War in Ukraine: both sides are wrong

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I picked the US picking on the UK precisely because of the absurdity of the whole thing. However, Russians aren't wrong if they claim Oleg and Kievan Rus as their cultural heritage. Putin has mentioned a religious motivation for absorbing Ukraine as a propaganda device--but, again, Putin isn't exactly wrong about the facts here. I think he's lying about his true intentions. Still, Russia does have a religious and cultural interest in Ukraine from the point of view that the Russian people do have historical ties to Ukraine. The United States could just as easily justify annexing the UK by saying that the successes of the republic justify rescuing the British from the Crown. Given the strength and resolve of the British, invading the UK would probably work out just as well as Russia invading Ukraine...

...except...

NATO. The collective strength of NATO in Europe would challenge US military supremacy, hence deterring the US from doing something like that. Similarly, a unilateral invasion of the US wouldn't go over so well since, like Russia, we also possess a strong nuclear deterrent. Any nation outside NATO would prefer that the US not even have reason to suspect any citizen even THINK bad thoughts about the US lest they become another Iraq or Afghanistan.

Yes, the Soviet Union was a great contributor in defeating the Nazis----both directly and indirectly. They were heroic in Stalingrad---that was the turning point of the war.

I never said they weren't a "great contributor."

But you can't deny that the US played a paramount role in defeating the Nazis.

Yes, the Soviet Union was a great contributor in defeating the Nazis----both directly and indirectly. They were heroic in Stalingrad---that was the turning point of the war.

I never said they weren't a "great contributor."

But you can't deny that the US played a paramount role in defeating the Nazis.

USA gave all the weapons, equipment and money to Russia in order to defeat the nazis

Although not necessarily related to Putin and The Russian Federation, historical Russia has a very bad history of genocide/massacre.

In 1784, the massacre of Koniag Alutiiq.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Awa%27uq_Massacre


In 1900, the massacre of Chinese, including Manchu, Daur and Han.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1900_Amur_anti-Chinese_pogroms

There have also been mass expulsions of Chinese before.

In 1916, the massacre of the Turkic residents of Central Asia.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Central_Asian_revolt_of_1916


The above are just three of the quickest examples I can find.
I am not sure about the official attitude of the Russian Federation to these events.

^ None of the above was Middle Ages.
But if you want something from earlier Russian record, here you are:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Massacre_of_Novgorod
That was something even for these times.
Later record?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holodomor
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Katyn_massacre
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Great_Purge
Still in living memory is some places.

I can't say one way or the other anything about that, I don't know middle age history very well. But lots of countries were doing lots of stuff back in middle ages. I don't think its fair to punish them in the 21-st century for that.

The latter two, as well as the examples magz provides, are around WW1 and WW2.
Namely, modern history. Punishment is one thing. But it's another matter to never compensate or even apologize for it.

Still, Putin isn't Lenin or Stalin. Lots have changed.

The West appeased Putin in 2014, just like the West appeased Hitler in 1938.

Hitler offered the excuse that Germans were being oppressed; Putin offers the excuse that Russians are being oppressed.

I certainly don't believe Putin would kills millions of Jews and Slavs and put them in concentration camps. But he is doing similar things, though with less deaths (doesn't lessen the impact, though)

"That person" has changed.
But if you are not against those executors, even when claiming to take their "legacy".
It's not very convincing that you're also against what they've done.

I am against 1937 purge and holodomor. I never said that I wasn't. The only reason I didn't mention it before is that it wasn't a topic of this thread.

So I guess my take on it is that both Putin and Hitler should be given a chance to take back what they lost and stop there.