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CubsBullsBears
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20 Jun 2022, 12:37 am

Lots of conservatives have been upset about there being a lesbian couple in the new movie “Lightyear”. There are multiple issues I have with that way of thinking:

1. So, I saw Lightyear myself this weekend. The scene with the lesbian couple only lasts about a minute and it is irrelevant to the movie’s main plot.

2. There have been many, many, many scenes of heterosexual kisses and affection in Disney movies dating back many decades. Why is the homosexual equivalent of that so horrible for kids to see?

3. I’m sure there were parents in the 60s and before that said things like “I don’t want my kids to be indoctrinated into thinking that white and black people can be friends” and what not. People from both parties have obviously moved on from that. Now the same thing is happening where conservatives are saying “they’re trying to indoctrinate our kids”. I do agree that certain things are inappropriate for young children to learn, but to make a big deal about an LGBT couple shown in a movie as if Disney has never had love and affection shown in their movies before? C’mon now!

I’ll also add this: there was a scene in the incredibles where syndrome is like “you married elastagirl?” And then looked at Dash and Violet and said “and got BUSY!”. There’s also the scene at the beginning of Finding Dory where Dory says “when mom and dad love each other very much”.

Those things, in movies that are directed at kids, are not as big of a deal as a quick kiss on the lips between 2 men or 2 women, apparently.

No matter what side y’all are on, I’m hoping y’all can at the least understand my point. Thank you all for reading.


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r00tb33r
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20 Jun 2022, 5:54 am

Quote:
There Is No “Gay Agenda” At Disney

Must be closeted, then. :wink: :lol:


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Fnord
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20 Jun 2022, 10:59 am

CubsBullsBears wrote:
There Is No "Gay Agenda" At Disney.
Perhaps . . . but several people I personally know who have worked at Disneyland (just down the road from my house) tell me that many of the costumed cast members in the park are at least sympathetic to LGBTQ+ causes, if not wholly committed.



kraftiekortie
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20 Jun 2022, 11:47 am

I happen to believe that Disney, in general, is very “family-oriented.”

They might have some “progressive” aspects in their ideology…but I doubt very much they are especially “radical.”

I believe they are rather “mainstream,” actually.



Twilightprincess
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20 Jun 2022, 11:51 am

If Disney ever makes a princess movie again, the princess should be a lesbian. It still wouldn’t mean that Disney has a gay agenda. Disney has made so many princess movies that, statistically, at least one of them should be a lesbian - if they are seeking to reflect the general population.



magz
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20 Jun 2022, 11:57 am

CubsBullsBears wrote:
3. I’m sure there were parents in the 60s and before that said things like “I don’t want my kids to be indoctrinated into thinking that white and black people can be friends” and what not. People from both parties have obviously moved on from that. Now the same thing is happening where conservatives are saying “they’re trying to indoctrinate our kids”. I do agree that certain things are inappropriate for young children to learn, but to make a big deal about an LGBT couple shown in a movie as if Disney has never had love and affection shown in their movies before? C’mon now!
I think that's the point.
It's entirely possible to present gay couples on the same level of family-friendliness as heterosexual couples are typically presented.
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BTW, I like it about Moana/Vaiana: it's a Disney princess movie with a friendship instead of romance. Yay! Finally!


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Kerch
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20 Jun 2022, 6:19 pm

IMO they're attempts at being progressive are lackluster and obviously done because they feel like it's come to the point that scoring woke points will score them money points now. I'm not too excited about it.

They never go far enough. It's always lesbians. All this family media doing queer stuff chooses lesbians because that's the safe choice. Even many homophobes don't mind lesbians as much because at least girls kissing is sexy while men kissing is disgusting. But that's what they do, they put a pair of pretty girls kissing for a couple of frames into the background and convince everyone they're being groundbreaking.

It's stupid. I want an animated family film to have 2 ugly old hairy fat gay men as the main characters who love each other and kiss for, like, 10 seconds.
Then it'll be done, the mold will be broken, normalisation will hopefully transpire, nobody will feel the need to top it and we can just get on with our lives instead of making a big deal about being queer when it shouldn't be an issue in the first place.



r00tb33r
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20 Jun 2022, 6:21 pm

^ That.


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Fnord
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20 Jun 2022, 6:43 pm

Kerch wrote:
. . . I want an animated family film to have 2 ugly old hairy fat gay men as the main characters who love each other and kiss for, like, 10 seconds. . .
I kinda remember an Ian McClellan video depicting something like that, but I cannot find it on the Internet.



