Why do people want Trump?

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Kraichgauer
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20 Dec 2021, 4:52 pm

QFT wrote:

Kraichgauer wrote:

QFT wrote:

SabbraCadabra wrote:

QFT wrote:

In fact the whole point of destroying property was to "protest racism", so it wouldn't be logical for White Supremacy groups to do it in that particular occasion.

Racists destroy property at BLM protests, people start saying "Those BLM people sure do like destroying property."

It worked, didn't it?

I actually heard the opposite argument that some of the BLM folk or their allies protested at the Capitol in order to blame Republicans.

It really could have been both ways. Maybe both with summer riots and with Jan 6, *some* people were genuine supporters of respective political party being violent and others were the members of the other party trying to impersonate them to tarnish their name.

In fact I have read that some of the same faces were found in both rallies. Were they truly Republican or truly Democrat? Who knows. Perhaps neither: just some people paid to cause trouble or something?

As far as "umbrella man" its the first time I hear of him. If you say he damaged just a few things and then they all damaged a bunch of stuff after he left, you can't use his actions as an excuse of what they did later. Vandalism is not an appropriate response to vandalism, especially since you say he caused just a little bit of vandalism and then the rest of them did a lot more.

If the destructive DC rioters were actually BLM, how come only Trump supporters were identified and prosecuted for the capitol attack?

I don't follow the news that closely. I am only saying what I briefly read. What I read was that there were some of the same faces in the photographs. I believe they mentioned some funny faced people dressed up funny in the same exact way being in both protests or something. Why didn't they get caught? Well, they didn't catch everyone, clearly. Just a few. There were too many people to catch, wasn't there?

I do watch the news religiously. And I can say without doubt, more and more rioters are getting arrested and convicted. Not a single one were leftists.

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Kraichgauer
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20 Dec 2021, 5:02 pm

QFT wrote:

Kraichgauer wrote:

QFT wrote:

SabbraCadabra wrote:

QFT wrote:

Where did you get the idea that Trump starts wars on the first place.

One could argue that he set the wheels in motion.

That can be argued about other presidents too. Fact remains: the few presidents leading to Trump started wars, Trump hasn't.

SabbraCadabra wrote:

QFT wrote:

If you look at all the property BLM destroyed during summer 2020 and compare it to the property that capitol riot destroyed, you will see BLM destroyed more.

That wasn't BLM, most of the destruction was caused and/or instigated by white supremacy groups who showed up to start trouble.

Its the first time I hear it. Can you elaborate? Because I literally never heard this. I thought it was BLM destroying property.

In fact the whole point of destroying property was to "protest racism", so it wouldn't be logical for White Supremacy groups to do it in that particular occasion.

SabbraCadabra wrote:

QFT wrote:

Your argument is that capitol is somehow more important than businesses. In other words, we are debating which is more important: the sheer amount of property, or whom the property belongs to.

Pretty sure the Capitol is more important.
If a business gets destroyed, they typically use the insurance money to pay for repairs.
If our entire democracy gets destroyed, we're kind of in a bad place.

So did they actually do all the repairs? Has Minneapolis been rebuilt?

They weren't trying to change the system. They were trying to change the outcome of one specific election.

SabbraCadabra wrote:

QFT wrote:

Also you might argue that BLM *did* try to attack democracy. Their intention was to basically blackmail courts to give the cops tougher sentences. Now, if you believe that courts represent democracy (since they were democratically elected), then forcing courts to do something they otherwise won't do would be an attack on democracy.

So you're saying that requesting that cops get the legal punishment they deserve is somehow equivalent to attempting a full-out coup with the intent of kidnapping government officials and giving them public lynchings?

But cops would have gotten legal punishment they deserve even without the protests. The point of protests seem to be to give them tougher punishment than they otherwise would be given. So isn't it also an attach on democracy, to make institutions do something they otherwise won't do?

By the way I am not saying that their punishment is too tough. I mean we are talking about murder and I am not going to say that murder deserves lesser sentence.

What I "am" trying to get to is simple logic. Forget what they want courts to do for a second. Lets just say they want courts to do X. If they think it is necessary to break property in order to force courts to do X, that logically implies an attack on the court system, which is part of democracy.

,

Those cops wouldn't have gotten the punishments they deserved with out the demonstrations. We know that because convictions of police officers for abuse and murder hardly ever happened before the public was made to wake up to it by BLM and Antifa.
Changing the outcome of the last Presidential election would probably have meant the beginning of the end of our free government, leaving the country at the mercy of a popular strongman autocracy.

What you are basically saying is that if it is a "good cause" (such as getting cops punished) then one is allowed to use violence to achieve it, but if it is a "bad cause" (such as changing outcome of the election) then it isn't. But in this case its not really about violence. It is about all those other things. And those other things pretty much make up your mind whether you think violence is acceptable to achieve them or not. Pretty much "the end justifies the means" mentality.

Well, this being the case, together with the fact that the two parties have opposite opinions on those other things, it kinda makes sense why each party views their own violence as more acceptable than the opponent's violence. But I say that both sides being dishonest by acting this way.

