Will Europe be predominantly muslim by the next century?

Page 1 of 3 [ 44 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2, 3  Next

BlossX
Toucan
Toucan

Joined: 24 May 2019
Age: 23
Gender: Non-binary
Posts: 272

15 May 2022, 8:26 am

As title says, forecasts give muslim as main religion by 2050. (title is not correct, I meant 2050) I will find source soon and attach it.

What are your thoughts? are you worried by that? or you get along with muslims/you are muslim.

I, personally, being christian (by birth) am quite worried as our identity will not be clear anymore but that is only my personal, useless, opinion.

What are your opinions?



Twilightprincess
Veteran
Veteran

Joined: 28 Sep 2016
Age: 38
Gender: Female
Posts: 8,008

15 May 2022, 8:30 am

I’m fine with the people, but I don’t care for their religion or holy book too much. I don’t care for the Jewish or Christian holy books and religions, either, so….

I’m fine with abrahamic religions as long as they aren’t extreme versions.


_________________
“I don’t know half of you half as well as I should like; and I like less than half of you half as well as you deserve.” Lord of the Rings


BlossX
Toucan
Toucan

Joined: 24 May 2019
Age: 23
Gender: Non-binary
Posts: 272

15 May 2022, 8:35 am

I am worried mainly not because of religion, but because I see a big gap between my culture and theirs.

They seems (mostly, from what I know) to create and keep their ethnic groups and not integrate too much into the country they go to reside. (In italy, we have many africans who come, but they stay in their small african groups and don't want to learn the italian language)

Source: I live in a small city of 34000 thousand people and I work as volunteer to help them find a job (Refugees mainly) we are struggling a lot with the linguistic barrier (I speak fluent english, but they don't want to learn italian) at least most of them

This is why I am worried. There will be no clear identity and clear ideas about my country future. I am quite worried by all that, it will be a multi-ethnical country where everyone mind his own business and clashes will arise maybe? Like in America where some neighbourhoods are so dangerous you can't go there?

I suggest everyone to read "The clash of civilizations and the remaking of world order" by Huntington. such an enlightening book.



kraftiekortie
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 4 Feb 2014
Gender: Male
Posts: 84,152
Location: Queens, NYC

15 May 2022, 8:36 am

No. I doubt that Europe will be predominantly Muslim ever.



Twilightprincess
Veteran
Veteran

Joined: 28 Sep 2016
Age: 38
Gender: Female
Posts: 8,008

15 May 2022, 8:37 am

I wouldn’t worry too much about it. It’s impossible to say what the world will be like in 2050.


_________________
“I don’t know half of you half as well as I should like; and I like less than half of you half as well as you deserve.” Lord of the Rings


BlossX
Toucan
Toucan

Joined: 24 May 2019
Age: 23
Gender: Non-binary
Posts: 272

15 May 2022, 8:39 am

Well, I do worry since I am 23 and at that period I will be 53.

I want to get involved into politics to help my country become a better place, so I am gathering your ideas to help me shape my own idea.



kraftiekortie
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 4 Feb 2014
Gender: Male
Posts: 84,152
Location: Queens, NYC

15 May 2022, 8:42 am

Many of the Muslims there probably will be assimilated into the greater culture, become more secular, and be less fanatical about their Islam.

If you had Islamic political parties becoming influential, then I might worry.



kraftiekortie
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 4 Feb 2014
Gender: Male
Posts: 84,152
Location: Queens, NYC

15 May 2022, 8:53 am

They might not want to learn Italian—but their kids will certainly want to learn Italian.

This sort of thing has been happening within immigration since at least the 19th century. The children of immigrants in the US, for example, are often more “American” than people who have been American for generations.

It’s very difficult to live in Italy without knowing Italian. They will use their kids as translators, and the kids will be proud to be Italian. That’s the usual immigrant experience.



naturalplastic
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 26 Aug 2010
Age: 67
Gender: Male
Posts: 29,540
Location: temperate zone

15 May 2022, 9:06 am

Only 27 years from now?

I doubt it.

Farther down the road, maybe, but hard to say.

Ten and 12 years ago sensationalist books were written with that thesis. Pat Buchanan is still flogging the issue. The
idea is that the native born population of the continent has a low birth rate, and gets a lot of immigrants from nonwhite countries with high birthrates, including Muslim countries. So its trending toward a Muslim majority.

