafrederick


cyberdad
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16 Dec 2021, 8:15 pm

AngelRho wrote:
The promise of communism is equality for all, it’s focus on special victim classes. The reality of communist economics is that once you force everyone to be equal, you make them all equally poor.


I think you need to be careful in projecting what the goals of communism were at the turn of the 20th century when much of the manifestos were written and how global landscape looked back then. Poverty and class and the rule of despotic royal monarchs who governed colonial states were a reality back then.

Communism and socialism are a distant memory in 2021, please stop trying to spread right wing conservative propaganda which conflates socially conscious and equitable political movements with communism and socialism. This is a relic from the 1950s which was used to frighten conservative christian families into voting republican. All labor based parties in the English speaking world including your democrats are neo-liberal capitalists in their outlook. Big business profits regardless who is in power.



AngelRho
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16 Dec 2021, 11:49 pm

cyberdad wrote:
AngelRho wrote:
The promise of communism is equality for all, it’s focus on special victim classes. The reality of communist economics is that once you force everyone to be equal, you make them all equally poor.


I think you need to be careful in projecting what the goals of communism were at the turn of the 20th century when much of the manifestos were written and how global landscape looked back then. Poverty and class and the rule of despotic royal monarchs who governed colonial states were a reality back then.

Communism and socialism are a distant memory in 2021, please stop trying to spread right wing conservative propaganda which conflates socially conscious and equitable political movements with communism and socialism. This is a relic from the 1950s which was used to frighten conservative christian families into voting republican. All labor based parties in the English speaking world including your democrats are neo-liberal capitalists in their outlook. Big business profits regardless who is in power.

Well, the problem really is that big business profits either because of who is in power or in spite of who is in power, not because they actually achieve anything. That’s not capitalism. It’s collectivism. Look no further than the too-big-to-fail bailouts of Government Motors. And I don’t care one iota about Republicans. They’re all just part of the problem.

Critical race theory demonizes white people specifically along with other high-achieving folks for no other reason than skin color. It is bankrupt of reason. And it happens to be heavily influenced by Marx. There’s nothing socially conscious or equitable about it. It is the opposite of equitable because it demands relinquishing the hegemony to victim classes who are identified by race rather than merit. True equity is achieved when all persons are allowed the same opportunity to produce things and benefit from their own realization of ideas. Discrimination based on race or skin color is perhaps the highest level of collectivism there is, and CRT actively encourages racism rather than stopping it.



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17 Dec 2021, 12:17 am

equally poor is still better than a few rich lording it over legions of poor. if in an objective sense, my lords were only a bit richer than me [they get to shop at special stores and have their own dacha in the countryside, but not the usual obscene wealth of say, bill gates], i could more easily live with that.



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17 Dec 2021, 12:18 am

It was merchant guilds/cartels who funded the wars and expeditions of empires such as the Dutch and British East India Company and later colonial cartels in the new world who made up the foundation for neo-capitalist post-colonial business empires who select world leaders through political donations/funding and through collaborative financing of the military industrial complex. This aspect of history hasn't changed, only the names and players.

Marx, CRT and civil rights movement are three seperate things. Let's focus on CRT as it's being debated in the US right now. A number of republican states have banned the teaching of CRT in their states but they know very well that CRT is not taught in the highschool curriculum. It;s taught in college.

When GOP politicians agitate parents to storm school board meetings they are protesting something that doesn't exist. Instead republican parents (who know nothing about what their kids are learning) try and get their schools to ban the teaching of actual history which was already present in the curriculum.

The republicans were particularly vociferous in their intent to ban the 1619 Project which was an academic project to outline the reality of life for the first slaves in the US. This is as equally important to the history of black people in America as the founding fathers or the pilgrims landing at Plymouth is for white people.

The attempts to erase projects like this are an attempt to erase black history which is absolutely racist.



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17 Dec 2021, 12:20 am

AngelRho wrote:
cyberdad wrote:
AngelRho wrote:
The promise of communism is equality for all, it’s focus on special victim classes. The reality of communist economics is that once you force everyone to be equal, you make them all equally poor.


I think you need to be careful in projecting what the goals of communism were at the turn of the 20th century when much of the manifestos were written and how global landscape looked back then. Poverty and class and the rule of despotic royal monarchs who governed colonial states were a reality back then.