When did I ever say such a thing? As a matter of fact, I did attend a BLM demonstration in downtown Spokane, and it was completely orderly and nonviolent. I tend to think most BLM protests are nonviolent, but those don't get media attention. If it bleeds, it leads.
The real difference between BLM and the DC riot is, BLM has a legitimate complaint against the police taking a kneejerk reaction against African Americans just because said cops see them automatically as criminals who they can abuse without fear of repercussions. Very different from the capitol rioters who believe non-whites were taking their place in the chow line, that Jews are the sinister puppet masters keeping conservative whites down, and that only Donald Trump could save them.

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kraftiekortie
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20 Dec 2021, 5:10 pm

It should be remembered that FBI/Fed type investigators tend to be conservative, and very anti-Antifia/BLM. It would have been in their own "best interest" to find BLM folks amongst the insurrectionists at the Capitol.

SabbraCadabra
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20 Dec 2021, 8:16 pm

QFT wrote:

Vandalism is not an appropriate response to vandalism, especially since you say he caused just a little bit of vandalism and then the rest of them did a lot more.

That's how human beings work. Monkey see, monkey do.

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cyberdad
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20 Dec 2021, 8:21 pm

@QFT

The intention of many of the rioters (especially the ones who broke into the building) was to look for members of congress to lynch. Many entered with rope and improvised weapons. This is all on the record so I am not sure why you are cherry picking what you claim was their intent??

The actions of security/police in the building saved lives. Ashli Babbitt was shot dead because she was leading a mob threatening to kill people. Her death is probably the only time the stand your ground gun laws actually worked because the man who shot her was doing his job.

The only unfulfilled actions was that more of them weren't shot dead. Had they been hordes of black Americans the secret service, army and intelligence units would have been sent to the capitol building within minutes to take them all out.

Fixxer
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20 Dec 2021, 10:06 pm

Trump is the epitomy or freedom. Sure, as a Canadian, it was tough seeing that Donald Trump was about the USA being kinda independent, in wanting to be self-suffisent in terms of how if you wanted to deal with the US, on the international level, you had to deal with Donald J. Trump the businessman. Anyway, he is most possibly the only president or political leader of any country to take the lead against the corona plandemic … and the agenda 21 being under progress, all I can say is to listen to that song and hope that we can get to living a decent life, away from the fear propaganda being obsessively brought to us by any electronic devices, little mentions,banners, ads, then goes the censorship.. anyway, be proud of standing up in these tough times.

Kraichgauer
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20 Dec 2021, 10:25 pm

Fixxer wrote:

! !!
Please tell me you're not serious about that!

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Fnord
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21 Dec 2021, 9:15 am

Fixxer wrote:

You might benefit from installing a spelling checker in your web browser.

You might also benefit from ignoring posts by members of the KKK, MAGA, Proud Boys, QAnon, and other deluded conspiracy theorists on Facebook, Twitter, and YouTube.

VegetableMan
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21 Dec 2021, 2:52 pm

Why does anyone want any of the horrible choices were served up every four years? Nothing ever gets better, it's just rearranging the deck chairs on the Titanic.

If you vote for Democrats or Republicans, you have no right to complain.

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Oscar Meyer Lansky

Kraichgauer
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21 Dec 2021, 4:20 pm

VegetableMan wrote:

I think the Build Back Better bill would've been great, had a couple turncoats hadn't have screwed things up.

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VegetableMan
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21 Dec 2021, 5:10 pm

Kraichgauer wrote:

VegetableMan wrote:

I think the Build Back Better bill would've been great, had a couple turncoats hadn't have screwed things up.

You'll have to elaborate on that. I'm not sure what your point is.

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cyberdad
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21 Dec 2021, 5:59 pm

VegetableMan wrote:

Kraichgauer wrote:

VegetableMan wrote:

I think the Build Back Better bill would've been great, had a couple turncoats hadn't have screwed things up.

You'll have to elaborate on that. I'm not sure what your point is.

I think Kraichie is referring to Manchin

VegetableMan
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21 Dec 2021, 7:58 pm

cyberdad wrote:

VegetableMan wrote:

Kraichgauer wrote:

VegetableMan wrote:

I think the Build Back Better bill would've been great, had a couple turncoats hadn't have screwed things up.

You'll have to elaborate on that. I'm not sure what your point is.

I think Kraichie is referring to Manchin

Yeah, alright. Still don't see how it relates to my comment.

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Kraichgauer
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21 Dec 2021, 9:13 pm

VegetableMan wrote:

cyberdad wrote:

VegetableMan wrote:

Kraichgauer wrote:

VegetableMan wrote:

I think the Build Back Better bill would've been great, had a couple turncoats hadn't have screwed things up.

You'll have to elaborate on that. I'm not sure what your point is.

I think Kraichie is referring to Manchin

Yeah, alright. Still don't see how it relates to my comment.

Meaning, BBB wasn't just about moving deck chairs around the Titanic, but could have actually helped people.

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SabbraCadabra
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21 Dec 2021, 9:23 pm

Kraichgauer wrote:

I think the Build Back Better bill would've been great, had a couple turncoats hadn't have screwed things up.

Sources indicate it is still going to pass.

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Kraichgauer
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21 Dec 2021, 11:46 pm

SabbraCadabra wrote:

Kraichgauer wrote:

I think the Build Back Better bill would've been great, had a couple turncoats hadn't have screwed things up.

Sources indicate it is still going to pass.

I certainly hope so. No thanks to that narcissus from West Virginia.

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