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21 Jun 2022, 3:22 pm

(sarcasm)

Disney has no business accurately portraying the diversity of people that actually exist in the real world! They should stick to classic, family-friendly themes, like murdering a child because she's prettier than you, or kissing random unconscious minors you find in the woods without consent! Back in my day, cartoons totally never did stuff like bugs bunny kissing elmer fudd on the lips, both in and out of drag!

(/sarcasm)



Fnord
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21 Jun 2022, 4:21 pm

Kerch wrote:
IMO they're attempts at being progressive are lackluster and obviously done because they feel like it's come to the point that scoring woke points will score them money points now. . .
Back in the 60s, there was something called "tokenism", where a movie, stage play, or television program would have one (and usually only one) "negro" person in the otherwise white cast.  This character was allowed to speak a line or two, and then was either forgotten or killed off.

This "token negro" was included so that the show could be considered "integrated" just enough to please people in the the civil rights movement, but not enough to offend people hanging on to the white-dominated status quo.  It was all about ticket sales.


[opinion=mine]

Now Disney is doing the same thing with "token queerfolk" to appease people in the woke movement without offending too many people still hanging on to their dreams of a straight-dominated status quo.  It is still all about ticket sales.

Sad.


[/opinion]



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21 Jun 2022, 6:21 pm

Fnord,

You may be interested to learn about the 'bury your gays' trope as this touches upon what you have mentioned.

https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/ ... ryYourGays

Queerbaiting is when a character is hinted to be LGBT for marketability, but it is never delivered upon. It is a type of tokenism in a sense, where a studio wants praise and viewership for providing representation but doesn't want to risk a decline in fans who would actively turn away because of the character. So, as a solution, they hype up a character, have the character show up for five seconds and then promptly kill them off. Well, not always, sometimes they're in the background standing next to each other and / or kissing in a scene that can easily be cut for release in countries where that won't fly. It's an incredibly lazy form of representation but it's the type that earns the most money. Especially since there's going to be a crowd who complains, which will encourage audiences to go watch the film to see what all the fuss is about, even when it's just a three second glance shared between characters that might suggest an off-screen romance. :roll:

Disney is a bit more relaxed with their shows. They have shows where a main character isn't straight, but such shows tend to be short-lived. I know there was a little bit of controversy with The Owl House being cut short, however the network claims that the decision was based on a move away from serialised stories and towards more episodic adventures, rather than a decision based on the LGBT content. Episodic cartoons tend to do better in re-runs.

It is somewhat amusing to me to know that censors around the world changed a romantic scene into an overly dramatic "Will you dress up and travel with me?" despite heavy blushing, awkward laughter and tears. So now it looks like they're both bizarrely emotional over planning a day out together.


Films such as Isn't it romantic? and G.B.F. (Gay Best Friend) poke fun at tokenisation of gay characters. Of course, there is plenty of good representation out there...but you're not going to find it in a Disney movie. We do seem to be constantly repeating "Disney introduces its first gay character!" (it's done that already) "The character appears for a second and then leaves!" Wow, ground-breaking, same time next year then?


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Fnord
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21 Jun 2022, 6:54 pm

That TVTropes article is spot on!

“Bury the <other>” would be even more accurate, since it encompasses just about every identity that is not straight, white, American, or male.

On the flip side, there is the “<other>sploitation” film, wherein gratuitous nudity, sexual situations, and/or violence centered on LGBTQ+, POC, foreign, or female characters (porn seems to thrive on this).

The “Blacksploitation” films of the 1980s are examples of this (“Blackula”, “Coffee”, et cetera).



roronoa79
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21 Jun 2022, 9:08 pm

Disney has dared to decide that the Right does not have a monopoly on deciding what is family-friendly.

Denying the existence of queers isn't very family-friendly to families with queer parents or queer children. What makes conservatives think their conceptions of family are so morally superior? Christian supremacy--that's what.


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21 Jun 2022, 9:14 pm

People these days can't just sit and watch movies without getting offended by something.


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21 Jun 2022, 10:04 pm

Joe90 wrote:
People these days can't just sit and watch movies without getting offended by something.


Has there ever been a time when people were open-minded/accepting enough not to get offended by LGBT stuff in movies?

I’d imagine people would’ve been even dumber about this in the 60’s -90’s.