Mega Quake in Turkey signals the end of time

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God is more like a Greek god than I thought.

David and Jonathan were hot for each other.



In Elton John's famous opinion

https://parade.com/40380/dotsonrader/el ... exclusive/



At the time of Jesus' arrest



An incriminating verse if there ever was one.

According to the Secret Gospel of Mark

http://gnosis.org/library/secm.htm



Moreover, in the Gospel of Thomas

https://www.marquette.edu/maqom/Gospel% ... ambdin.pdf



So, it seemeth most likely that Jesus indeed was a compassionate gay man. I perceive no other explanation.

I don’t recognize gnostic texts as Biblical canon.

If you have to rely on spurious sources as evidence to make your point, there’s little point to trying to discuss it. The one piece of authentic evidence you DID cite left out a lot of context.

I would say you are of the school of just flat hating Christians and everything to do with Christianity. Fine.

But I do see the synoptic gospels and John as painting Jesus as a merciful, loving, and compassionate person. And that’s the whole point. Mercy above Law as symbolized in the Holy of Holies. I think a lot of Christians get hung up on the Old Testament rules to the level they forget that gay people are PEOPLE.

Also, I think homosexuality in the Bible as sinful behavior gets way more attention that it deserves. There’s this sort of steady drumbeat about how the Bible says it’s a sin that it creates the illusion that Christians don’t think anything else is a sin. Adultery (extramarital sex, to be specific) is a sin that carried the death sentence. Fornication (between unmarrieds) was a sin but was simply “frowned upon.” If a bride was found not to be a virgin and the husband was aware, he wasn’t allowed to divorce her or have her put to death. And divorce was an option in Biblical times. It wasn’t seen as the failing many conservative Christians see it as. The prohibition of divorce allows for infidelity as a justification, but elsewhere emphasizes the importance of keeping promises and preserving a natural order of one person for one person for life. And there’s no shortage of OT rules that outline proper married relationships for widows/widowers.

My problem with divorce isn’t so much that Jesus somehow declared it this horrible ugly thing we must avoid at all costs, but rather divorce is always a permanent solution to a temporary problem. Our relationship failures have nothing to do with the person we’re with. It has everything to do with what we bring to the relationship individually. In my own experience…yes, she was a toxic lunatic that I needed to escape. But it’s not like I wasn’t dealing with my own codependent tendencies along with abysmal self-esteem issues. Once I began to see myself as being worthy of better, I began holding my romantic partners to a much higher standard. Things didn’t always work out. But it was much better to fail fast than to drag things out potentially for decades. After I broke up with my fiancée, I was in a few relationships that were more or less good, and maybe there were one or two situations that were…well, let’s just say not AS GOOD as I could have hoped for. But in the end I’ve only been married ONCE, have 4 children, and it’s a very healthy and stable partnership.

So I think the whole idea of divorce being this great sin is a complex one. First, keep your promises. If you promise a lifetime, give a lifetime. No matter what. If you can’t do that, don’t get married. If you think things are headed in the wrong direction, get out before you take your vows. And I would take that further to say if something happened and my wife and I had to separate, I would never want to be with anyone else. If she went crazy, I’d have her locked up, but I’d still see her every chance I got. If she threatened to kill me or hurt our children, I’d do what’s necessary to keep everyone alive, but I’d never look for anyone else. If she was unfaithful to the point I could no longer stay with her, I might file for divorce. But I’d never be with anyone else. Has nothing to do with religion, just that I love her that much.

And I think when it comes to those “great sins” such as sexual sins or divorce, it’s really the love we as Christians have for each other that should remain in view. OT says homosexuality is a sin, right? Ok, but what does that have to do with Christians being called to mercy and compassion? It doesn’t mean we have to accept it as morally acceptable, but maybe we COULD try to understand that none of us exactly have that much control over how we feel. It’s possible to be attracted to someone without wanting to feel attraction for them. It’s easy to point fingers at a divorced woman and draw all sorts of conclusions about her when in reality her husband is a violent drug addict who abuses her and their children. It’s easy to point fingers at all sorts of people when we all have our own moral failings are grateful others didn’t cast the first stone when they easily could have.