Communism and socialism are a distant memory in 2021, please stop trying to spread right wing conservative propaganda which conflates socially conscious and equitable political movements with communism and socialism. This is a relic from the 1950s which was used to frighten conservative christian families into voting republican. All labor based parties in the English speaking world including your democrats are neo-liberal capitalists in their outlook. Big business profits regardless who is in power.

Well, the problem really is that big business profits either because of who is in power or in spite of who is in power, not because they actually achieve anything. That’s not capitalism. It’s collectivism. Look no further than the too-big-to-fail bailouts of Government Motors. And I don’t care one iota about Republicans. They’re all just part of the problem.

Critical race theory demonizes white people specifically along with other high-achieving folks for no other reason than skin color. It is bankrupt of reason. And it happens to be heavily influenced by Marx. There’s nothing socially conscious or equitable about it. It is the opposite of equitable because it demands relinquishing the hegemony to victim classes who are identified by race rather than merit. True equity is achieved when all persons are allowed the same opportunity to produce things and benefit from their own realization of ideas. Discrimination based on race or skin color is perhaps the highest level of collectivism there is, and CRT actively encourages racism rather than stopping it.


Funny, I thought it was just a matter of recalling how a dominant group - in this case, whites - had used their position in the past to oppress for economic and social reasons those groups - such as blacks - who were not in power. That's called unvarnished and straight forward history.
If you have a different take on the historic record, I'd like to hear it.


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cyberdad
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17 Dec 2021, 12:43 am

Kraichgauer wrote:
Funny, I thought it was just a matter of recalling how a dominant group - in this case, whites - had used their position in the past to oppress for economic and social reasons those groups - such as blacks - who were not in power. That's called unvarnished and straight forward history.
If you have a different take on the historic record, I'd like to hear it.


For republicans this is revisionist :lol:



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17 Dec 2021, 12:46 am

cyberdad wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
Funny, I thought it was just a matter of recalling how a dominant group - in this case, whites - had used their position in the past to oppress for economic and social reasons those groups - such as blacks - who were not in power. That's called unvarnished and straight forward history.
If you have a different take on the historic record, I'd like to hear it.


For republicans this is revisionist :lol:

revisionist in their view means deviating from comfortable falsehoods whose wool they systematically pull over our eyes.



cyberdad
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17 Dec 2021, 12:53 am

auntblabby wrote:
cyberdad wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
Funny, I thought it was just a matter of recalling how a dominant group - in this case, whites - had used their position in the past to oppress for economic and social reasons those groups - such as blacks - who were not in power. That's called unvarnished and straight forward history.
If you have a different take on the historic record, I'd like to hear it.


For republicans this is revisionist :lol:

revisionist in their view means deviating from comfortable falsehoods whose wool they systematically pull over our eyes.


Conservative white Americans claim not to see race. Except when it doesn't benefit them.



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17 Dec 2021, 1:05 am

cyberdad wrote:
auntblabby wrote:
cyberdad wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
Funny, I thought it was just a matter of recalling how a dominant group - in this case, whites - had used their position in the past to oppress for economic and social reasons those groups - such as blacks - who were not in power. That's called unvarnished and straight forward history.
If you have a different take on the historic record, I'd like to hear it.


For republicans this is revisionist :lol:

revisionist in their view means deviating from comfortable falsehoods whose wool they systematically pull over our eyes.


Conservative white Americans claim not to see race. Except when it doesn't benefit them.

that is just the balderdash they spout to us, but among themselves the truthful feelings come out.



cyberdad
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17 Dec 2021, 1:31 am

auntblabby wrote:
cyberdad wrote:
auntblabby wrote:
cyberdad wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
Funny, I thought it was just a matter of recalling how a dominant group - in this case, whites - had used their position in the past to oppress for economic and social reasons those groups - such as blacks - who were not in power. That's called unvarnished and straight forward history.
If you have a different take on the historic record, I'd like to hear it.


For republicans this is revisionist :lol:

revisionist in their view means deviating from comfortable falsehoods whose wool they systematically pull over our eyes.


Conservative white Americans claim not to see race. Except when it doesn't benefit them.

that is just the balderdash they spout to us, but among themselves the truthful feelings come out.


Yep it seems to be a covert war