There is a lot of immigration from Muslim countries into Europe, but there are a lot of refugees from the Middle East who are non Muslims fleeing Muslim persecution (Christians, Druze, Zorastrians, etc). And Europe is getting a flood of desperate migrants from subsaharan Black Africa who mostly not Muslim. Britain get migrants from it former colonies in South Asia. But these are both Muslims from Pakistan, and Indians (who can be Muslim or Hindu). So Europe maybe turning brown, but it may not turn Muslim.



kraftiekortie
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 4 Feb 2014
Gender: Male
Posts: 84,152
Location: Queens, NYC

15 May 2022, 9:09 am

The US has been having a major influx of people from Hispanic countries for decades.

Have we become a majority Hispanic country? Not by a long shot. Especially overtly in a cultural sense. Many people of Hispanic origin assimilate.

New York City has a considerable Hispanic population. I certainly wouldn’t call it a Hispanic city in general. Maybe in certain areas…but certainty not the city as a whole.



Last edited by kraftiekortie on 15 May 2022, 9:12 am, edited 2 times in total.

shlaifu
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 26 May 2014
Age: 38
Gender: Male
Posts: 2,616

15 May 2022, 9:09 am

BlossX wrote:
Well, I do worry since I am 23 and at that period I will be 53.

I want to get involved into politics to help my country become a better place, so I am gathering your ideas to help me shape my own idea.


When I was 6, the soviet union collapsed, and no body saw it coming. People thought capitalism had won.
When I was 17, 9/11 happened. I couldn't have imagined the islamophobia and the surveillance laws following that. When I was 25, lehmann brothers collapsed and I couldn't imagine the austerity, the stock market surging through buybacks rather than investment, property prices tripling, and a wave of new right wing populism.
Now I'm 38, and I couldn't imagine we would still be arguing about climate change, build coal and gas power plants, while the richest people in the world talk about creating a virtual reality where they can own absolutely everything.

It is very hard to predict the future and to react in a way that benefits the mass of people, but my guess is that working towards better integration of immigrants is smarter than risking a new nationalist anti-immigrant movement based on what might happen according to some guy's forecast.

Until 2050, there will statistically be three major financial crises, a regime collapse no one thought possible, and the rise of global temperature by 1 degree, droughts, civil wars, and no one can foresee the chaos that will produce.


_________________
I can read facial expressions. I did the test.


kraftiekortie
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 4 Feb 2014
Gender: Male
Posts: 84,152
Location: Queens, NYC

15 May 2022, 9:43 am

Encourage the immigrants to assimilate…but don’t insult their mother culture.



BlossX
Toucan
Toucan

Joined: 24 May 2019
Age: 23
Gender: Non-binary
Posts: 272

15 May 2022, 10:02 am

kraftiekortie wrote:
They might not want to learn Italian—but their kids will certainly want to learn Italian.

This sort of thing has been happening within immigration since at least the 19th century. The children of immigrants in the US, for example, are often more “American” than people who have been American for generations.

It’s very difficult to live in Italy without knowing Italian. They will use their kids as translators, and the kids will be proud to be Italian. That’s the usual immigrant experience.


Yes, this is what actually happens. Their kids do speak better italian than the parents and they act as translator when they go to the post-office, to the bank, etc..!



temp1234
Veteran
Veteran

Joined: 9 Apr 2022
Gender: Male
Posts: 927

15 May 2022, 11:16 am

One of the things that are worrying is that Islam is not very tolerant of other religions. What I mean by that is that in some of the Muslim countries, if you try to spread a different religion, you could be arrested. It may be rather the government/people than the religion itself that is intolerant. I've met some Muslim people who said that they have the right to practice and spread their religion in western countries, while in their countries they have the right to restrict foreigners from practicing or spreading other religions. Also, in some Muslim countries if you try to convert to a different religion, you could be executed, hence have to try to leave the family and country. I could say that Islam is a religion that you cannot get out of once you are in, at least in some countries.

However, the children of the immigrants to western countries from Muslim countries value the freedom in western countries and it's hard to imagine they could be so intolerant as in Muslim countries. While they respect their parents and practice Islam, they usually don't have that intolerant attitude. I hope they stay that way. So, probably the number of Muslims in Europe will increase because there are always refugees and most Muslims won't convert or quit. However, if the number increases to the point where they are the majority, things could get a bit scary. I doubt that it'll be as soon as 2050, though.



Tim_Tex
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 2 Jul 2004
Age: 42
Gender: Male
Posts: 43,873
Location: Abbottistan

15 May 2022, 12:30 pm

I don't see it happening. Europe is becoming less religious by the day.

Incidentally, Turkey (though only partially in Europe) was the first to be fully secular, in the 1920s.



kraftiekortie
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 4 Feb 2014
Gender: Male
Posts: 84,152
Location: Queens, NYC

15 May 2022, 1:43 pm

Without immigrants, we wouldn’t have a United States, for all intents and purposes.