Why not? Your canonical texts leave out a lot of details. The Gnostic texts can give us some ideas as to who Jesus was. Just because they aren't "Biblical canon" doesn't mean that they are automatically wrong.



The Mark 14 bit? The part about the naked young man seems to come out of the blue. Not much context there to begin with. If Mark had wanted to paint Jesus as a heterosexual, then he could have left that detail out. No harm in pointing fingers.



Getting defensive now, are we? Just because I see some validity to the argument that Jesus was gay doesn't necessarily mean that I "just flat hate Christians and everything to do with Christianity." I'm sure that some Christians are perfectly good people.



Now you're sounding like Elton John.



The Old Testament rules are strictly for the Jews to hit themselves over the head with. Any Jew will tell you that. Haifa, in Israel, is one of the most gay-friendly cities on Earth.

https://www.gayout.com/haifa-gay-events-hotspots



Some Christians do like to fixate on homosexuality, for whatever reason. Pete Buttigieg is a Christian, isn't he?



Jesus let off a woman who was caught in adultery.



Actually, it only counted as "adultery" if the woman was married.



That was only if she had been a virgin and he had raped her. Then, he had to marry her and he was never allowed to divorce her.



For Jews. And, it was entirely at the husband's discretion.



Conservative Christians seem to regard Mr. Trump's multiple divorces as perfectly acceptable.



You may be right, but I can't think of any.



You and Jesus are allowed to have different opinions.



Congratulations!



Leviticus prescribes a death penalty. But, only for male homosexuals. Lesbians get a pass. Also, there isn't any record in the Bible of anyone actually executed for homosexuality. Picking up sticks on the Sabbath carried a death penalty, and there was a poor fellow who was executed for that. But, nobody for homosexuality. Also, people criticized Jesus for violating the Sabbath laws. He violated a law for which someone had actually been executed. Homosexuality would be trivial by comparison.



But, it gives us such a sense of superiority.

By the by, if you wish your Jesus to be a heterosexual who kissed girls, there is the Gospel of Philip

http://gnosis.org/naghamm/gop.html

^ Judas kissed Jesus, and you do not have to look in a disreputable "gospel" for that.

How did you all get from talking about that tragic quake in the news in Turkey...to...the topic of homosexuality?????


Thats like talking about "Bigfoot, and antisemitism".

That’s WrongPlanet for you!

Scandalous!

Men kissed other men all the time in Biblical days.

My father, a heterosexual, used to kiss me and call me “darling.”

I think Jesus and his apostles had a polyamorous relationship. Jesus especially liked hanging out with his groupies. Good for them! [insert pride flag]

For the modern homophobic American Christian audience, that bit will probably be excised with the next translation. Just like the way the bit about abortion in Numbers 5 gets bowdlerized. They'll have Jesus and Judas shaking hands.

I can only take partial credit for it going in that direction by mentioning Biblical prophecy. But only PARTIAL credit.

I've done what I can to steer the topic away from a sensitive topic since the mere hint of homosexuality being sinful is a ban-able offense around here. Everything else beyond that is just bizarre, and I'm not going anywhere near it. What is it about expressing Christian views and NOT being hateful that inspires some to take up their torches and pitchforks against us? Weird.

Think you answered your own question here. We know what you think about LGBT people (and you even hint at it here), so it's a little disingenuous for you to claim surprise at this reaction.

^ this. I can't see anything biblical without expressing disdain because, no matter what it is, (Thank God he survived!, Praise be!, etc) I know the person saying that would either hate me or they aren't consistent with their beliefs.

Basically Angel is saying that God is punishing the US for allowing same sex marriage by...inflicting an earthquake...on another country...a country that doesnt allow same sex marriage (and where folks are already too busy dodging bombs to think about the issue anyway).

Makes sense to me!